Israel vs. Palestine - the Bloodening

**mistere** · 12.28.08, 01:03 PM

Um, I'm not pretending like I know what to do there, but, um, I feel like
we should be talking about this. You know, the Israeli razing of the Gaza Strip,
in like, retaliation, and stuff. 24 hours and not much in the US media,
at least in my limited access. Meanwhile, respectable news outlets have the
apocalypse on a loop. 40 years in the making maybe, but perhaps a word,
no?

http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/12/...ast_update.php

*whistles off into the distance...*

**VanHalenRules** · 12.28.08, 01:13 PM

Even if it had been on the news, I wouldn't have seen it because I've been pretty much tuned out of the real world over the past few days.

**graeme** · 12.28.08, 01:59 PM

Mistere. It's been all over the BBC, as it rightly should. Much as I think the beeb has lowered it's standards over the last few years, it is still the international standard for (almost) impartial news-reporting as far as I am concerned. (Though saying that, if I still lived in the UK I'd be tuning into BBC2 or CH4)

The reporters have, in interviews and by turns, hammered Hamas spokesmen and Israeli government officials, basically calling all bloodthirsty idiots who need to grow the fuck up, very quickly. Of course, being British, they just ask the kind of questions these people do not want to be asked. Their "non-answers" speak volumes more than any ridiculous posturing on the part of the reporters.

The current line of reporting/questioning seems to be;

(To Hamas) "Why not just stop throwing rockets into Israel. It just gives them an excuse"

(To Israel) "Is this not over-reacting just a tad? Oh, is it any coincidence that an election is on the cards and Israelis want a tougher line"

The bottom line though is that this is just a massacre, and, whatever the ulterior motive, and there are so many I could think of, Israel seems bent on starting a land war next. A few dead Israeli soldiers will give a better excuse to further this into hell knows what.

Perhaps it's because the Brits basically started this whole mess with our wonderful carve up of the region, but the media seems able to speak about what it sees without any fear of being seen anti-semite, anti-muslim or whatever.

This is a clusterfuck of the highest order and, whilst I am most certainly not against israel's right to exist (only an idiot would be), in light of the mounting casualty rate in Gaza, one can only sympathise with hamas' declarations that it will call all of it's fighters to arms. regardless of where a person stands politically, a people being bombed would not be expected to sit there and hope that their attackers would stop. Fighting back is what people under pressure do.

But then again, as soon as it was announced that 18 months of being caged in were being relaxed to allow food, medicine etc into gaza, you just knew that something was going to happen.

However, fuck the governments and militias doing the killing. Let's just hope that this doesn't spread out to lebanon and Syria or that, woe betide a few invading troops get hurt, that israel blames Iran for the whole thing, and that the strikes we've long been fearing happen. One missile goes Tehran bound and the whole region turns into ...... (Conspiracy theorists might say that this is just simply a pretext to do just that)

Once again, the people in power who make the decisions are fuck holes who care not a shit about what happens so long as they get their way and, of course, a lot of ordinary people die.

Sometimes I am embarrassed to be a human being.

btw. Watch what happens in Egypt. just a thought.

**Len75** · 12.28.08, 02:01 PM

these people should put their best fighters in the cage and let them go at it. Im so sick of this shit. Im so glad that i live in a country that is stable and peaceful. We are so blessed people.

**fudd** · 12.28.08, 02:28 PM

This isn't going to end well. Interesting to see how Obama deals with this not liking Isreal and what not.

**Axxman300** · 12.28.08, 04:23 PM

It was a thing of beauty.

Hamas was actually having a "Graduation Ceremony" with all of their new terrorists, er, fighters lined up in formation in front of many Hamas leadership-types. They sank a missle right in the middle of them.

Ballsy move.

**Little Dreamer** · 12.28.08, 07:40 PM

Fuddman, I donno where you get your info about Obama not liking Israel. His chief of staff is Rahm Emanuel and his sec of state is Hillary. Sounds pretty pro-Israeli to me.

