Give us back our Marines!

[YO!Edward]

I really cant believe we are getting on for a week now without the return of our Royal Navy personnel from the Iranians. This matter is close to my heart as they include a contingent of Royal Marines Commandos, the unit I myself was in.

It strikes me that though there has been considerable concern expressed in the media the public reaction to this issue is luke-warm. I expected people to give more of a damn but I guess most people in the UK just want to forget that the lads are even over there. The story has even dropped off one of the largest internet homepage mainpages (msn.co.uk)

Regardless of your position on the Iraq war I consider these men Prisoners of War and every day they are captive I am hoping for their safe return.

I know 'Royal' can take it, anyone thats been at Commando Training Centre for 32 weeks of hell (like nothing you would believe!) can take a few days in Iran but its time these guys were realeased.

[voivod]

UK: 15 'ambushed' in Iraqi waters

• UK says data shows sailors held by Iran never strayed outside Iraqi waters
• Royal Navy: Britons were 1.7 miles inside Iraqi waters when "ambushed"
• Iran says sailors, captured while boarding vessels, were in Iranian waters
• UK foreign secretary says Britain will freeze bilateral business with Iran

LONDON, England (CNN) -- Satellite tracking data shows that a group of 15 British military personnel captured by Iran last Friday never strayed outside Iraqi waters, according to Britain's Ministry of Defence.

British Foreign Secretary Margaret Beckett also announced Wednesday that Britain would freeze all bilateral business with Iran until the 15 personnel were released.

"We are now in a new phase of diplomatic activity," Beckett told members of parliament.

Earlier, British Vice Admiral Charles Style said the global positioning system proves the boat carrying the Britons was "clearly" 3.1 kilometers (1.7 nautical miles) inside Iraqi waters and that they were "ambushed" by the Iranian forces.

Britain says Iran's detention of the eight Royal Navy sailors and seven Royal Marines, who were conducting a routine inspection of a merchant vessel at the northern end of the Persian Gulf, is illegal and is demanding their release.

Iran insists they were inside its territorial waters and, according to Style, provided a map with coordinates proving the Britons were out of bounds on Saturday.

However, those points provided were still within Iraqi territorial waters, Style said.

Upon pointing that out Sunday through diplomatic contacts "they provided a second set of coordinates" on Monday that were "in Iranian waters over two nautical miles" from the global position shown by the HMS Cornwall and confirmed by the merchant vessel the British personnel boarded.

The "change of coordinates," Style said, was "hard to legitimate."

Iran responded Wedesday by saying the sailors, which served aboard HMS Cornwall, were 0.5 km (0.27 nautical miles) inside Iranian waters when seized, Iran's embassy in London said, according to the official IRNA news agency.

The statement also "assures that the governments of Iran and Britain have the ability to solve the incident through contacts and close cooperation," IRNA said, according to Reuters.

The Iranians have condemned the move as an act of "aggression" and threatened prosecution. Tehran has also refused Britain's requests to visit the detainees.

The UK government is demanding the group's immediate release, with Prime Minister Tony Blair condemning the "completely unacceptable, wrong and illegal" detention of the 15 service personnel.

He said it was time to "ratchet up" the diplomatic and international pressure on Iran to release the group.

Blair told parliament on Wednesday: "Our thoughts are with our servicemen and the servicewoman and their families and their safe return is our paramount concern.

"Those personnel were patrolling in Iraqi waters under a United Nations mandate. Their boarding and checking of the Indian merchant vessel was routine.

"There was no justification whatever for their detention. It was completely unacceptable, wrong and illegal.

"It is now time to ratchet up the diplomatic and international pressure in order to make sure the Iranian government understands their total isolation on this issue."

Blair also defended the Navy personnel's "entirely sensible" decision not to fight back against their captors. To have done so would have led to "severe loss of life," the prime minister said.

Calling the shots
CNN's European Political Editor Robin Oakley said: "Blair talked about things moving into a different phase. We are going to see the start of that different phase today.

"Britain is hoping to use other countries that have good relations with Iran -- like Turkey -- to persuade them that they really should release the sailors.

"But one of the problems is no one is quite sure who is calling the shots in the Iranian administration at the moment, and precisely whose hands these sailors are in -- is it the Revolutionary Guard or the Navy? Is it now government officials? -- And who is making decision about how the case is handled at this stage.

"The British authorities remember the incident back in 2004 when eight British marines were held in similar circumstances. According to the marines themselves, there was psychological torture, there were people pointing guns at them, and they were paraded blindfolded on television, and so on.

