Billboard Author (Chuck Klosterman): The Irresponsible "Journalist" - Page 24
Follow us on...
Follow us on Twitter Follow us on Facebook Watch us on YouTube
Register
Likes Likes:  0
Save
Page 24 of 24 FirstFirst ... 1421222324
Results 346 to 350 of 350
  1. #346
    Forum Frontman
    It's Mike's Avatar
    Join Date
    03.26.06
    Age
    46
    Location
    Vaughan, Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    44,940
    Posts Per Day
    8.62
    Favorite VH Album

    like them all, no favourite
    Last Online

    Yesterday @ 09:01 PM
    Likes (Given)
    38
    Likes (Received)
    148
    Thanks (Given)
    2505
    Thanks (Received)
    12631

    Achievements:
    Master PraiserSupremely-LikedElite Daily PosterVHLinks Proud!200,000 VHL Life PointsOld Guard

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by sickman View Post
    While admirable not realistic. Put it this way. I run a business. I'm responsible for keeping my business running. I bust my balls here 12 hours a day and it's on my mind all the time. Yes, I need all of my employees to do their job to get my product out the door but I do not pay everybody equally. Why should a band, which is a small business, be treated any differently. If it's up to Ed to come up with the song ideas and start a majority of the writing process on his own while the other guys actually take time off and making hot sauce than why on earth would they deserve an equal share. It's just not practical.
    I don't think many people would disagree with you on that. Hell Mike and Sammy clearly don't judging by the Chickenfoot credits and by different quotes they've had in the past.

  2. #347
    Sinner's Swing!
    Jack Panama's Avatar
    Join Date
    03.04.08
    Age
    42
    Location
    Great State of Deseret
    Posts
    787
    Posts Per Day
    0.17
    Last Online

    Yesterday @ 12:35 PM
    Likes (Given)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0
    Thanks (Given)
    413
    Thanks (Received)
    295

    Achievements:
    Padawan PraiserWell-Liked5,000 VHL Life PointsOld Guard

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by sickman View Post
    While admirable not realistic. Put it this way. I run a business. I'm responsible for keeping my business running. I bust my balls here 12 hours a day and it's on my mind all the time. Yes, I need all of my employees to do their job to get my product out the door but I do not pay everybody equally. Why should a band, which is a small business, be treated any differently. If it's up to Ed to come up with the song ideas and start a majority of the writing process on his own while the other guys actually take time off and making hot sauce than why on earth would they deserve an equal share. It's just not practical.
    Agreed, but that's not how VH decided to do it. They said all for one, one for all. With every album, they could have renegotiated that. They didn't.

    It wasn't until 2004 when Ed had finally had enough, and demanded that Mike sign away his share.

    Now in your business, are you still carrying grudges of how much you paid one of your employees 30 years ago, to the point that you'd demand, comparatively, that they either pay you back or forfeit a percentage of their pension?

    Also, it's a little different because YOU own YOUR business. Van Halen however was a band, in which initially they only used Ed's and Alex's name, but those two alone didn't OWN the band. They weren't the CEO's. They play that role now. But in the early days, they didn't see it like that. It was the 4 of them, as equal partners.

    If Ed and Alex wanted to own the band, and have Roth and Mike as employees rather than partners, then they should have negotiated that when it started, not 30 years later. Instead, they cry about Mike's Porsche that he bought based on the arrangement that they all agreed to.
    Last edited by Jack Panama; 06.25.15 at 06:51 AM.

  3. #348
    Runnin' With The Devil
    brownnation's Avatar
    Join Date
    12.27.08
    Posts
    1,543
    Posts Per Day
    0.37
    Last Online

    02.18.16 @ 03:10 PM
    Likes (Given)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0
    Thanks (Given)
    3
    Thanks (Received)
    3

    Default

    Songwriting credit is complicated. Music is a business and in the case of bands like VH it's big business. So there is a personal way to look at songwriting, but how do you translate that into a business arrangement?

    I actually think VH was somewhat in the minority in doing the 25/25/25/25 thing. My guess is that was born out of their desire to distribute money somewhat equally among the members, especially for Alex. But also it was probably the recognition that everyone had their role in the beginning, and that just because it wasn't songwriting, doesn't mean the contributions of a guy like Michael Anthony weren't invaluable. By Dave's account he and MA humped and hustled to procure equipment, advertise, make a great live show, etc. etc. This frees up EVH to do his things and give him an outlet for his creativity. Seems a little crazy to me they would do the even split thing based on this, but that's what they decided to do (my guess is it had more to do with "hey if we are giving equal to Eddie's brother, and Dave writes the lyrics/melodies, then we better just make it even all around").

    But you can split the business anyway you want and it may have nothing to do with who actually wrote the damn things. White producers ripped off 100% the royalties of early black artists. Col Parker got Elvis Presley a few songwriting credits simply to funnel more money his way even though he never wrote anything in his life. Also, a song could be credited to the artist(s) on an album, or publicly, and there can be behind the scenes legal deals to ghost writers, producers, secondary band member contributions, etc.

