VH Tunings Different on Nearly Every Song on First Six Albums

[kydtsoos]

Has anyone else tried playing guitar along with Eddie to the first six albums, song by song? If you have, you probably noticed something hilarious about how each song, although tuned down a half step of standard, is not tuned to the same standard pitch. So if you play along you have to constantly tune up or down to each song to be in tune. It's funny because that problem is so consistent that it seems planned that way. I can't help but wonder why it is that way and how they tuned in the studio. Or maybe it's merely from adjusted original tape speed for album timing/space purposes.

[garbeaj]

It’s always a good idea to check the “Sticky” threads on this forum before you post a question...you’ll probably find a lot of answers there.

Be sure to check out my thread covering the tunings: https://www.vhlinks.com/vbforums/thr...uner-reference

[turnbuckle]

Has anyone else tried playing guitar along with Eddie to the first six albums, song by song? If you have, you probably noticed something hilarious about how each song, although tuned down a half step of standard, is not tuned to the same standard pitch. So if you play along you have to constantly tune up or down to each song to be in tune. It's funny because that problem is so consistent that it seems planned that way. I can't help but wonder why it is that way and how they tuned in the studio. Or maybe it's merely from adjusted original tape speed for album timing/space purposes.

Inorite!
Of all the six pack songs, only a few here and there are the same.
A long time ago, Edward revealed that when they were in the studio, he would just pick up his guitar, and whatever it was tuned at, he would have MA tune to him, and then roll the tape.
I don't think there was any rhyme or reason to it, just laziness I guess.

However, I am certain that Edward's personal tuning temperaments/deviations, were indeed created by his ear, and a lot of trial and error.

Side Note- In their clubbing days, they would often tune a full step lower, but MA felt it was too floppy for his bass strings

[Brett]

I don’t know how much of that I believe that Ed just tuned to whatever. I think it’s bullshit honestly. I think Ed liked to portray himself as an enigma and saying he didn’t bother tuning properly added to that aura of reckless abandon. But he always seemed to have a tuner around and it takes all of five seconds to tune a guitar. Especially with a good ear like he has. Plus if you’re not tuning accurately, it’ll affect vocals and harmonies on recordings. So I don’t buy any of that “I tuned to whatever” bs. A good producer like Ted Templeman wouldn’t allow that. He just wouldn’t. Now when it comes to the little cent changes on each string, yeah I think he had some ideas and played around with that by ear for the most part.

[Dave's Dreidel]

Also, I would think once they started adding keyboards to the mix, the guitarist couldn't just randomly tune to whatever he felt.

And as you said, talk about giving your vocalist nightmares.

[MF5150]

I don’t know how much of that I believe that Ed just tuned to whatever. I think it’s bullshit honestly. I think Ed liked to portray himself as an enigma and saying he didn’t bother tuning properly added to that aura of reckless abandon. But he always seemed to have a tuner around and it takes all of five seconds to tune a guitar. Especially with a good ear like he has. Plus if you’re not tuning accurately, it’ll affect vocals and harmonies on recordings. So I don’t buy any of that “I tuned to whatever” bs. A good producer like Ted Templeman wouldn’t allow that. He just wouldn’t.

This.

[bsbll4]

I've played along to the 6 pack songs tuned down a half step and never really noticed. But then again, I suck, so I probably would just chalk it up to me not being very good at playing the song to begin with.

[MF5150]

I've played along to the 6 pack songs tuned down a half step and never really noticed. But then again, I suck, so I probably would just chalk it up to me not being very good at playing the song to begin with.

Very, very few would notice. Has nothing to do with sucking or not sucking.

[bsbll4]

It makes me think of that Brettify guy that put those Youtube videos up a couple of years ago of him playing terribly (and not on purpose) to different songs. He wasn't even in tune most of the time. Everyone watching was like "oh my god how does he not hear that?!" I have a feeling that's what people would hear if I recorded something, although hopefully not to the same degree!

[Brett]

Brettify is still on YouTube and makes a ton of videos and he still can’t play or tune. You would think after the hundreds and hundreds of videos he’s put up that he would figure it out but he still hasn’t. And nobody really tells him because it’s just not worth it. I told him once I think and he went crazy so it’s not worth the time. He’s also put up a lot of drumming videos and actually he’s horrible at that too.

