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  1. #1
    Atomic Punk
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    12.18.17 @ 09:20 AM
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    Default Welfare Crackdown: Kansas Bans Cruises for the Poor

    Kansas Gov. Sam Brownback, a Republican, has just signed a bill from his state legislature banning welfare recipients from spending the public aid they receive through the federal Temporary Aid to Needy Families program in ways lawmakers deem wasteful or inappropriate.

    Now off limits are travel on cruise ships – likely somewhat scarce in landlocked Kansas – as well as adult entertainment, tattoos, alcohol, lingerie, and a long list of other products and services disapproved of by the Kansas state legislature.

    - See more at: http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/2015/0....8QyyQpiv.dpuf
    "Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack.” -- Gen. George S. Patton

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  3. #2
    Baluchitherium
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    The idea is good, but how do they police it? How do they know what they're paying cash for?

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    Forum Frontman fudd's Avatar
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    Good. Other states need to follow. And drug test.

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  7. #4
    Hot For Teacher FAN4EVER's Avatar
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    12.13.17 @ 07:49 AM
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    Quote Originally Posted by PrideofPasadena View Post
    The idea is good, but how do they police it? How do they know what they're paying cash for?
    Kansas issues paycards that the funds are loaded onto. This allows them to set the restrictions on the types of establishments the card can be used at. If a person tries to use the card at a liquor store it will get denied at the register. An additional restriction is a $25 cash withdrawal limit per day. Being in Kansas I generally agree with the state trying to make sure that the assistance is used to truly help those in need and not for booze, smokes and cruises... and I absolutely agree and support helping those that really need it. But the problem I have with this is that it just feels mean spirited. Take a look at the full list and you may find yourself shaking your head and wondering what the heck. Thinks like swimming pools and lingerie are on the list. So a person getting state assistance can't take their kids to a pool to cool off on a hot day when they can't afford to run the air conditioner? Or a person can't buy underwear? What the heck??? Also in case you had not figured out how wacked our state government is, no problem at all using the state assistance to buy a gun. Really, can't buy underwear but you can buy a gun. Again the law just has the appearance of meanness. Thanks Brownback.
    Aint life grand!

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  9. #5
    Good Enough
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    Quote Originally Posted by FAN4EVER View Post
    Kansas issues paycards that the funds are loaded onto. This allows them to set the restrictions on the types of establishments the card can be used at. If a person tries to use the card at a liquor store it will get denied at the register. An additional restriction is a $25 cash withdrawal limit per day. Being in Kansas I generally agree with the state trying to make sure that the assistance is used to truly help those in need and not for booze, smokes and cruises... and I absolutely agree and support helping those that really need it. But the problem I have with this is that it just feels mean spirited. Take a look at the full list and you may find yourself shaking your head and wondering what the heck. Thinks like swimming pools and lingerie are on the list. So a person getting state assistance can't take their kids to a pool to cool off on a hot day when they can't afford to run the air conditioner? Or a person can't buy underwear? What the heck??? Also in case you had not figured out how wacked our state government is, no problem at all using the state assistance to buy a gun. Really, can't buy underwear but you can buy a gun. Again the law just has the appearance of meanness. Thanks Brownback.
    Not to start an argument here, but in regards to your gun comment: Maybe somebody on state assistance still wants to be able to protect their family in the case of an emergency?

  10. #6
    Atomic Punk CaboChris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PCh5150 View Post
    Not to start an argument here, but in regards to your gun comment: Maybe somebody on state assistance still wants to be able to protect their family in the case of an emergency?
    Is a gun a neccesity like food?

  11. #7
    Atomic Punk bklynboy68's Avatar
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    It is not mean spirited.

    “I am for doing good to the poor, but...I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it. I observed...that the more public provisions were made for the poor, the less they provided for themselves, and of course became poorer. And, on the contrary, the less was done for them, the more they did for themselves, and became richer.”

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  13. #8
    Hot For Teacher FAN4EVER's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PCh5150 View Post
    Not to start an argument here, but in regards to your gun comment: Maybe somebody on state assistance still wants to be able to protect their family in the case of an emergency?
    No argument started here at all. There are so many ways to look at things and many times all points of view hold a certain level of value. Honestly, I had not thought of it that way so thank you for presenting your comment. I think the way I was thinking of the whole thing is that there are certain safeguards I think the state needs to take to first and most importantly ensure that the assistance is truly going to those in need. Second, I do think there should be processes in place to ensure that the assistance is being used to really help those getting to better their lives. The part I don't know how to solve for is who gets to say what betters someone's life? In my opinion this is government telling people that they can't do something that is perfectly legal just because they are getting state assistance. And to me that just feels for lack of a better term, mean. I guess I was looking at it from a different lens that a gun does not help someone better their life so why is it OK to buy with state provided funds within the context of the new law. After reading your post I now see how it could better their life by helping to protecting them. Which I think goes to my whole point of who gets to say it is OK?
    Aint life grand!

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  15. #9
    Hot For Teacher FAN4EVER's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bklynboy68 View Post
    It is not mean spirited.