"The British authorities are seeking very firm assurances the sailors are being well treated. Foreign Secretary Margaret Beckett is saying if they are being treated as well as the Iranians say they are, then what's the problem allowing access to them by British officials?

"But the background circumstances have changed since 2004. The U.N. Security Council has intensified sanctions against Iran over its uranium enrichment program, we have the U.S. conducting major exercises in the Persian Gulf, and also since 2004 we have a change in regime in Iran -- a rather more unpredictable regime led by President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad -- so people can't be absolutely sure things will play out as they did in 2004."

Turkish Prime Minister Tayyip Erdogan said Iran may allow Turkish diplomats to see the sailors and marines, according to CNN Turk. Erdogan is attending a meeting of the Arab League in the Saudi capital.

An Iranian official said Tuesday Britain would be allowed to make contact with the group once a preliminary investigation was completed. (Full story)

'That's the choice I made'
In an interview with the Independent newspaper, hours before she was captured, the one woman in the group, Faye Turney, spoke of her love for her three-year-old daughter Molly and her devotion to her job.

And she had told the BBC about her career: "My parents made sure that I was under no illusion that I could and can go to war at any time. That's the choice I made, so it's always there.

"You've got to have it in the back of your head that you can be called on -- and when you do you've just got to deal with it and get on with it."

The growing diplomatic row between Iran and the UK has seen regular contact between the two countries. The British Government has summoned the Iranian ambassador in London to the Foreign Office three times over the past five days to repeat demands for the captives to be released.

[WinterlessIceness]

How do you capture 15 Royal Marines Commandos as prisoners? Did Iranians have a battleship against them or something?

Edited: Oh. Well I kinda missed this part when I read first -

Blair also defended the Navy personnel's "entirely sensible" decision not to fight back against their captors. To have done so would have led to "severe loss of life," the prime minister said.

^ that I have no doubt in

[ZeoBandit]

They'll get released. You all will kick some ass, and I'm sure Bush will want to get some as well.

[Aristotle]

I really cant believe we are getting on for a week now without the return of our Royal Navy personnel from the Iranians. This matter is close to my heart as they include a contingent of Royal Marines Commandos, the unit I myself was in.

It strikes me that though there has been considerable concern expressed in the media the public reaction to this issue is luke-warm. I expected people to give more of a damn but I guess most people in the UK just want to forget that the lads are even over there. The story has even dropped off one of the largest internet homepage mainpages (msn.co.uk)

Regardless of your position on the Iraq war I consider these men Prisoners of War and every day they are captive I am hoping for their safe return.

I know 'Royal' can take it, anyone thats been at Commando Training Centre for 32 weeks of hell (like nothing you would believe!) can take a few days in Iran but its time these guys were realeased.

Its a disgraceful, blatant and deliberate act of provocation by the Revolutionary Guards and I think it is particularly untimely. But you can be sure that they remember the SAS from the 80's, so it wont be long before the soldiers are released. There's already a lot of internal conflict about what happened.

[JasonG5150]

They'll get released. You all will kick some ass, and I'm sure Bush will want to get some as well.

hell yeah, and its pissing me off how iran is trying to start something, we don't want a war with them, idk why they have to provoke it.

[graeme]

I sincerely hope this whole issue is resolved with no harm coming to anyone.

Having said that, something does not seem quite right about this whole situation.

The strait is a narrow waterway and though everyone has the latest gps gizmos, I really wonder if they hadn't strayed into Iranian waters, regardless of what the MOD says.

Whether this was intentional or not, who knows? It's embarrassing if not and if it was..well.

We have been operating here for a long time with no issues so why now?

The Iranians insist that it is not retaliation for the UN sanctions being placed on them or for the Iranians captured in Iraq recently. Maybe, maybe not.

Our own media (the BBC for god's sake) had the headline "Marines KIDNAPPED" when this first broke although i think they have stepped back from all the sensationalist stuff now.

If they were in Iranian waters, the Iranians did have the right to capture them but our boys also have the right to a visit from the consulate, considering we are technically not at war (yet).

We don't know where they are is more worrying than the fact they have been taken.

Overall, this is a nasty situation for all concerned. I desperately hope that the Iranians either return them or charge them (under the terms of the Geneva convention) with spying or whatever so we don't have to escalate this militarily, which is something that Blair has hinted strongly at.

Cynics might say that certain powers might actually want this excuse for escalation into open conflict.

That is my biggest concern.

