The Abortion Debate Thread

[It's Mike]

FLASHBACK to when Trump Said He’d Put 2-3 Justices On The Supreme Court — And They Would Overturn Roe

Unlike the Dems... Presidential Candidate Trump made good on his Promises.

Promises Made ... Promises Kept.

An Incredible Legacy!!

So Far...

He's certainly got a legacy.

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[Number 47]

Oh My God! It's Charlottesville all over again.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/pi...est/vi-AAYRINV

Gotta love the MSM.

[Nostalgia Act]

^^^

We are going to see more of this. Wouldn't be surprised if someone gets killed.

I'm going to stay out of the decision that came down yesterday, but when it comes to protests-any protest - that blocks the road, I am for the person/people in the vehicle doing what they have to do to escape the situation. Not purposely running into a crowd,but being an innocent victim that is just driving down the street and a "mob" blocks your path.

Edit:

Yesterday here in Tulsa, there were protests/demonstrations downtown with a group of prolife people , and an even larger group of pro choice people. From what I gathered from a news report, the pro life folks had an armed person with them acting as security. Apparently this person made the pro choice folks feel uncomfortable. This person was asked to leave the area by law enforcement, and I believe complied.

[NDL]

Oh My God! It's Charlottesville all over again.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/pi...est/vi-AAYRINV

Gotta love the MSM.

Infighting is gonna be the ruination of our Country.

[fudd]

^^^

We are going to see more of this. Wouldn't be surprised if someone gets killed.

I'm going to stay out of the decision that came down yesterday, but when it comes to protests-any protest - that blocks the road, I am for the person/people in the vehicle doing what they have to do to escape the situation. Not purposely running into a crowd,but being an innocent victim that is just driving down the street and a "mob" blocks your path.

Edit:

Yesterday here in Tulsa, there were protests/demonstrations downtown with a group of prolife people , and an even larger group of pro choice people. From what I gathered from a news report, the pro life folks had an armed person with them acting as security. Apparently this person made the pro choice folks feel uncomfortable. This person was asked to leave the area by law enforcement, and I believe complied.

I am in Atlanta pretty regularly. I have made the necessary adjustments weapons wise.


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[VH1986]

Maybe it's time for a divorce. Blues need to migrate to their states and Red to theirs. There needs to be cessation of the Union and two countries formed. Each can pursue their own socio-economic and political systems and can forge economic ties as trading partners and military allies in the face of international threats to North America or the Western Hemisphere. Union Blue will become the second largest economy in the world behind China and Red Confederation will be the third. Together, yet separately, our two nations can help to sustain geo-political balance.

The separation won't be neat and comfortable, but it could ultimately save years of internal conflict that will eventually lead to implosion. Let us Americans, Blue and Red, be the authors of our own transformation.

Go ahead and rip this to shreds.

[VH1986]

I'm sorry, I have no faith in educating. Educating who exactly? Poor women in Appalachia?

Middle class women in Portland?

Education and the money thrown into it and other hot button issues has had ZERO effect. 86 the other day, talked about sometimes you have to force the issue vis a vis LGBT and Trans. This is the same imo. Maybe people should be scared to be horny on a Friday night after taking a dab and drinking Hennessy.

Ain't no dabber or sipper going to quash their inhibitions on a freaky Friday night. Let's get real.

[fudd]

Maybe it's time for a divorce. Blues need to migrate to their states and Red to theirs. There needs to be cessation of the Union and two countries formed. Each can pursue their own socio-economic and political systems and can forge economic ties as trading partners and military allies in the face of international threats to North America or the Western Hemisphere. Union Blue will become the second largest economy in the world behind China and Red Confederation will be the third. Together, yet separately, our two nations can help to sustain geo-political balance.

The separation won't be neat and comfortable, but it could ultimately save years of internal conflict that will eventually lead to implosion. Let us Americans, Blue and Red, be the authors of our own transformation.

Go ahead and rip this to shreds.

Nah. Just wait for a terrorist attack again. Then everything will be hunky dory.


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[VH1986]

Nah. Just wait for a terrorist attack again. Then everything will be hunky dory.