    But as far as who actually "wrote" the song, that's a more complicated philosophical question, that in my opinion can only be answered on a case to case basis, song by song, on a continuum. To use VH for an example, as some people have mentioned Alex and Eddie jam. Now, the genesis of an idea of whether Eddie brought in a riff and they started jamming or Alex laid down a groove initially and Eddie wrote over that, I believe has a bearing on songwriting. Alex would be literally and figuratively instrumental in the creation of a song if his initial contribution was inextricable from the creation of that song. On the other hand, if he's just laying down a basic beat to what Eddie brought to the table, I don't think there's much argument to be made that he contributed to the song writing credit.

    Another thing to consider both legally and philosophically is that an instrumentalists contribution to songwriting is so unique to the particular track and performance, then they deserve songwriting credit, whether they were initially given it or not. In other words, if the bassist and drummer simply play over pre-written changes and create a musical backdrop for a composition, then they are not considered to have contributed to the songwriting process. But, if they come up with parts that are so unique (and I think this gets fuzzy), then they have a case for songwriting credit. I'll use Alex as an example again. There's a big difference between creating and performing the amazing drum-driven intro and structure of the song "Hot for Teacher" and laying down a basic beat for "Don't Tell Me What Love Can Do". Hypothetically, if he were to have to make a case for songwriting credit, he'd have a very strong case in the former example and not a chance in hell in the latter.

    Like I said though, this all gets very fuzzy and really people can divvy up credit both personally and legally however they see fit. I know you can make a case for yourself as a player that you contributed to the songwriting and get more royalties, but in the case of MA, they can't go back and take his away (obviously they can renegotiate like they did). If there is an expert on some of this stuff, I would love to hear about it. I know just enough about this to get myself into trouble, but if anyone out there can affirm or refute what I've written here, I'd love your take.
    Anonymous for fear of fatwa

  4. #349
    Top Of The World
    DFVH5150's Avatar
    Join Date
    03.24.04
    Location
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Posts
    4,735
    Posts Per Day
    0.80
    Favorite VH Album

    5150
    Favorite VH Song

    Dreams
    Last Online

    Today @ 01:30 AM
    Likes (Given)
    111
    Likes (Received)
    46
    Thanks (Given)
    3549
    Thanks (Received)
    1392


    Premium Member
    Achievements:
    Master PraiserWell-LikedVHLinks Proud!25,000 VHL Life PointsKnight Of Da Roundtable

    Default

    Chuck Klosterman molests collies.
    Dave
    VH FOREVER!!!!!!!

    Stats:
    BECAME PSYCHO FAN: 12/91
    VAN HALEN W/DAVE: 9x
    VAN HALEN W/SAMMY: 8x
    VAN HALEN W/GARY: 5x
    CHICKENFOOT/THE CIRCLE: 9x
    DAVE SOLO: 14x
    SAMMY SOLO: 15x (W/MONTROSE 1x, @CABO WABO CANTINA 1x)
    GARY/EXTREME/TRIBE OF JUDAH/HURTSMILE: 7x
    MET: Sammy 1x, Dave almost 1x, Gary 2x

  5. #350
    Top Of The World
    DFVH5150's Avatar
    Join Date
    03.24.04
    Location
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Posts
    4,735
    Posts Per Day
    0.80
    Favorite VH Album

    5150
    Favorite VH Song

    Dreams
    Last Online

    Today @ 01:30 AM
    Likes (Given)
    111
    Likes (Received)
    46
    Thanks (Given)
    3549
    Thanks (Received)
    1392


    Premium Member
    Achievements:
    Master PraiserWell-LikedVHLinks Proud!25,000 VHL Life PointsKnight Of Da Roundtable

    Default

    By the way, no colostomy bag jokes? There's gotta be one in these huge threads...
    Dave
    VH FOREVER!!!!!!!

    Stats:
    BECAME PSYCHO FAN: 12/91
    VAN HALEN W/DAVE: 9x
    VAN HALEN W/SAMMY: 8x
    VAN HALEN W/GARY: 5x
    CHICKENFOOT/THE CIRCLE: 9x
    DAVE SOLO: 14x
    SAMMY SOLO: 15x (W/MONTROSE 1x, @CABO WABO CANTINA 1x)
    GARY/EXTREME/TRIBE OF JUDAH/HURTSMILE: 7x
    MET: Sammy 1x, Dave almost 1x, Gary 2x

 

 

Similar Threads

  1. "Say Uncle," "You Wear It Well," "River Wide" and "Left for Dead."
    By extreme red roth in forum VH Songs/Albums/Videos
    Replies: 55
    Last Post: 06.29.18, 07:08 AM
  2. Replies: 36
    Last Post: 02.21.12, 09:44 PM
  3. VH Book Author Comments On Leaked "Page Six" Excerpt
    By Apocalypso in forum Main VH Discussion
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 06.29.07, 07:41 AM
  4. Chuck Klosterman
    By extreme red roth in forum VH Fans Meeting Place (Non-Music)
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 10.26.05, 11:05 PM
  5. Interesting bug in the "author" section of some people's posts
    By UnleashVH in forum VHLinks Feedback & Troubleshooting
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 05.30.02, 08:54 AM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •