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  1. #1
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    Default San Francisco, CA, ballot measure set to lower voting age to 16

    So in the state that just raised the smoking age to 21 despite evidence it won't do anything to curb underage smoking, San Francisco, at the forefront of what eventually goes state-wide, will allow its voters to decide if 16 and 17-yr olds can vote.

    To be clear, if this passes, in San Francisco, at 16 you can drive a car and vote. At 17 you can see a rated-R movie. At 18 you must register for the military draft and you can consent to sex. At 21, you can drink and smoke. That makes sense.

    Supervisors OK ballot measure to lower SF voting age to 16
    By Emily GreenMay 10, 2016 Updated: May 10, 2016 9:02pm

    A charter amendment to lower the voting age to 16 that will appear on the November ballot would put San Francisco at the forefront of expanding voting rights at a time when some other governments around the country have implemented increasingly restrictive voting laws.

    “Regardless of whether this measure is approved or not, (San Francisco) is starting a trend that will happen across the country, where cities like ours will consider whether young people can vote,” Supervisor John Avalos, who championed the measure, said at Tuesday’s Board of Supervisors meeting. The measure would allow people as young as 16 to vote in city elections.

    The board voted 9-2 to place the measure on the ballot, reflecting a change of heart by several supervisors who initially indicated they were opposed to the measure.

    Some of them changed their minds after a hearing last week during which dozens of young people testified in support of the proposal, which is also unanimously supported by the San Francisco Board of Education. And they were swayed by the idea that lowering the voting age gets people involved in the electoral process earlier, which in turn could make them habitual voters — a step critical to improving the country’s low turnout rates.

    Bucking national trend

    But some supervisors also pointed to the rise of Donald Trump, the presumptive Republican presidential nominee, as evidence that adults are no more informed than a 16-year-old.

    “I don’t think 18-year-olds and older have a lot to brag about, and I actually think if you gave 16- and 17-year-olds a chance ... they would do a lot better than we are,” Supervisor David Campos said.

    Lowering the voting age runs counter to laws in many states to implement strict voter ID requirements and limit the time frame during which people can vote.

    A Kansas law that took effect in 2013 requires residents to provide proof of citizenship when they register to vote. It is one of four states with such a law. A 2013 North Carolina law eliminated residents’ ability to register to vote and cast a ballot on the same day and also cut early voting by seven days.

    In 2016, 17 states will have new voting restrictions in place for the presidential election, according to the nonpartisan Brennan Center for Justice in New York. The laws range from new ID requirements to registration restrictions and a shorter time frame for early voting, according to the center.

    Such measures are in stark relief to the charter amendment to go before San Francisco voters in November. If it passes, San Francisco could become the first major U.S. city to lower the voting age
    .
    Council members in Washington, D.C., are considering legislation to allow 16- and 17-year-olds to vote in federal elections, a measure even more radical than San Francisco’s. Two other municipalities have lowered the voting age in local elections to 16 — Takoma Park and Hyattsville, both in Maryland.

    “When this first came up, my initial, knee-jerk reaction was ... not so favorable,” Supervisor Scott Wiener said Tuesday. He changed his mind after reading more about it. “There are so many 16- and 17-year-olds who will be passionate, intelligent and thoughtful voters.”

    Some opposition

    While it was clear from the outset at Tuesday’s meeting that the measure had the eight votes it needed to go on the November ballot, two supervisors, Mark Farrell and Malia Cohen, voted against it.

    Farrell said current laws create a patchwork system for young people: They can drive at 16, vote at 18, and purchase tobacco at 21. Gov. Jerry Brown signed legislation earlier this month raising the age to purchase tobacco.

    “The age limits we have imposed are incredibly inconsistent and, truthfully, just don’t make sense from a macro perspective,” he said.

    Cohen echoed that sentiment. “We want to lower the age to vote to 16 but we are raising the age to purchase tobacco to 21,” she said.

    She also said she was worried that lowering the voting age would give rise to more 16- and 17-year-olds being treated as adults in the criminal justice system.

