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  1. #16
    Forum Frontman fudd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArtyBoy View Post
    On one hand I can understand that you have to bring the guitars in line with modern tastes and expectations. If someone tried to play anything from Van Halen to Metallica with a `59 Les Paul, they would be sorely disappointed. Much lower output pickups with no wax potting.

    But those goofy-ass G-force tuners! If you can't tune your guitar yourself, you shouldn't be playing! Then they came out with the 100th birthday models with that handwritten scrawl on the headstock that looked like a Sharpie. I was just looking at the 2017 SG's and they've removed the traditional "Rhythm-Treble" ring from the switch, and the knobs don't have the "Volume" and "Tone" reflectors. I wouldn't mind Grovers one bit, but they're locking tuners. I can see how it could make a string change fast, but...I dunno. I feel like locking tuners are for tremolo guitars, not stop tailpiece SG's.

    I've got four Gibsons, and I would say all but one have had some little issues. On the 1990 Les Paul, which I got brand new, the knobs were a bit too big for the pots and would rattle until I got new pots awhile back. On the 2000 Les Paul and 2004 SG the high E can slip off the neck, especially on the SG. I may have to get a nut cut sometime (my stadiums full of fans demand perfection). On the `00 Les Paul it seems like I have to have the action higher than I would like to avoid fret buzz, but maybe as I practice more the action will feel "lower." I've also got an SG Classic with the P-90's, and that one's flawless.

    My Fenders, including the ones branded Charvel and Jackson, Mexican and American, were ready to roll right away.

    Despite the issues, though, the #1 thing I was after with the Gibsons is intact: it's awesome as hell to lift the lid on the plush-lined case and see a classic Gibson guitar with shiny chrome looking up at you!
    I absolutely love my 2015 Gibson les paul traditional. It's the best sounding guitar I have.




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  3. #17
    Unchained KS 5150's Avatar
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    04.23.19 @ 10:51 AM
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    Quote Originally Posted by fudd View Post
    Sadly Gibson used to have this issue in the 80-90's period too. Don't really see how it's his fault. He ain't setting em up and making them.


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    Late '80s & '90s were something of a golden period, truth be told. Before Henry bought Gibson from Norlin in '86, there were lots of clunkers. My '89 Custom:

    Last edited by KS 5150; 09.06.17 at 06:18 PM.
    "People ask me how far I've come. And I tell them twelve feet: from the audience to the stage." - David Lee Roth

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  5. #18
    Atomic Punk RRvh1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fudd View Post
    I absolutely love my 2015 Gibson les paul traditional. It's the best sounding guitar I have.




    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    That's a beauty.
    "There's too many people on this basketball that's floating around the sun, who are too afraid to allow themselves to FEEL" - Edward Van Halen
    "Van Halen was never about the singer..." - A very wise fan.
    "Embrace the past. Live in the moment but keep your eyes on the future, and keep on moving forward..." - Richie Sambora

  6. #19
    Sinner's Swing!
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    01.08.19 @ 08:26 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by fudd View Post
    Sadly Gibson used to have this issue in the 80-90's period too. Don't really see how it's his fault. He ain't setting em up and making them.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    True, but the issues, and decision making ultimately lands on his shoulders.
    He's been cited as the key problem on most forums, many complaints by people who used to work under him.
    The largest issue it seems, and I think this is where it speaks to quality, is that he has really catered more to shareholders over musicians.
    Pushing out volume over quality. cutting back on tooling, upping quotas to the point that detail work suffered. Silly gimmicks, illegally acquiring endangered woods (which brought a raid by government officials). They deny it to this day, but other industry insiders claim he knew full well. They offered a good deal, and he pulled the trigger.

    Morale has reportedly been horrible for years.
    That said, I think when he first took over, he did some very good things, but like many CEO's in the corporate world, they lose their focus on what made them stand out from the competition, and tend to rest on their good/historical name.

    With Henry, it does seem to be the case. I've watched a few of his product launches for the next weird oddity that he is convinced will set the industry abuzz....But they are notoriously lackluster affairs.
    He's simply a man out of touch.
    To quote him on a news conference after the Federal raid. "This shutdown is costing me millions of dollars a day!"
    Not that the shutdown was "unfortunate", or that "we will cooperate with authorities", or that it has put people out of work in the short term.
    Nope! It's costing ME millions of dollars a day.

    That's a hell of a lot of guitars being sold per day...No? Ummmm....More like he watched the markets, and saw people bailing from the stock.
    Last edited by we die young; 09.07.17 at 11:09 AM.

  7. #20
    Eruption
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    04.22.19 @ 07:21 PM
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    Since we're talking about Gibson, check out this old f-holer I fixed up for an elderly couple from church.
    It's from the mid '30s;







    There was three splits on the front, two splits and a separation on the back, and all four back trusses were popped up.
    When it was done, and I strung it up, it played better and easier than any acoustic I've ever played.

    And no, I did not do any relic'ing, LOL!
    Why behave in public...if you're livin' on a playground !



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  9. #21
    Sinner's Swing!
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    Quote Originally Posted by turnbuckle View Post
    Since we're talking about Gibson, check out this old f-holer I fixed up for an elderly couple from church.
    It's from the mid '30s;







    There was three splits on the front, two splits and a separation on the back, and all four back trusses were popped up.
    When it was done, and I strung it up, it played better and easier than any acoustic I've ever played.

    And no, I did not do any relic'ing, LOL!
    That's sweet.
    I've always had a soft spot for old archtops.
    Gibson in particular.
    I think that's why people including myself have such passionate feelings toward where they are at today.
    Make no mistake...they are still capable of producing amazing instruments of exceptional quality, and I think that is the point. With the Gibson name, it should be a given that their guitars at the price they command should be of a certain quality bracket. That's what shocks people when they see the odd absolute unplayable turkey come out their doors.

    At worst, I would expect a finish flaw, or maybe a touch more adjusting to compensate for a slightly out of spec neck joint (they are still hand fit after all) or some oyher minor issue here or there...but some things I've seen you almost wouldn't accept from a late 80s Korean factory setup. Finish applied over sloppy glue joints, hardware very I'll fitted, missed screw holes in control cavities, cold solder joints, control cavities not even blown out with shop air prior to electronics being installed causing scratchy pots/selectors from dirt and dust getting into them, crooked tuners, the Gibson headstock logo even being significantly off center. (My SG has that)
    Rough binding installs, and marginal fret work.
    Obviously if you saw these issues in a store setting, you'd just move on to the next one, but in our online world, a lot of folks end up having to buy without the advantage of being able to play it first..."But hey...It's a Gibson! It's gotta be awesome!"

    Reality is, it's only as good as who put it together, and who signed off on the QC.
    It should be consistently better, but unfortunately not always the case.

    There are still some beauties that come out their doors.
    Last edited by we die young; 09.07.17 at 05:18 PM.

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  11. #22
    Unchained RogueNT's Avatar
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    04.21.19 @ 04:34 AM
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    Quote Originally Posted by we die young View Post
    True, but the issues, and decision making ultimately lands on his shoulders.
    He's been cited as the key problem on most forums, many complaints by people who used to work under him.
    The largest issue it seems, and I think this is where it speaks to quality, is that he has really catered more to shareholders over musicians.
    Pushing out volume over quality. cutting back on tooling, upping quotas to the point that detail work suffered. Silly gimmicks, illegally acquiring endangered woods (which brought a raid by government officials). They deny it to this day, but other industry insiders claim he knew full well. They offered a good deal, and he pulled the trigger.

    Morale has reportedly been horrible for years.
    That said, I think when he first took over, he did some very good things, but like many CEO's in the corporate world, they lose their focus on what made them stand out from the competition, and tend to rest on their good/historical name.

    With Henry, it does seem to be the case. I've watched a few of his product launches for the next weird oddity that he is convinced will set the industry abuzz....But they are notoriously lackluster affairs.
    He's simply a man out of touch.
    To quote him on a news conference after the Federal raid. "This shutdown is costing me millions of dollars a day!"
    Not that the shutdown was "unfortunate", or that "we will cooperate with authorities", or that it has put people out of work in the short term.
    Nope! It's costing ME millions of dollars a day.

    That's a hell of a lot of guitars being sold per day...No? Ummmm....More like he watched the markets, and saw people bailing from the stock.
    ^^^^THIS x1000. I live in Nashville and know several current and former Gibson employees. Henry may not be on the assembly line, but the blame for the shit quality and the ridiculous "innovations" lie squarely at his feet for exactly the reasons listed here. He may have saved Gibson from the brink in '86 but he has driven them right back there with his obsession to turn Gibson into a "lifestyle company" and his rampant acquisitions that have Gibson stretched so thin they can't even pay their suppliers.
    Last edited by RogueNT; 09.12.17 at 08:06 PM.

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  13. #23
    Atomic Punk
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    04.23.19 @ 10:21 AM
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    Gibson guitars could be facing bankruptcy



    http://www.nme.com/news/music/gibson...nkrupt-2244823
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  14. #24
    Atomic Punk MF5150's Avatar
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    10.07.18 @ 06:44 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Rover View Post
    Gibson guitars could be facing bankruptcy



    http://www.nme.com/news/music/gibson...nkrupt-2244823
    Good. Hopefully an investor can come in, buy it for cheap and start over at making this company a worthy brand again. Work on producing simple, quality instruments that bring what worked in 1959 up into the 21st century.

    Henry J needs to be removed because the guy is a fucking nut job. Flushing a once proud American company down the shitter.

    And for the love of Zeus' butthole, stop out pricing 95% of the market from buying your products. And if you are going to do that, change the god damned headstock of the Epiphones. Make em like the Japanese versions. Identical as the US models only they say Epiphone. Theres only one reason why they dont and it's because everybody would just buy Epiphones. The current headstock is an abomination and they know it.

    And remove the heel joint and headstock break angle. Does not make a fucks worth of difference in tone.

    And put double cream PAFs in everything.
    My man, when you are fantasizing, don't go for attainable, you can get attainable at the local Applebee's. - Dave's Dreidel

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  16. #25
    Baluchitherium Jedi McFly's Avatar
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    Yeah, I don't understand how Gibson have fucked up so badly. Fender has been killing it. It's simple, maintain a good range of guitars based on your classics at multiple price points. Keep your roots in the traditional features but don't be afraid of sensical comfort features - what I'm saying is compound radius or stainless frets are good, robo-tuners are BAD. If you're going to take a risk on a new design do so in a way that doesn't infringe on the rest of your lineup.

    And like MF5150 said, definitely ditch that awful Epiphone headstock.

  17. #26
    Eruption bjk's Avatar
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    04.23.19 @ 06:27 PM
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    That’s what was cool about the Epi Explorers and Flying V. They had the same headstocks as their Gibson counterparts. I used to have an old Epi ‘58 Korina Explorer. Wish I still had it. It was a damn good guitar I got at a Musicians Friend scratch & dent store for about $200. All it had was a busted toggle switch. I get why Gibson doesn’t use the “open book” headstock on the Epi line. It’s an incentive to go with the “real thing”. I will say, the faded series are pretty solid USA made guitars in the $500-$600 range.

  18. #27
    Forum Frontman fudd's Avatar
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    Mitch is right. They’re pricing themselves out of the market with so many models. Like it’s about 2700 for A STANDARD!!’ You can get damn near 2 American fenders for that. Just too much. I have a 2015 and it’s damn phenomenal. But it was still 2200. Just lower prices.


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  19. #28
    Good Enough CalFB's Avatar
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    04.23.19 @ 04:49 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by MF5150 View Post
    His stories have bounced around more than Sofia Vergara's tetas in a wagon driving through Monument Valley.
    Nice visual, thanks
    Most rock journalism is people who can't write, interviewing people who can't talk, for people who can't read. - Frank Zappa

  20. #29
    Forum Frontman fudd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jedi McFly View Post
    Yeah, I don't understand how Gibson have fucked up so badly. Fender has been killing it. It's simple, maintain a good range of guitars based on your classics at multiple price points. Keep your roots in the traditional features but don't be afraid of sensical comfort features - what I'm saying is compound radius or stainless frets are good, robo-tuners are BAD. If you're going to take a risk on a new design do so in a way that doesn't infringe on the rest of your lineup.

    And like MF5150 said, definitely ditch that awful Epiphone headstock.
    I love my 2015. Robots and all. Super easy to use


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  22. #30
    Romeo Delight
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    04.22.19 @ 08:21 AM
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    Quote Originally Posted by fudd View Post
    Mitch is right. They’re pricing themselves out of the market with so many models. Like it’s about 2700 for A STANDARD!!’ You can get damn near 2 American fenders for that. Just too much. I have a 2015 and it’s damn phenomenal. But it was still 2200. Just lower prices.
    If you wade through all the BS, you can still find decent USA models at somewhat reasonable prices, you just have to look. There is a pretty cool Guitar Center only "Trad Pro IV" model that is no frills that I have seen sold as low as $1499-$1699 if you wait for GC incentives. (it's currently $1999)

    I bought a 2016 and I love it. Locking grovers but no gforce

    http://www.guitarcenter.com/Gibson/L...tric-Guitar.gc

 

 

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