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  1. #46681
    Baluchitherium
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    09.18.19 @ 06:31 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by Get The Show On The Road View Post
    Was just reading about this when this statement caught my eye:

    "According to California Attorney General and trump foe Xavier Becerra, "While the White House clings to the past, automakers and American families embrace cleaner cars. The evidence is irrefutable: today's clean car standards are achievable, science-based, and a boon for hardworking American families and public health."

    If this were remotely true then California wouldn't need to have their own standards because their citizens wouldn't buy cars that didn't meet them on their own volition.

    The fact is that most people I know want fuel efficient vehicles. But they also want to be able to afford them. As usual facts are overlooked. I didn't buy my Toyota Tundra V8 because I like getting 15 miles to the gallon. I bought it because I needed something with that kind of power to haul my 30 foot, 6500 lb trailer. Provide me a truck that gets 50 miles a gallon that can do the same and costs the same and I'd gladly make that purchase.

    The reality is you can't. So quit trying to tell me "we have the technology" because if we did those vehicles would be being produced.
    My buddy just bought an F150 w/ the 2.7 ecoboost and gets about 10liters per 100KM for fuel economy; which is damn impressive for a truck.

    Auto makers need to realize that China is largely driving the car (so to speak) for environmental regulations for autos; which itself is ironic. They're the largest car market, and have required that cars be zero emissions by (I think) 2025. So, GM, FCA and Ford can cling to current North American standards all they want -but they'll be losing out on a MASSIVE market while doing so. Instead of bitching about the standards and paying lobbyists to try and stall the inevitable - get w/ the program and invest those $'s into R&D.

    Ford is doing it, GM is doing it, doubtful that FCA is.

    As for affordability in cars, the Model 3, standard range plus works out to about the cost of a Camry or Accord. People don't look at all the costs - but thems the facts. As I own a Model S, and came from a hybrid (so pretty fuel efficient) - factoring what my electricity bill is vs what my gas bill was for the same KM's driven - I'm saving about $200 a month.

    The biggest thing I'm wondering is why California (and other states) are not upset that The Donald is overriding their legislation. I thought each state was able to do their own thing? Maybe I'm wrong though.
    Winners come and go; legends are forever.

  2. #46682
    Sinner's Swing! BlindtotheWorld's Avatar
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    09.18.19 @ 01:36 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by Get The Show On The Road View Post

    If this were remotely true then California wouldn't need to have their own standards because their citizens wouldn't buy cars that didn't meet them on their own volition.
    Exactly.
    ]"Problem is Van Halen doesn't miss you. Or me. Or any of us." - Little Dreamer

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  4. #46683
    Atomic Punk Get The Show On The Road's Avatar
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    09.18.19 @ 05:40 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott View Post
    My buddy just bought an F150 w/ the 2.7 ecoboost and gets about 10liters per 100KM for fuel economy; which is damn impressive for a truck.

    Auto makers need to realize that China is largely driving the car (so to speak) for environmental regulations for autos; which itself is ironic. They're the largest car market, and have required that cars be zero emissions by (I think) 2025. So, GM, FCA and Ford can cling to current North American standards all they want -but they'll be losing out on a MASSIVE market while doing so. Instead of bitching about the standards and paying lobbyists to try and stall the inevitable - get w/ the program and invest those $'s into R&D.

    Ford is doing it, GM is doing it, doubtful that FCA is.

    As for affordability in cars, the Model 3, standard range plus works out to about the cost of a Camry or Accord. People don't look at all the costs - but thems the facts. As I own a Model S, and came from a hybrid (so pretty fuel efficient) - factoring what my electricity bill is vs what my gas bill was for the same KM's driven - I'm saving about $200 a month.

    The biggest thing I'm wondering is why California (and other states) are not upset that The Donald is overriding their legislation. I thought each state was able to do their own thing? Maybe I'm wrong though.
    LOL, I'm trying to do the math on the F150 you mentioned and I'm coming up with about 25 miles per gallon. Yeah, that's pretty damn good for a full size pickup.
    The only genre I really know is Van Halen.