    “It’s a very slippery slope when we make the argument that if one can vote, one should be able to stand trial,” Cohen said.

    Supervisor Jane Kim countered that the fact that 16- and 17-year-olds can be tried as adults is “all the more reason they should be able to vote and have a say in our criminal-justice policies.”

    Practically speaking, the measure would impact a small percentage of possible voters — around 11,000 youth out of 450,000 registered voters in San Francisco . . .

  2. #2
    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
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    I'm OK with 16, I'm OK with 21. 18 seems the most reasonable though.

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  3. #3
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by It's Mike View Post
    I'm OK with 16, I'm OK with 21. 18 seems the most reasonable though.

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    The problem I more have is that we have all these different ages. Yeah, at 16 you can be tried as an adult, but you also can't be trusted to have a glass of wine with dinner...yet you can vote when you probably haven't even taken American Government in high school yet (that is your senior year)?

    We should just make it all 18.

  4. #4
    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lovemachine97(Version 2) View Post
    The problem I more have is that we have all these different ages. Yeah, at 16 you can be tried as an adult, but you also can't be trusted to have a glass of wine with dinner...yet you can vote when you probably haven't even taken American Government in high school yet (that is your senior year)?

    We should just make it all 18.
    Not the worst idea.

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  5. #5
    Atomic Punk CaboChris's Avatar
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    21 for everything.

    Enlist in military...vote...drink.

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  7. #6
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    Age of consent 21 too?


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  8. #7
    Atomic Punk CaboChris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lovemachine97(Version 2) View Post
    Age of consent 21 too?


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    Yep.

    16, 17, 18, and 19 are still too young imo. I'll even go a year lower, to 20.

    If you have the word "teen" in your age...you're too young imo.

  9. #8
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    Man, college campuses would be the hotbed of crime if you were King!


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  10. #9
    Atomic Punk CaboChris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lovemachine97(Version 2) View Post
    Man, college campuses would be the hotbed of crime if you were King!


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    They already are.

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  12. #10
    Atomic Punk ziggysmalls's Avatar
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    Nobody should vote at 16. Sorry you can't even drive a car cross country. You simply are not responsible enough to vote in an election. One where the vast majority of issues don't concern you because you are a minor. You can't even use a credit card to go into life long debt.

    Just make it all 18 or 21

    Freaking idiots

  13. #11
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    Yeah, there is a part of me that thinks you should at least have a high school degree. I have a real problem giving an equal vote to someone who has never taken a government or econ class in high school. I mean you should know the basics. Of course, that is a slippery poll tax of a slope, so it won't happen, but maybe we could all agree on 19?

    One of the things that happens on high school campuses is that kids grow up with absentee parents, and when they hit 18, they are responsible for their education and can sign themselves out of school. I see it happen. At 19 you should be out of high school and in college or in your first job. If you can vote and go to war, you should be able to smoke and drink.

    One theory I think has merit is that the binge drinking on college campuses is made worse due to it being illegal for those under 21 to drink. Just like during prohibition, when it is illegal, you're more likely to get drunker faster.
    Last edited by lovemachine97(Version 2); 05.12.16 at 09:48 AM.

  14. #12
    Atomic Punk CaboChris's Avatar
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    San Francisco. I'm shocked.

    This is so transparent. Basically, it's "let's get em young". Progressives are starting to get desperate when they start advocating for change, like this.

    Most 16 year olds are dolts who can't even change a tire on a car, yet SF wants to give them a vote?

    This is about trying to hurry along progressive ideology, that is not moving fast enough for their liking.

    It's like the minimum wage argument. Why 16 and not 14?

  15. #13
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    In 20 years in San Francisco you'll be able to vote at age 6 but not smoke until you hit 100. There won't be a minimum or a maximum wage, but a wage everyone makes for every job. There will be one set of laws for natural-born citizens and another for immigrants. The only energy used will be from people riding bicycles.

    Maybe the left and right can come to a compromise. Right to life for fetuses except in extreme cases--as long as the fetus gets to vote!

 

 

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