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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by JUNGLE DRUMMER View Post
    Yeah, those are points I agree with as well.
    So it's only 89% you disagree with!

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  3. #32
    Atomic Punk Get The Show On The Road's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlofeldsCat View Post
    Fair point about the States, which I can't comment on. As for guitar geeks keeping them alive, the guitar is dying, remember? Everything's computerised and these bloody karaoke TV shows have killed the concept of the band/musician. And beyond that, too many of the 'next generation' are revering the 'other' legends whilst besmirching Ed and talking down his contributions. All the millenials smugly dismissing him with 'all he did was tapping and that was done many times before him, like Hackett and May and Gibbons'. in a 'god, didn't you know this already? How stupid are you?' condescending tone.
    Yeah, but Big Band Jazz died years ago and Dizzy Gilespie and Charlie Parker are still talked about as fabulous players. Especially in music appreciation classes.

    You can't tell the story of pop music without including the electric guitar, and you can't tell the story of the electric guitar without mentioning EVH.

    I'm guessing when EVH passes (which hopefully won't be for a while) his legacy will be re-written and some of the dismissive tone towards him will be forgotten. Since he's still alive he doesn't get that "final" judgement and retrospective on just what he accomplished on the instrument.
    The only genre I really know is Van Halen.

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  5. #33
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    It just irks me how every other legend got and kept their reverence yet Ed - incredulously - has been skipped over and now we're waiting for him to die to (possibly) reclaim it? WTF is wrong with people?

    I can honesty see it being: 'Oh yeah, Hendrix he's the man. And then Clapton and the Brit Blues guys, sure. Blackmore, Hackett, Scholz, Gibbons, definitely. Who'd you say, Van Halen? Naw - dude just ripped off Hackett and Mandel plus Jordan and Rocky George took it further. Now Rhoads though, and Malmsteen, they truly made a mark on rock guitar. Then Vai and Satch, Lane, then Mayer and Bonamassa'.

    It's unreal. They can recall in detail how the world was stunned by Jimi and Jimmy, how everyone played 'catch up' yet they don't recall the (recent-ish) testimony of everyone from Slash to Schon to Vai as to the seismic impact of Eddie. How he left the guitar world scratching their heads, every album for the first few years, and that it took the guitar community about 8-10 years to catch up to the point where every band had a hotshot gunslinger shamelessly regurgitating Eddie's licks, on Eddie-style guitars, whilst acting like they're cutting edge despite playing like Ed in '78.
    Last edited by BlofeldsCat; 11.25.17 at 06:05 PM.

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  7. #34
    Baluchitherium noise next door's Avatar
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    It's funny, I walk into my local music store (that is quite massive), and Edward Van Halen is the most visually represented artist in that entire place.

    You look around and you see more physical evidence of his "presence" in the music instrument industry than any other player by a huge margin.

    There are so many guitars, amps, effects, TAB books, etc etc... it's nuts. They recently had one of those $32,000.00 Franky replicas in a glass case.

    But it's not cool to like VH, because they're not part of the critic's establishment. You can't tell anyone you like VH in those upper circles of "informed thoughtful musicians". I play guitar and song write in the Alt-rock world and 99% of the people I work with have no idea that 90% of the music I write with them has been completely inspired by the voicings and chord changes of mostly EVH and similar players, and I can't tell them that or they'll literally laugh out loud.

    For whatever reason this band has been lumped in with Poison and the like probably due to the big hair, over-the-top guitar solos, and especially the lyrical party themes.

    The average person has no clue how songwriting actually works.

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  9. #35
    Atomic Punk JUNGLE DRUMMER's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Get The Show On The Road View Post
    Yeah, but Big Band Jazz died years ago and Dizzy Gilespie and Charlie Parker are still talked about as fabulous players. Especially in music appreciation classes.

    You can't tell the story of pop music without including the electric guitar, and you can't tell the story of the electric guitar without mentioning EVH.

    I'm guessing when EVH passes (which hopefully won't be for a while) his legacy will be re-written and some of the dismissive tone towards him will be forgotten. Since he's still alive he doesn't get that "final" judgement and retrospective on just what he accomplished on the instrument.
    In the last decade, Ed has started to regain the recognition and respect. It's not all the way back to where it should be, but I believe Ed will eventually be remembered for truly how incredible of a musician he is.

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  11. #36
    Atomic Punk Get The Show On The Road's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by noise next door View Post
    It's funny, I walk into my local music store (that is quite massive), and Edward Van Halen is the most visually represented artist in that entire place.

    You look around and you see more physical evidence of his "presence" in the music instrument industry than any other player by a huge margin.

    There are so many guitars, amps, effects, TAB books, etc etc... it's nuts. They recently had one of those $32,000.00 Franky replicas in a glass case.

