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  1. #91
    Atomic Punk ziggysmalls's Avatar
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    05.27.20 @ 03:54 AM
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    I think its far more complicated than any of us MMQB's can understand. You have four band members running a multi-million dollar corporation. You have drugs and alcohol. You have wives giving their input. You have personal influencers giving advice to people. You have the record company putting pressure. You have either dying management or new management with their idea. History is there along with family ties.

    All we know is what happened and what people have said since. Obviously any of the four are going to be extremely biased. The only one who has changed their story was Mike. When he was with the Van Halens, he agreed to everything that they said. When he was kicked out, he sided with Sammy. If that happens to a football player or CEO who does that, well you don't put too much stock into that. If you agree to whomever is giving you a paycheck, you are somewhat in the employ of the person.

    Do I believe Eddie fucked it up? Sure. However I also believe that Sammy was also at fault too. Not as much as Eddie but its obvious from all and in his words, they were only close for two albums. They started to fall out. 4 years of that is going to make both sides not respect each other.

    Two guys who probably have never contributed to the drama to Van Halen are Mike and Gary. All others have some blood on their hands

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  3. #92
    Good Enough Pacfanweb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlindtotheWorld View Post
    Are the Cabo Wabo Cantinas actually all that lucrative? I mean, it's not some huge global chain like Hard Rock or something. If I recall, the Tequila came afterwards and never had any involvement from the VH brothers. Am I right here? If so, what's there to be that mad about? They don't have ownership stake in some themed restaurant/night club in Mexico?
    I can't imagine that Sam is really making a fortune just on the cantinas.

    At the end of the day, they are just bars and I guess restaurants if they serve any food.

    And I don't see why they're pissed at Sam (if they even are, really) over the Cabo.

    It was losing money. They were pissed at him for that, so he bought them out. Then, after getting kicked out of VH, he put a lot of time and effort into reviving the original one in Cabo.

    At the same time, he was working his ass off to revitalize his solo career, plus he started his tequila company. All that stuff kind of got going in the same general time frame...with the common factor being Sam's name and fame, plus his working his arse off to make it all happen. He kind of realized that he liked that whole lifestyle, and based his career around it. Basically, he became a kind of hard rock Jimmy Buffet. It all flowed together....music, tequila, Cabo Wabo Cantina, Red Rocker.

    And it succeeded. I don't see why the VH brothers would be pissed about that. If they really think that he intentionally sabotaged Cabo so they'd sell their shares to him so he could magically wave a wand at it to turn it around, I just don't know what to tell anyone about that....that notion is just so stupid it hurts.

    Sam is a good businessman. Not because he's so smart...I really don't think he is, but he's smart enough to know what he doesn't know, and savvy enough to find folks to run things for him that DO.

    Like his bicycle shops back in the day...he did very well with those. He's one of those dudes that can recognize a good idea and find folks to make things happen.
    I asked a ref if he could give me a technical foul for thinking bad things about him. He said, of course not. I said, well, I think you stink. And he gave me a technical. You can't trust em. -
    Jimmy V

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  5. #93
    Good Enough Pacfanweb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ziggysmalls View Post
    I think its far more complicated than any of us MMQB's can understand. You have four band members running a multi-million dollar corporation. You have drugs and alcohol. You have wives giving their input. You have personal influencers giving advice to people. You have the record company putting pressure. You have either dying management or new management with their idea. History is there along with family ties.

    All we know is what happened and what people have said since. Obviously any of the four are going to be extremely biased. The only one who has changed their story was Mike. When he was with the Van Halens, he agreed to everything that they said. When he was kicked out, he sided with Sammy. If that happens to a football player or CEO who does that, well you don't put too much stock into that. If you agree to whomever is giving you a paycheck, you are somewhat in the employ of the person.

    Do I believe Eddie fucked it up? Sure. However I also believe that Sammy was also at fault too. Not as much as Eddie but its obvious from all and in his words, they were only close for two albums. They started to fall out. 4 years of that is going to make both sides not respect each other.

    Two guys who probably have never contributed to the drama to Van Halen are Mike and Gary. All others have some blood on their hands
    Well, of course both Sammy and Dave are somewhat at fault for the way things ended with both their tenures, and for different reasons.
    They can't have been in the band that long and been perfect angels.

