Back In Black & 5150

**Dave's Dreidel** · 02.06.23, 05:50 PM

Depends upon how you count sales.

If memory serves, as of late 2020, 5150 was at 8.7M sales, that is actual units moved. If you count the "new" version of sales, which is every 1,500 streams from an album, no matter which song, counts as one album sale, I believe 5150 just ticked over the 10M mark.

I also remember reading that using the same way of counting sales, 1984 would be over 25M, which makes sense, as three of the most played songs in their catalog are on that album, and Jump just conquers all when it comes to streaming plays I bet. If a casual fan has VH in their streaming playlist, good chance it is Jump.

**fudd** · 02.06.23, 05:54 PM

Originally Posted by Little Dreamer

Trick of The Tail, by Genesis. 1st record with Phil as lead singer

That’s a horrible album.

My god, your record collection must be just weird. You have any Bread and Seals and Croft? Maybe some Babs?

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**fudd** · 02.06.23, 05:57 PM

Originally Posted by Little Dreamer

Also worth noting that BIB was produced by Mutt Lange. 5150 by Mick Jones of Foreigner. I think Mutt Lange is much better producer, and BIB benefited from that.

Mick jones was only there because Mo Ostin made VH have a producer. His input was minimal.

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**Dave's Dreidel** · 02.06.23, 06:01 PM

Originally Posted by fudd

Mick jones was only there because Mo Ostin made VH have a producer. His input was minimal.

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This is just my theory, no proof to back it up, but here goes.

I think for the most part the lyrics on 5150 are some of the best in Sam's career, and I think having Mick Jones helped Sam immensely to have such a great songwriter there to bounce ideas off of. Pure speculation.

**I Coulda Hada VH** · 02.06.23, 08:26 PM

The best songs from BIB, HAH and 5150 ...

**Little Dreamer** · 02.06.23, 09:23 PM

Originally Posted by Dave's Dreidel

This is just my theory, no proof to back it up, but here goes.

I think for the most part the lyrics on 5150 are some of the best in Sam's career, and I think having Mick Jones helped Sam immensely to have such a great songwriter there to bounce ideas off of. Pure speculation.

I think the story of Mick Jones having "no input" is a charade invented by Eddie (one more). Mick Jones himself has disputed this, asserting he had as much input as a normal producer.
What has transpired many years later is that VH wanted Ted to produce, which made sense. But Ted said no. Ed was hurt. He then wanted the band to produce themselves. Warner said no. They had to get Mick Jones. Which was their 3rd choice at best. So he was double hurt.
In order to not make public what he felt was a series of humiliating setbacks, he invented the story of "yes Mick Jones' name is on the record, but he did nothing, so it's JUST LIKE we produced it ourselves, like we wanted."

History showed later that producing their own record was never one of Van Halen's skills. So it was certainly better to have Mick Jones than to have no one. Mick might even have learned a few things from Mutt Lange from working with him on Foreigner 4.

**Heisenberg** · 02.07.23, 12:54 AM

VH's Women and Children First album cover artwork was initially considered to be black.

One of the big VH Memorabilia collectors bought the batch of mock-up printing artwork laminates from Noel Monk several years ago.

It looked pretty damn cool black. I don't know why they switched it to green.

Initially I thought I remembered commentary about it stating the reason they switched to green from black had to do with the new AC/DC Back In Black album cover & VH didn't want to have their album with a similar black cover. But I went back & couldn't find the commentary so not sure. Probably a coincidence.

**Raldo** · 02.07.23, 01:53 AM

Originally Posted by Heisenberg

VH's Women and Children First album cover artwork was initially considered to be black.

One of the big VH Memorabilia collectors bought the batch of mock-up printing artwork laminates from Noel Monk several years ago.

It looked pretty damn cool black. I don't know why they switched it to green.

Initially I thought I remembered commentary about it stating the reason they switched to green from black had to do with the new AC/DC Back In Black album cover & VH didn't want to have their album with a similar black cover. But I went back & couldn't find the commentary so not sure. Probably a coincidence.

Hadn’t heard that story before. Still a cool cover.

**marcin** · 02.07.23, 04:23 AM

These three off the top of my head...

**Simon Ribeiro** · 02.07.23, 04:42 AM

Originally Posted by Cole_5150

Flick of the switch fly on the wall?

I like them both. But Flick is damn fine to my ears. It's like Powerage, but with Brian Johnson. And the band produced both records.

You can hear Phil Rudd (on FOTS) hitting those Paiste Rude like there was no tomorrow for him, which was true.

**Simon Ribeiro** · 02.07.23, 04:48 AM

Originally Posted by fudd

That’s a horrible album.

My god, your record collection must be just weird. You have any Bread and Seals and Croft? Maybe some Babs?

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Really? My God!!!

I love Trick of the Tail - it has Dance on a Volcano, Squonk, Robbery, Ripples, Los Endos, Entangled. Killer tracks, IMHO.

**Al Van Bundy** · 02.07.23, 05:26 AM

How do you find out record sales after the last RIAA certification?

**DFVH5150** · 02.07.23, 05:32 AM

Originally Posted by Heisenberg

VH's Women and Children First album cover artwork was initially considered to be black.

One of the big VH Memorabilia collectors bought the batch of mock-up printing artwork laminates from Noel Monk several years ago.

It looked pretty damn cool black. I don't know why they switched it to green.

Initially I thought I remembered commentary about it stating the reason they switched to green from black had to do with the new AC/DC Back In Black album cover & VH didn't want to have their album with a similar black cover. But I went back & couldn't find the commentary so not sure. Probably a coincidence.

Wow, never heard that about the black.

I'm sure they used dark green as a military motif. They were doing a lot of that in '80.

**DFVH5150** · 02.07.23, 05:34 AM

Originally Posted by Simon Ribeiro

Really? My God!!!

I love Trick of the Tail - it has Dance on a Volcano, Squonk, Robbery, Ripples, Los Endos, Entangled. Killer tracks, IMHO.

According to the Van Halen Encyclopedia, Alex played "Los Endos" on the OU812 tour in Richmond, VA. And, they jammed to "Keep It Dark" in Montevideo in '83 during the the SGMAD jam.

**Simon Ribeiro** · 02.07.23, 06:16 AM

Originally Posted by DFVH5150

According to the Van Halen Encyclopedia, Alex played "Los Endos" on the OU812 tour in Richmond, VA. And, they jammed to "Keep It Dark" in Montevideo in '83 during the the SGMAD jam.

Nice!! Edward was a big fan of Genesis - both AVH and EVH had a band called Genesis when they were young and High School students.