Just coz his middle name is "hussein" doesn't make him anti-israeli. And even though Barack's a damn smart guy, he can't make peace happen over there if people over there don't want peace. Of course there's always the Iraqi pacification method - give 100k of yearly salary to all the mid-level commanders for them to retire. That generally brings peace just about anywhere around the world. Middle-east peace must just not be worth that much money...

**mistere** · 12.29.08, 03:06 AM

Maybe if we could all get past our gods and promised lands and whatnot,
we'd be better off. Not that we wouldn't still find something to fight over
(see Ireland), but it would be one less excuse. What's so funny bout peace,
love and understanding? Crazy talk.

Btw, when I said responsible networks I include the likes of the BBC.
It just confounds me that this barely rates in the US - at least in what they
export back to the outside world, which is where you might think they'd at
least want the appearance of giving a shit, or I dunno, being actual journalists
and not merely the smug and petty narcissists they are.

Rant over.

**fudd** · 12.29.08, 05:07 AM

Originally Posted by Little Dreamer

Fuddman, I donno where you get your info about Obama not liking Israel. His chief of staff is Rahm Emanuel and his sec of state is Hillary. Sounds pretty pro-Israeli to me.

Just coz his middle name is "hussein" doesn't make him anti-israeli. And even though Barack's a damn smart guy, he can't make peace happen over there if people over there don't want peace. Of course there's always the Iraqi pacification method - give 100k of yearly salary to all the mid-level commanders for them to retire. That generally brings peace just about anywhere around the world. Middle-east peace must just not be worth that much money...

I remember when all the debating was going on during the election and somehow or another he said that Isreal should fend for themselves. If I can find it I'll post it. And just because he has an isreali in his cabinet doesn't mean anything or Hilary for that matter. He is the president. I just hope this doesn't start WWIII.

**Charvel2** · 12.29.08, 05:13 AM

Is this really not getting coverage in the US? It's been the lead item here since it kicked off, and it's getting uglier by the hour.

**bsbll4** · 12.29.08, 06:02 AM

Hamas fires rockets breaking a cease-fire, Israel overreacts, and then another cease fire is bargained.

This happens every 3 months, that's why it doesn't get more play over here.

**broken9500** · 12.29.08, 07:25 AM

I say fuck Hamas. I hope Israel levels the whole damn region.

As for the whole "overreacting" thing...I don't get that at all. Hamas was the one that sent the bombs over during the "cease-fire." They get whatever hell comes down.

**VanHalenRules** · 12.29.08, 07:53 AM

Originally Posted by Charvel2

Is this really not getting coverage in the US? It's been the lead item here since it kicked off, and it's getting uglier by the hour.

As I mentioned earlier, my TV was on anything but news since Christmas, but yes, this is getting a lot of coverage over here as of last night (when I started watching).

**cabomiro** · 12.29.08, 09:05 AM

Originally Posted by fuddman5150

I remember when all the debating was going on during the election and somehow or another he said that Isreal should fend for themselves. If I can find it I'll post it. And just because he has an isreali in his cabinet doesn't mean anything or Hilary for that matter. He is the president. I just hope this doesn't start WWIII.

What's wrong with saying Israel or Palestine should fend for themselves.

The US president shouldn't have to choose sides. He should be Pro US and not worry about getting himself into every other conflict. Look at all the wars going on in Africa for the last 30 years and I don't see the US getting involved. And they shouldn't!

**Dave's Dreidel** · 12.29.08, 10:35 AM

The quicker we get off our need for foreing oil and have nothing to do with that entire region the better. I won't say never, but they will not get along with each other in that region at any point during our lives.

If Africa had huge oil reserves that we were dependent on, we would have been involved somehow in all their wars over the past thirty years, you can bank on it.

It is called protecting American interests, and sub Saharan Africa has about zero interest to the USA.

However, the Middle East and its huge oil reserves? Mucho interest.