    But it's not cool to like VH, because they're not part of the critic's establishment. You can't tell anyone you like VH in those upper circles of "informed thoughtful musicians". I play guitar and song write in the Alt-rock world and 99% of the people I work with have no idea that 90% of the music I write with them has been completely inspired by the voicings and chord changes of mostly EVH and similar players, and I can't tell them that or they'll literally laugh out loud.

    For whatever reason this band has been lumped in with Poison and the like probably due to the big hair, over-the-top guitar solos, and especially the lyrical party themes.

    The average person has no clue how songwriting actually works.
    When I was gigging back in the 90s it wasn't "cool" to play VH. I never understood why, but I had a hell of a time trying to get my bands to play Van Halen material. And we're talking CVH stuff here too.

    I'll never forget playing a backyard party and one of these Depeche Mode types was there. I knew him and knew he played guitar. During a break in our set he asked if he could play through my rig which consisted of my EVH EBMM, a 5150 half stack with two other cabinets for effects and a home made pedal board with a chorus to split the sound into stereo, a phaser, and a flanger. That fucker tried to play through it and it was just a wall of fucking noise. After about a minute I told him to knock it off and give it back to me.

    One under appreciated aspect of Ed's playing is how much control and dynamics he has playing at a high volume. It took me a long time to be able to control my rig, and this doofus who thought he could just turn the volume knob up and make it sound good discovered first hand how nuanced it can be to make a clear sound come out of a highly over driven amp.
    The only genre I really know is Van Halen.

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  13. #37
    Hot For Teacher Purple Haze's Avatar
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    VH: One of the best debut albums ever.
    VH II: DTNA, SGMAD, and Spanish Fly are the high points.
    WACF: ATCWR and Romeo Delight are the high points.
    FW: Mean Street and Unchained are the high points.
    DD: Should have never happened.
    1984: 1984-Hot for Teacher then I can leave the rest.
    5150: Totally kicks ass except for Get Up.
    OU812: Mine All Mine, When It's Love, and FWYS are three of Van Halen's best.
    FUCK: Poundcake, Judgment Day, Runaround, The Dream is Over, Right Now, 316 and Top of the World rule!
    Balance: Possibly the best album of the Hagar years. The depth of the songs and performances were awesome.
    VH III: Biggest fucking mistake EVER.
    ADKOT: Overrated as fuck.

  14. #38
    Good Enough DRFC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JUNGLE DRUMMER View Post
    Lol, pretty much disagree with probably 98% of your post BlofeldsCat. Well done.
    Yeah, #16 has some truth to it

  15. #39
    Atomic Punk RRvh1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Get The Show On The Road View Post
    When I was gigging back in the 90s it wasn't "cool" to play VH. I never understood why, but I had a hell of a time trying to get my bands to play Van Halen material. And we're talking CVH stuff here too.

    I'll never forget playing a backyard party and one of these Depeche Mode types was there. I knew him and knew he played guitar. During a break in our set he asked if he could play through my rig which consisted of my EVH EBMM, a 5150 half stack with two other cabinets for effects and a home made pedal board with a chorus to split the sound into stereo, a phaser, and a flanger. That fucker tried to play through it and it was just a wall of fucking noise. After about a minute I told him to knock it off and give it back to me.

    One under appreciated aspect of Ed's playing is how much control and dynamics he has playing at a high volume. It took me a long time to be able to control my rig, and this doofus who thought he could just turn the volume knob up and make it sound good discovered first hand how nuanced it can be to make a clear sound come out of a highly over driven amp.
    Sounds like the Billy Corgan story that Ed told.
    "There's too many people on this basketball that's floating around the sun, who are too afraid to allow themselves to FEEL" - Edward Van Halen
    "Van Halen was never about the singer..." - a very wise fan.
    "Embrace the past. Live in the moment but keep your eyes on the future, and keep on moving forward..." - Richie Sambora

  16. #40
    Atomic Punk RRvh1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by noise next door View Post
    It's funny, I walk into my local music store (that is quite massive), and Edward Van Halen is the most visually represented artist in that entire place.

    You look around and you see more physical evidence of his "presence" in the music instrument industry than any other player by a huge margin.

    There are so many guitars, amps, effects, TAB books, etc etc... it's nuts. They recently had one of those $32,000.00 Franky replicas in a glass case.

    But it's not cool to like VH, because they're not part of the critic's establishment. You can't tell anyone you like VH in those upper circles of "informed thoughtful musicians". I play guitar and song write in the Alt-rock world and 99% of the people I work with have no idea that 90% of the music I write with them has been completely inspired by the voicings and chord changes of mostly EVH and similar players, and I can't tell them that or they'll literally laugh out loud.

    For whatever reason this band has been lumped in with Poison and the like probably due to the big hair, over-the-top guitar solos, and especially the lyrical party themes.