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Well, I don't want that to happen to any area of the existing country. And, things only seemed hunky dory for a little while.

[lovemachine97(Version 2)]

I that is one reason some in the gay (and minority) community are worried that the SC will eventually roll back Federally mandated laws providing equal rights such as same-sex marriage, discrimination, contraception, etc. Clarence Thomas' opinion specifically mentions looking at cases that address these issues.

So I would say that based upon the decision’s logic, plus Thomas’ concurrence, there is reason to be concerned, but I find it unlikely.

Obergefell was decided, basically, that the unenumerated right to marriage exists under the term “liberty” in the due process clause and that the due process and equal protection clauses extends such a right to same sex couples.

In Dobbs, the court uses the Glucksberg test. The court ignored that test in Obergefell saying it applies only to newly identified rights, not extending existing rights to those denied them. This decision says that without historical evidence of a right, narrowly defined, a state can limit it if there is a rational basis for state interest in doing so. Rational basis is a very deferential standard for the state.

This reasoning brings Loving (interracial marriage rights), Lawrence (states can’t outlaw sodomy), Griswold (contraception) and Obergefell into much dicier territory then before, because they easily could not pass that test. The decision says they wouldn’t be affected but offer no real legal reasoning why they wouldn’t fall under the new Dobbs framework. And you could even make the argument anything that basically wasn’t a right at the time written that has since relied on these clauses is at risk, like right to counsel.

At the same time, I doubt anyone but Thomas actually wants to revisit these. Kavanaugh’s concurrence says he doesn’t. Roberts seems very unlikely. And I think Gorsuch is unlikely, too. Plus you have the 3 liberals so it’s at least 5-4 against reversing those and probably 6-3, minimum.

Of course, it’s a lot easier as a straight dude to say “don’t worry,” I’m sure.


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[track 5]

I'm very anti abortion for the most part. For those that use it as getting by as a tool to just fuck and carry on. Not big on that. But, I've seen some shit where a girl has been gang raped after the big game or hung out with the wrong people. Now she has to look at that child knowing how THAT went down. And I've also seen fucking animals that I wish were aborted. Tons of them. I'm weird that way. Brutal people that do brutal things....Not your guy on this end. Out.

[track 5]

^^^

that blocks the road, I am for the person/people in the vehicle doing what they have to do to escape the situation. Not purposely running into a crowd,but being an innocent victim that is just driving down the street and a "mob" blocks your path.

Edit:

Yesterday here in Tulsa, there were protests/demonstrations downtown with a group of prolife people , and an even larger group of pro choice people. From what I gathered from a news report, the pro life folks had an armed person with them acting as security. Apparently this person made the pro choice folks feel uncomfortable. This person was asked to leave the area by law enforcement, and I believe complied.

I remember one. LMAO. It was stupid shit. These fuckers thought that blocking the road we wouldn't pass. By the border. And two trucks we had nailed down on our end, obviously. Good times. Long weekend. LOL. I think I posted that around here. Out.

[ziggysmalls]

I don't care what you are protesting. Could be for MAGA2024, BLM, Abortion, Right to Conceal Carry, etc Get the fuck out of the street. I will side with a car going at a reasonable speed to leave the area. If you get crushed, your own damn fault for thinking a 200lb body can compete or stop a 2500lb object. If a person feels threatened and they shoot your ass, same thing. Protesting is fine until somebody feels threatened.

Ok back to the topic on hand and this is long

I see a lot of RBG comments on Facebook. If anybody should be pissed off, it should be at her. She should have retired when she had cancer for the 5th time and with Obama having obviously the time and clout to nominate somebody to replace her. Her hubris on not leaving the bench, allowed a constitutionalist judge to replace her. I know its easy to say conservative but in reality they are ruling on the constitution. Anyway her pride and power wouldn't allow it. I bet that had it then been 4 votes to keep it, Robers would have sided with them. That guy is definitely a moderate on many issues and then this would have been 5-4 instead of 3-6. So St Ginsberg pride is part of the reason why this happened. The Garland thing is something different but that was a few month window. That was political. She had years to do what was right for her followers. That was pride.