  5. #46684
    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    09.18.19 @ 01:32 PM
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    You guys have it wrong. US automakers have the technology, but, they would rather keep it in their pockets and go bankrupt instead of get them out to market.
    If I don't respond to you it means I have you on ignore, which means you are a douchenozzle.

    Emperor Brett - "I can't believe you guys are analyzing song-by-song Van Halen III? What next, analyzing the script of Stroker Ace looking for some shred of Citizen Kane?"

    David Lee Roth did the impossible. He made Van Halen better. Deal with it!

    A man's rights rests in three boxes: the ballot box, the jury box, and the cartridge box

    Hurricane Halen - Let's all gingery touch our sword tips!!!

  6. #46685
    Top Of The World JustDave's Avatar
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    Is that because they're in cahoots with the oil companies?

  7. #46686
    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustDave View Post
    Is that because they're in cahoots with the oil companies?
    No. The Alien occupiers that want to keep our technology levels low enough for us to remain docile and compliant.
    If I don't respond to you it means I have you on ignore, which means you are a douchenozzle.

    Emperor Brett - "I can't believe you guys are analyzing song-by-song Van Halen III? What next, analyzing the script of Stroker Ace looking for some shred of Citizen Kane?"

    David Lee Roth did the impossible. He made Van Halen better. Deal with it!

    A man's rights rests in three boxes: the ballot box, the jury box, and the cartridge box

    Hurricane Halen - Let's all gingery touch our sword tips!!!

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  9. #46687
    Good Enough
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    09.18.19 @ 07:30 PM
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    The fact of the matter is, the vast majority of large car/truck/suv owners at least in major cities aren't using such vehicles to haul goods, tow work trailers or even recreational stuff - they're buying and driving them because they're big, comfortable and(at least perceived) safer fucking cars. Comfort and perception of status, etc over practicality rules the day here.

    Speaking only for myself, I own two hybrids, a 2014 Chevy Volt (which I about another year from unloading) and a 2018 Honda Clarity (which is actually pretty nice). I'd love to own a big ol' roomy SUV for room and comfort (and about $10k more new) but from Huntington Beach, my wife drives back and forth to Burbank and I drive drive daily south to Lake Forest (x2 per day) - thus between the two of us, we spend about 200 miles on SoCal freeways *per day* mon-fri. My wife fills her car about twice a month, I fill mine (The Volt)about once a week and both cars have itty bitty gas tanks, about 7-9 gallons. We charge our cars overnight, something made possible by doing solar panels on the roof about 5 years ago and installing a charging station on the side of the house. Just about everyone I know does serious driving in SoCal, but the majority have big gas hogs w/giant tanks and *always* bitch when gas prices spike, which in CA is all the time.

    Thus, I don't have a problem with the Feds or even the otherwise fucked up state of CA trying to push the envelope on cleaner, more economical cars. But I am amused that CA's typically grandstanding politicians are throwing a hissy fit about the Feds relaxing standards when the auto industry is basically fine following the previous standards set in place knowing more economical cars especially with a lower reliance on gas is the trend with buyers. As it's been mentioned in this thread, car manufacturers aren't going to excel selling poor performing gas guzzlers in a global market going forward. It's increasingly becoming a niche market.

  10. #46688
    Atomic Punk
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    Quote Originally Posted by Judgement Day View Post
    Dear God, please make it stop!!! This shit, along with the Kavanaugh BS stories has made it all but impossible to listen to the other side. It's literally been a three year temper tantrum. Keep it up and put Warren up as your nominee and watch Trump win in a landslide.
    Keep it up... red pills are working, even in the blue states. Something the MSM will damned if they're going to report on.
    "The VH Universe is built on a wall that separates CVH from SVH. Tell either side there's no wall, you've bought a war. Or a slaughter." Lt. Joshi - LAPD

 

 

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