[YO!Edward]

This story seems to have clambered back into the public eye today due to the revelation that one of the Royal Navy personnel is a woman, a mother of two in fact.

Now that must be a very worried family.

[graeme]

This story seems to have clambered back into the public eye today due to the revelation that one of the Royal Navy personnel is a woman, a mother of two in fact.

Now that must be a very worried family.

Saw an interview with her yesterday. Seems like a smart and tough girl but yeah, you would not want to be her father right now.

[graeme]

The Iranians have just done a televised apology from the Brits propaganda piece. Faye Turney, the captured woman, was reading a letter apologising for her illegal entry into Iranian waters bla bla.

She looked healthy though obviously nervous as hell. The buzz word on the airwaves is predictably "under duress".

We'll see what happens next. Blair is doing his strong man "I am super cool" impression in the Commons at the moment.

We should just ask the Turkish government to speak to the Iranians. Probably a lot quicker and less volatile than most other options.

[Axxman300]

The Revolutionary Guard practices the capture of VBSS boats every day. We've watched them and Iranian TV has showed these exercises. What I don't get was why the Brits don't have any air cover when they do these ops like our Navy does.

The water way is narrow and disputed between Iraq and Iran. This dispute is one of the things that lead to the Iran/Iraq war.

The British will handle this, the Iranians just announced that they'l release the female captive.

The Stenis battle group was yanked out of port call yesterday and steamed into the Gulf to conduct exercises with the Eisenhower. This means that Iranian radar operaters have to track 200 extra planes and you KNOW we're going to fly right up to their airspace and say "Hi" (We do this anyway, and other countries do this to us. It's called brinksmanship and it's kinda fun).

[graeme]

[QUOTE=Axxman300;757356]

The water way is narrow and disputed between Iraq and Iran. This dispute is one of the things that lead to the Iran/Iraq war.


QUOTE]

From what I understand, even though the group that was captured was outgunned, the "Cornwall" was very close by as would be air support but what's the point.

You take them out and you DO have a war and a propoganda victory for Tehran.The restraint they showed was absolutely the best policy. It gives the Brits a lot more leeway and clout regarding the people they can call on for pressure against Iran.

Or maybe not. I guess time will tell on this one, once we get a better picture of what both sides are really trying to achieve.

I don't trust a single one of these politicians.

[Dennis]

Regardless of your position on the Iraq war I consider these men Prisoners of War and every day they are captive I am hoping for their safe return.

Agreed....it's very sad to see your Country men & woman broadcast on tv the way they are being. It's dumb for Iran to force them to read bullshit "confessions"...nobody believes that. Here's to all of them coming home soon.

[Axxman300]

[QUOTE=graeme;757364]

The water way is narrow and disputed between Iraq and Iran. This dispute is one of the things that lead to the Iran/Iraq war.


QUOTE]

From what I understand, even though the group that was captured was outgunned, the "Cornwall" was very close by as would be air support but what's the point.

You take them out and you DO have a war and a propoganda victory for Tehran.The restraint they showed was absolutely the best policy. It gives the Brits a lot more leeway and clout regarding the people they can call on for pressure against Iran.

Or maybe not. I guess time will tell on this one, once we get a better picture of what both sides are really trying to achieve.

I don't trust a single one of these politicians.

Here's the problem, the Royal Navy was conducting UN SANCTIONED searches to enforce UN Sanctions just emplaced. The seize British service people is an act of war, not only against England, which is not at war with Iran, but the entire world via the UN. American SEALs and FAST Marines would have opened fire. Why? They're in the clear as far as self defence is concerned and look at where you are now, the UK is going to have to suck on whatever Iran waves in their face. Our unwritten rule is : Never surrender to Haji.

The problem is that Iran's leaders watch too much of the western media, which is constantly spouting about how stretched thin our military is. The problem is that we are and we aren't. If you compair what we're doing in Iraq with what our true destructive capability is it's clear that we're just farting around military-wise. Iran's problem is that it thinks it's poking a dying animal, they could very well find out otherwise because - technically - they've handed us an excuse on a Silver Platter. All the UK has to do is ask for help.

Like I said before, the UK won't. However, if they wimp out on this issue then they should also hand back the Falklands too.

[FORD]

This is a setup. Can we say "Gulf of Tonkin II".

The Russians seem to think the attack on Iran is scheduled for Good Friday.

The BCE would be just twisted enough to do that.

This insanity must be stopped. This nation will NOT RECOVER from any further implementation of the Likud/PNAC agenda. It will be worse than the Soviet Union after Afghanistan.