I don’t actually think I have that great of an ear for tuning stuff even after all these years. When I play along to the six pack I don’t notice if things aren’t quite 1/2 step down or not. I guess I don’t play along with the albums that often so I don’t really notice. Actually come to think of it I don’t think I ever do. When I record covers I just play along to the backing track.

[Dave's Dreidel]

I can tell when things are out of tune (everyone can I think), but I can't fix it on the fly or tune by ear. I'm a slave to technology in this regard.

[Brett]

I can tune by ear but I can’t necessarily tell if the note that I’m basing it on is in perfect pitch. I can do what Ed said he did, but frankly what’s the point. Just use a fucking tuner. I don’t know of any situation where I wouldn’t just use a tuner and do it correctly. Even if you’re playing live you have your tuner sitting right there on your board most likely. There’s very little reason to tune by ear anymore.

And I really doubt that Ted Templeman said “yeah no problem Ed, whatever tuning you’re in is good enough.” Like I said I think Ed just said that as part of his mystique.

[iplayguitaralot]

Just buy a strobo plus and tune/intontate to their sweetened tunings and you are much better off then most people. It’s an upwards battle to keep one tuned if you don’t know how to set it up to how you play. Edwards guitar tech had a pretty good explanation about if you play hard you can tune it to string strike rather than waiting for it to settle, and doing a tempered tuning like a piano. Garb found most of the tunings he liked, being that he tuned often to some of those offsets I imagine he had it planned.

[turnbuckle]

I found the April '80 Guitar Player interview, and just quoting Edward here, for whatever that's worth;

How do you tune up before a show?

"I tune all my guitars myself. We tune a quarter step down, so it's like right between E and Eb, this is for vocal reasons.
I used to tune down to D, but Mike couldn't get his bass tone-he'd get too much slap.
When we go in the studio, man, I don't strobe tune or anything. I just pick the guitar up and if it's in tune, I say, 'Mike, tune to me,' and we play.
Why does it have to be the same? Who says it has to be tuned to E? Why the rules? Fuck the rules!
I mean the main reason I get all the weird stuff I do on guitar is because I don't do it by the rules."

[garbeaj]

I found the April '80 Guitar Player interview, and just quoting Edward here, for whatever that's worth;

How do you tune up before a show?

"I tune all my guitars myself. We tune a quarter step down, so it's like right between E and Eb, this is for vocal reasons.
I used to tune down to D, but Mike couldn't get his bass tone-he'd get too much slap.
When we go in the studio, man, I don't strobe tune or anything. I just pick the guitar up and if it's in tune, I say, 'Mike, tune to me,' and we play.
Why does it have to be the same? Who says it has to be tuned to E? Why the rules? Fuck the rules!
I mean the main reason I get all the weird stuff I do on guitar is because I don't do it by the rules."

Yet I’ve proven that the tuning was no accident and the many pictures of Eddie’s tuning roadcase and his tech’s benches prove that he used Peterson strobe tuners. He means that he uses specific tuning offsets that he arrived at using his ear and/or his Peterson strobe tuners. When he is just playing and practicing, he tunes by ear...There is footage of him doing this by ear in the “5150 Vault” video, but again this is in rehearsal and not during a recording session or live show.

The “rules” say you have to tune to the exact chromatic pitch on each string, but I have clearly and irrefutably shown that Eddie created his own tuning offsets and used many of the same tuning offsets on different songs on the same album and even the same tuning offsets that appear on an album made in 1977 also appear on another album in 1981. This proves that these tunings were not accidents.

He used tuning offsets that he arrived at using his ears and Peterson tuners which he has been using since at least 1978 and possibly earlier than that. All of this is covered in my thread covering Eddie’s many tuning offsets. This isn’t even controversial anymore since the live tuning offsets that he used on the last tours were revealed in Guitar World, again as I have mentioned in the sticky tuning thread.

Lonnie Totman and Tom Weber have confirmed that Eddie used tuning offsets. Don’t take my word for it. Look through the tuning thread and there should be no mystery to it. They exist on the records and I have found and notated them and I’ll continue to post them as I find them. Before too long I’ll have the exact tuning offsets on every song from every album from the demos through OU812. The proof is in the pudding. Try the tunings and I guarantee you that you will be in tune with the recordings.