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  1. #1
    Atomic Punk
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    Default The Cost of Cancer Drugs (CBS 60 Minutes)

    http://www.cbsnews.com/news/cost-of-...l-health-care/

    Dr. Kantarjian says one thing that has to change is the law that prevents Medicare from negotiating for lower prices.

    Dr. Hagop Kantarjian: This is unique to the United States. If you look anywhere in the world, there are negotiations. Either by the government or by different regulatory bodies to regulate the price of the drug. And this is why the prices are 50 percent to 80 percent lower anywhere in the world compared to the United States.

    Lesley Stahl: Fifty percent to 80 percent?

    Dr. Hagop Kantarjian: Fifty percent to 80 percent.

    Lesley Stahl: The same drug?

    Dr. Hagop Kantarjian: Same drug. American patients end up paying two to three times more for the same drug compared to Canadians or Europeans or Australians and others.
    "Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack. -- Gen. George S. Patton

  2. #2
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    12.17.17 @ 07:25 AM
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    This tells me that Americans could pay less if "everyone else" paid more.

    Are cancer drugs different than other drugs? Basically it costs hundreds of millions, if not a billion dollars for every drug brought to market, and then you have ten years before it goes generic (or does that not happen with cancer drugs?). If there is no profit in the drug, they aren't going to spend to develop it.

    However, we could cut a lot of cost by drastically reforming the FDA and the approval process.

  3. #3
    Baluchitherium Ted Van Halen's Avatar
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    Default The Cost of Cancer Drugs (CBS 60 Minutes)

    They do go generic. One of the ones I was on was generic. I don't recall it's cost but it was the cheaper of the two. The one I'm on now is generic too but it costs same as the brand name one before. They've got you coming and going.
    -TVH-


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    What is government itself but the greatest of all reflections on human nature? - James Madison


    Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the Government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian. - Henry Ford

  4. #4
    Gird your loins Daisy Hill's Avatar
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    12.16.17 @ 07:41 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by lovemachine97(Version 2) View Post
    This tells me that Americans could pay less if "everyone else" paid more.

    Are cancer drugs different than other drugs? Basically it costs hundreds of millions, if not a billion dollars for every drug brought to market, and then you have ten years before it goes generic (or does that not happen with cancer drugs?). If there is no profit in the drug, they aren't going to spend to develop it.

    However, we could cut a lot of cost by drastically reforming the FDA and the approval process.
    the cost of developing new drugs...(research, testing, approvals and marketing) with only a limited time to market before the patent expires is why we are entering into a post antibiotic age. It takes a billion dollars to develop the drug, and then you have to recoup costs and make your profit in 20 years. It's a pretty bad business plan and keeps the cost of new drugs high. Pfizer has admitted that although they made their name on their expertise at developing new antibiotics, there is just no profit for investors and they closed their facility in Connecticut....The profit for drug companies is in chronic diseases...they need drugs that people need to take for the rest of their lives ( or at least 20 years) to recover costs...diabetes, high cholesterol, eczema... those kinds of chronic illness get all the play

    not much profit in curing someone....or in wiping out an infection.

  5. #5
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daisy Hill View Post
    the cost of developing new drugs...(research, testing, approvals and marketing) with only a limited time to market before the patent expires is why we are entering into a post antibiotic age. It takes a billion dollars to develop the drug, and then you have to recoup costs and make your profit in 20 years. It's a pretty bad business plan and keeps the cost of new drugs high. Pfizer has admitted that although they made their name on their expertise at developing new antibiotics, there is just no profit for investors and they closed their facility in Connecticut....The profit for drug companies is in chronic diseases...they need drugs that people need to take for the rest of their lives ( or at least 20 years) to recover costs...diabetes, high cholesterol, eczema... those kinds of chronic illness get all the play

    not much profit in curing someone....or in wiping out an infection.
    Of course, chronic is better than dead, but point taken. Actually, there is a near cure for type II diabetes: gastric bypass surgery. We used to think that weight loss resulting from the surgery was reversing diabetes, but it actually turns out that the piece of the duodenum that is cut out causes over 80% of patients' bodies to "reset" and begin producing insulin again.

    My sister-in-law got it after developing gestational diabetes. Being a doctor, she did a lot of research before settling on one of the top hospitals in the country for gastric bypass. She was cured within a year (and lost 100lbs).

    My mom was on 20 units of insulin a day. She also was not obese. She otherwise would not be a candidate for gastric bypass. Less than a year later she was completely off insulin. On my sister-in-law's recommendation, my mom went to the same place. My wife's father also got it done and is off all other medication and his insulin was cut by 80%. So he wasn't "cured," but much better off than he was. But over 80% are cured.

    Point being that a cure doesn't necessarily have to come from the pharmaceutical industry.

    That said, I think we have two problems. One, limiting a company's profit to 20 years or whatever it is means they need to recoup their costs AND profit in that short amount of time, which inflates the cost of the drug. The most recent research from 1995-2007 shows that the cost of bringing a drug to market is now $2.56 billion, up from $800 million (1983-1994).

    The other problem is that 90% of that cost comes from Phase III trials with the FDA--and the FDA can even ask for more trials if they want. I believe there is already a cure for the most common form of blindness, but the FDA asked for a 4th trial and the money ran out. So a bunch of people who could see again or for the first time can't because an unelected government entity says they need a 4th trial.

    In my utopia, the FDA would be voluntary, like UL for electronics, and other private entities like UL (Consumer Reports, etc.) could apply to be sanctioned to compete with the FDA for approvals.

    However, that's pie in the sky, so what we should do is have conditional approval after phase II, allowing consumers to choose whether or not to try a drug before phase III. If the sickest of the sick who won't survive past phase III decide to pay for the drug after conditional approval, that could pay for a significant amount of the phase III costs, which then makes profit over 20 years much easier. Better scenario--eliminate the time limit and allow for conditional approval after phase II.
    Last edited by lovemachine97(Version 2); 07.08.15 at 03:44 PM.

  6. #6
    Gird your loins Daisy Hill's Avatar
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    12.16.17 @ 07:41 PM
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    actually I've seen that info about the gastric by pass and type II diabetes. I've also seen some research about fasting and "resetting" the metabolism. I think the research was in Sweden and replicated in the UK. 800 calories a day for 30 days.

    I actually saw something similar in that a friend went on a "protein sparing" fast for weight loss in the 90's...the same thing that Oprah did. and within weeks he was completely off insulin.

    I wonder if the two things are related and that it is more the fast after the surgery than the surgery itself...I think they said the theory is that with extreme fasting the body quickly uses the easiest obtainable fat stores..those around the internal organs and that is what "resets" the metabolism.

 

 

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