    And Mike clearly towed the party line when he was in the band, and now that he's been out, we can clearly see that more of the truth resided on Sammy's side of the story than on Edward's. I think you can just look at what EVH has said in interviews through the years and see that the guy simply says whatever is necessary at the time and basically nothing is really the truth.
    Look no farther than 2004 when he said how blessed he was to have both Sam and Mike back in his life, when we now know that he almost had to be forced to accept Mike back in order to get Sam.

    So just based on his contradictions over the years, I'd side with more of Sam's version than Ed's, without hesitation.

    Same with Dave...Dave definitely thought he was bigger than Van Halen and thought he was going to be a movie star, but it obviously wasn't all on him, but most of that split was.

    So they were both at fault, but there is one common factor through all of these version of Van Halen that has remained the same. Dave didn't seem to have much trouble getting along with his other bands. The whole rock world pretty universally loves Sammy. I've never heard anyone say anything bad about Gary.
    Yet EVH couldn't get along with any of them for long.

    I love me some EVH, but again, he's prime proof of someone that needs some strong management, and I guess an "interventionist" type of manager like Ed Leffler to keep the peace between him and his singers with strong personalities.
    Once he didn't have that, it all went downhill. Dammit, lol
    I asked a ref if he could give me a technical foul for thinking bad things about him. He said, of course not. I said, well, I think you stink. And he gave me a technical. You can't trust em. -
    Jimmy V

  6. #94
    Baluchitherium
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pacfanweb View Post
    Well, of course both Sammy and Dave are somewhat at fault for the way things ended with both their tenures, and for different reasons.
    They can't have been in the band that long and been perfect angels.

    And Mike clearly towed the party line when he was in the band, and now that he's been out, we can clearly see that more of the truth resided on Sammy's side of the story than on Edward's. I think you can just look at what EVH has said in interviews through the years and see that the guy simply says whatever is necessary at the time and basically nothing is really the truth.
    Look no farther than 2004 when he said how blessed he was to have both Sam and Mike back in his life, when we now know that he almost had to be forced to accept Mike back in order to get Sam.

    So just based on his contradictions over the years, I'd side with more of Sam's version than Ed's, without hesitation.

    Same with Dave...Dave definitely thought he was bigger than Van Halen and thought he was going to be a movie star, but it obviously wasn't all on him, but most of that split was.

    So they were both at fault, but there is one common factor through all of these version of Van Halen that has remained the same. Dave didn't seem to have much trouble getting along with his other bands. The whole rock world pretty universally loves Sammy. I've never heard anyone say anything bad about Gary.
    Yet EVH couldn't get along with any of them for long.

    I love me some EVH, but again, he's prime proof of someone that needs some strong management, and I guess an "interventionist" type of manager like Ed Leffler to keep the peace between him and his singers with strong personalities.
    Once he didn't have that, it all went downhill. Dammit, lol
    The common connection between both was Edward left Dave's house Dave thought it was agreed they each do a project and all gather after again then resume Van Halen. Obviously Ed had a different version.
    Sam thought it was all good to do greatest hits and take some time with the family, and was fired for no good reason. Clearly Ed has a different version.
    Dave and Sam are as different as different gets but both walked away thinking stuff was settled and clearly Ed had something different. That does not make Ed some evil douchebag but that inability to communicate does have tragic consequence but its not like you can just say Ed stop being an introvert. Its just who he is as a person.

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  8. #95
    Atomic Punk Bad to the Bone's Avatar
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    05.27.20 @ 06:55 AM
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    In reality this entire conversation boils down to one thing-Sam is a good business man and Ed wasn't so Ed and Al got pissed.

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  10. #96
    Atomic Punk I Coulda Hada VH's Avatar
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    05.27.20 @ 07:12 AM
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad to the Bone View Post
    In reality this entire conversation boils down to one thing-Sam is a good business man and Ed wasn't so Ed and Al got pissed.
    Exactly.
    "It's so lonely at the top because it's so crowded at the bottom" - Diamond David Lee Roth

    "The truth sounds like hate to those who hate the truth" - Todd Wagner

    "Women and Children First ... The REAL Van Halen III"

  11. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlindtotheWorld View Post
    Are the Cabo Wabo Cantinas actually all that lucrative? I mean, it's not some huge global chain like Hard Rock or something. If I recall, the Tequila came afterwards and never had any involvement from the VH brothers. Am I right here? If so, what's there to be that mad about? They don't have ownership stake in some themed restaurant/night club in Mexico?
    Not but 90 million split 4 ways which wouldíve been the inevitability is probably what pisses him off the most.