    The average person has no clue how songwriting actually works.
    Yup.
    At my local Long & McQuade, there is an entire section dedicated to Ed's products. Wolfgangs, striped series, amps, pedals, EVH banners and logos galore...

    By comparison, there might be a few Ibanez Jem guitars or a single (used) SRV strat or a Hendrix tribute guitar. But those are just displayed like any other run of the mill axe. There's no fanfare or extra effort made to pass them off as being special or 'look at this!' in terms of marketing. The EVH brand is huge.
    "There's too many people on this basketball that's floating around the sun, who are too afraid to allow themselves to FEEL" - Edward Van Halen
    "Van Halen was never about the singer..." - a very wise fan.
    "Embrace the past. Live in the moment but keep your eyes on the future, and keep on moving forward..." - Richie Sambora

  17. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by RRvh1 View Post
    The EVH brand is huge.
    But that is a separate topic, dude.

  18. #42
    Atomic Punk RRvh1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlofeldsCat View Post
    But that is a separate topic, dude.
    I was quoting another poster who specifically mentioned Ed and his products at his local music store.
    "There's too many people on this basketball that's floating around the sun, who are too afraid to allow themselves to FEEL" - Edward Van Halen
    "Van Halen was never about the singer..." - a very wise fan.
    "Embrace the past. Live in the moment but keep your eyes on the future, and keep on moving forward..." - Richie Sambora

  19. #43
    Atomic Punk RRvh1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlofeldsCat View Post
    Fuck it, let's go controversial. And if we're gonna go controversial then we have to look beyond just the catalogue itself.



    1) Van Halen never attained the heights that their debut album suggested nor sustained the momentum and legacy that it delivered.

    2) The Van Hagar haters would be creaming themselves, and singing along to WCTBL, over Van Hagar if it was a separate, non-related band.

    3) The tunes this forum rates as legendary and quintessential (OFOTD LOC, EWS) are pretty shit.

    4) VH II is a major disappointment. More so even than Bernie Torme following Randy in Ozzy's lineup.



    5) Despite their debut album portending otherwise, Van Halen are far from being the greatest rock band ever.

    6) FSG is a fucking good tune and well-crafted despite Eddie struggling to complete it.

    7) Unchained is let down by everything that follows once then vocals kick in.

    8) Swagger does not exist. It's also abstract and subjective, thus it can be claimed by any fan of any band.

    9) It's also over-used on this forum.

    10) WCTBL is better than Girl Gone Bad.

    11) FSG is better than Girl Gone Bad.

    12) Inside is better than Girl Gone Bad.

    13) Pleasuredome is their most underrated song.

    14) Ed stopped being a 'great' in 1984. And stopped being 'top tier' in 1989.

    15) You're No Good is a fabulous cover. Up there with YRGM.

    16) Alex is just as much to blame for Ed's destruction of the band as Ed himself. Ed listens to his brother yet Al did nothing.

    17) Despite their historical relevance, VH will be long-forgotten (and soon) whilst their 70s and 80s peers will continue to echo down the decades to be remembered only by geeks guitar fans and music historians.

    18) VH are as much to blame for Sammy's decade-long hints of a reunion as he is - because they never shot him down and shut the door.. Their monk-esque silence leading to entire tomes on sites like this and You Tube.
    This ^^^ is a poster who totally 'gets' the gist of the thread, and replies in kind.
    Way to "hit the ground running", Blofeld!
    "There's too many people on this basketball that's floating around the sun, who are too afraid to allow themselves to FEEL" - Edward Van Halen
    "Van Halen was never about the singer..." - a very wise fan.
    "Embrace the past. Live in the moment but keep your eyes on the future, and keep on moving forward..." - Richie Sambora

  20. #44
    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    As much as Blofeld is wrong on almost everything, he is dead on about the lack of reverence for Ed in younger musicians.

    The current guitarist in our band is of my age, so he of course is familiar with Ed and gives him his due. However, the guy I played with before him, was in his 20's, and a reallly good player, not Blofeld good, but really good, and he knew NOTHING about Van Halen.

    Stones, Zeppelin, Who, Doors, yep, all of them. VH...nope. They are radioactive for some reason.
    Taylor Swift is nice to look at. Adele can sing.

    Emperor Brett - "I can't believe you guys are analyzing song-by-song Van Halen III? What next, analyzing the script of Stroker Ace looking for some shred of Citizen Kane?"

    David Lee Roth did the impossible. He made Van Halen better. Deal with it!

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  21. #45
    Atomic Punk ziggysmalls's Avatar
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    Well maybe if we are lucky, some group of 18 year old kids are looking at what Greta Van Fleet are doing and are pondering "what legendary band can we emulate and make money off of?"

    Maybe Van Halen will be that band?

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