I honestly do think that a breakup would be best for this country. i just don't see a path forward. Sorry I just see such division on common goals and such immaturity, maybe it would best. Then again we could have Yugoslavia and a war? However maybe we could be simply like Czech and Slovakia? The issue would be geographical. You got the west and east coast that are alike but thousands of miles apart. Ports, roads, etc.

Oh wait, maybe the states should simply have more power to do what they want intead of the federal government? I mean that was really the basis of this ruling. The federal government is going to give power back to the states to decide what they want to do. I actually like that idea. If the legislative branch of a state is in control of the law, then people can change said law at the state level if they choose. So California wants to be abortion friendly, they can be. If Alambama doesn't, well they can pass that law. The people then will decide what they want by removing their legislative branch so a new law can be passed.

Yes short term it sucks. I get that but long term this is where we want to be at. At least IMO. I would rather Ohians dicate what we want than Californians and vice versa. Again short term it will be bumpy. I get that. Like drugs. Oregon wants people to not be crinimilzed for drugs. Ok. Doesn't make sense to me but I don't live there. If they find out its a bad idea, they vote the people in to repeal it. If you identify solely on abortion then its likely that you will move to another state so you can have it. Just like if I want to do heroin without conviction, hell I go in my car and get to Oregon or Washington to shoot up. If I hate taxes, I don't live in Califronia or NY. I move somewhere else like they are doing. If I need to smoke pot and want recreational I go move to Michigan or NY instead of here in Ohio.

I do agree that a compromise on abortion is the best idea. I hate it but I do support it under certain conditions. Obviously health of mother, baby, rape, incest, etc The big things which IMO is likely a very small minority of the babies aborted. Most likely are do to not being responsible enough for having sex. I think all around in our scoiety we have abandoned responsibility and accountability which has created a huge issue with a lot of things. Maybe this is a good life lesson? Yes short term it will suck but if you demand people to wear masks in public and peopel adhere to it because its science, well wearing a rubber is a good thing too base don the science its far more effective BC than pulling out or blasting inside and rolling the dice. Yes I know the cost? Yeah if you are unable to afford a box of rubbers, then you likely are too poor to get an abortion. You likely are too poor to raise a kid. So maybe and I know this is a crazy idea but maybe don't have sex or do other forms of sex until you can affrod that birth control. If its that important for you to have unprotected sex or even protected with failed BC, then you need to understand there is a risk. Our society though is only concentrated on people who can't afford. Yes if you are too poor to buy rubbers then the issue at hand is improving your income to the point where you can. That should be your primary focus.

Think of STD's. Wearing a rubber doesn't prevent AIDS or other STD"s from infecting you. It lessens the risk just like wearing a rubber lessens the risk of getiting knocked up but its not 100%. Yet you make that call.

Again short term sucks. Long term maybe we learn about accountability, judgement and responsiblity.

Now that said I really don't like this decision in the short term but I also hate the fact that we have a culture that loves abortion. THat proclaims how great it is to have one. To allow it under no restrictions to third trimester. Yes I know a minority of people believe but a politcal party has embraced that position. Our Speaker embraces it. Sorry to say but you do this over time, you do embolden people to take certain measure. I don't want a ban but I also don't want 8 month fetuses being ripped out either. Maybe over time we get a responsible abortion law across the 50 states to where it is considered a rare event and not embraced. I don't understand how anybody can be proud of ripping out a living life from their womb. How they can be excited about having this right. That said, I understand it needs to be there. So I am conflicted but as I said earlier, a step back may end up being two steps forward

[fudd]

Nothing will change. People will now cross state lines to get an abortion. I don’t get the outrage. It seems people want to bitch just to bitch.


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[CaboChris]

Nothing will change. People will now cross state lines to get an abortion. I don’t get the outrage. It seems people want to bitch just to bitch.


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The talk about 2 separate countries or whatever is ridiculous. This isn't the end of the world. This shit happens in lifetimes. We act like shit is never supposed to change or be reversed. People will adapt. They're just gonna have to spend money. I'm sick of fucking hearing about poor people and how it will affect them. Guess what? Don't have sex then. I once went 10 years of my life without sex. It's not impossible.

Adapt.

America isn't here to make EVERYTHING convenient.