    That and the book.


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  12. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad to the Bone View Post
    In reality this entire conversation boils down to one thing-Sam is a good business man and Ed wasn't so Ed and Al got pissed.
    Call it what you want but the end result is still the same.


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  13. #99
    Good Enough Pacfanweb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fudd View Post
    Not but 90 million split 4 ways which would’ve been the inevitability is probably what pisses him off the most.

    That and the book.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    The 80 million was for the Tequila. 80% of Cabo Wabo for 80 million, I believe was the number.

    That had nothing to do with Van Halen, other than Sam used the Cabo Wabo name for it. That was 100% Sam, shortly after he was out of VH, in 1996.

    I seriously doubt there's been that much made by all the Cabo Wabo bars combined. I'm sure they make money, but not like the tequila did.

    I actually doubt the VH brothers are bothered much by the Cabo Cantina thing now. And I seriously doubt they care about the tequila, although I guess you never know with those dudes.

    I'd say the book is the big thing, that and Sam not being able to STFU.
    I asked a ref if he could give me a technical foul for thinking bad things about him. He said, of course not. I said, well, I think you stink. And he gave me a technical. You can't trust em. -
    Jimmy V

  14. #100
    Forum Frontman fudd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pacfanweb View Post
    The 80 million was for the Tequila. 80% of Cabo Wabo for 80 million, I believe was the number.

    That had nothing to do with Van Halen, other than Sam used the Cabo Wabo name for it. That was 100% Sam, shortly after he was out of VH, in 1996.

    I seriously doubt there's been that much made by all the Cabo Wabo bars combined. I'm sure they make money, but not like the tequila did.

    I actually doubt the VH brothers are bothered much by the Cabo Cantina thing now. And I seriously doubt they care about the tequila, although I guess you never know with those dudes.

    I'd say the book is the big thing, that and Sam not being able to STFU.
    No but had the relationship been salvaged I imagine that they would have done the venture together. Thatís my point. I imagine Daniels had something to do with that to bring Roth back.


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  15. #101
    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pacfanweb View Post
    The 80 million was for the Tequila. 80% of Cabo Wabo for 80 million, I believe was the number.

    That had nothing to do with Van Halen, other than Sam used the Cabo Wabo name for it. That was 100% Sam, shortly after he was out of VH, in 1996.

    I seriously doubt there's been that much made by all the Cabo Wabo bars combined. I'm sure they make money, but not like the tequila did.

    I actually doubt the VH brothers are bothered much by the Cabo Cantina thing now. And I seriously doubt they care about the tequila, although I guess you never know with those dudes.

    I'd say the book is the big thing, that and Sam not being able to STFU.
    You are thinking like a rational person.

    Ed and Al believe the following, right or wrong:

    Sam is lazy
    Sam became famous because of them
    Sam used their fame and names to garner interest in the Cabo brand
    Sam then turned that into a multi million dollar tequila business (so they think they go shafted out of that money too)
    Sam used them for the 2004 tour
    Sam trashed them to sell some books

    I know this isn't popular to acknowledge on here, but Sam is dead to them.
    If I don't respond to you it means I have you on ignore, which means you are a douchenozzle.

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  16. #102
    Atomic Punk Van Squalen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave's Dreidel View Post
    You are thinking like a rational person.

    Ed and Al believe the following, right or wrong:

    Sam is lazy
    Sam became famous because of them
    Sam used their fame and names to garner interest in the Cabo brand
    Sam then turned that into a multi million dollar tequila business (so they think they go shafted out of that money too)
    Sam used them for the 2004 tour
    Sam trashed them to sell some books

    I know this isn't popular to acknowledge on here, but Sam is dead to them.
    LOL. I think it's less Al, and more Ed.

 

 

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