    “I am for doing good to the poor, but...I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it. I observed...that the more public provisions were made for the poor, the less they provided for themselves, and of course became poorer. And, on the contrary, the less was done for them, the more they did for themselves, and became richer.”

    ― Benjamin Franklin
    Totally agree, but should government really be allowed to direct what the citizens can and can't do with the help that is provided?
    Aint life grand!

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  17. #10
    Atomic Punk CaboChris's Avatar
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    Being able to buy lingerie betters one's life.

    It creates babies...

    Republicans are the party of "the family" right?

    Babies equal future tax revenue. Win win...

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  19. #11
    Hot For Teacher FAN4EVER's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaboChris View Post
    Being able to buy lingerie betters one's life.

    It creates babies...

    Republicans are the party of "the family" right?

    Babies equal future tax revenue. Win win...
    Literally LOL'd
    Aint life grand!

  20. #12
    Atomic Punk
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    Quote Originally Posted by bklynboy68 View Post
    It is not mean spirited.

    “I am for doing good to the poor, but...I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it. I observed...that the more public provisions were made for the poor, the less they provided for themselves, and of course became poorer. And, on the contrary, the less was done for them, the more they did for themselves, and became richer.”

    ― Benjamin Franklin
    Thank you Mr Franklin for your wise words. Now, may I ask you:

    What about those of us who are "poor", not through CHOICE, not through LAZINESS, but because we've been left currently unable to work due to health problems / disability?

    Can't have people like me being "easy in (my) poverty" - quite right. So, please, tell me, with my health like it is now, how do you plan on "leading or driving (me) out of it"? Are you going to pay for me to have the surgery and on-going treatment I need to recover? It's only available in the States, so I warn you, as I live in the UK, it'll cost thousands to fly me over there and pay for the operation - and there's no way I can pay for it on my paltry benefits - but that's OK, because you (and I) want me back in work and not taking from the public purse, so I'm sure I can rely on you to do your utmost to "lead me out of poverty", whatever that takes. And, in the meantime, benefit scrounger as I am, with my cruises and lingerie, I can at least rely on the food banks and a pensioner Mother to help me out!

    ***

    See, that's the trouble with mechanisms like the one spoken of here in the original post - they make sweeping, frequently inaccurate, unfair generalisations. They demonise ALL people on benefits as being scroungers, ne'er do wells, less than human, when the REALITY is that most people on benefits are there because of real, and not very nice circumstances, and they are NOT well off financially, despite what you may have been led to believe...So when you disparage all of us, tar us all with that brush, pontificate about how we don't 'deserve' to have even the simplest luxury of a pair of nice knickers, consider how YOU might feel should you fall victim to circumstances beyond your control...Consider how YOU might feel to be seen as the scourge of the planet, when you're already pretty damned miserable through no fault of your own.
    Last edited by dibblekins; 04.17.15 at 11:59 AM.
    I'm FEMALE...Deal with it!

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  21. #13
    Sinner's Swing! VH122's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaboChris View Post
    Is a gun a neccesity like food?
    A gun is a tool much like an axe or knife.
    If you consider a tool a necessity than yes it is.

  22. #14
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    I have to say that I'm not big on giving people assistance only to then be able to control their lives through it. I understand why people call for it—there are many who use it in ways it's not intended.

    I'd much rather empower people in a different way. If Kansas wanted to be bold, implement the negative income tax. Put together a system of assistance where the more one works, the more one takes home.

    If you want them to use the money how it's intended and actually "teach people how to fish," then maybe it takes a month where they go on a cruise and then run out of money the last week of the month.


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  24. #15
    Atomic Punk
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    Quote Originally Posted by PCh5150 View Post
    Not to start an argument here, but in regards to your gun comment: Maybe somebody on state assistance still wants to be able to protect their family in the case of an emergency?
    And, maybe they need to go swimming - to work off all those calories consumed via the fast food diet on which those of us who are "poor" frequently binge! After all, we're do need to keep our public healthcare claims to a minimum, don't we?

    In all seriousness, swimming is one of the few forms of exercise that can actually alleviate pain without putting too much stress on bone and muscle. I find the banning of it for those on benefits - because, presumably, it's a non-essential 'luxury' - absolutely abhorrent, particularly for those who may be claiming those benefits due to poor health / disability.

    Don't get me wrong - I can understand taking benefits off those who seek to spend them on illegal activities / substances - I can appreciate the censure aimed at such individuals. But for people living in the 'Land of the Free' to start dictating which perfectly LEGAL activities have merit, which should be 'allowed', and which prohibited, strikes me as being the very opposite to freedom - it's tyrannical, distasteful, and actually rather frightening.

    At the end of the day, welfare recipients receive a SET amount of financial assistance - assistance to which ALL citizens are entitled, should circumstances warrant it. If those individuals choose to starve themselves for a week so that they can afford a new bra then that is THEIR choice. You may not like it but you can't, on the one hand, preach about personal liberties, and then, on the other seek to remove those liberties from law-abiding citizens, just because YOU do not approve of their choices. Claiming benefits does not render a person a criminal, a slave, an animal - please remember that - because you never know when you might have to walk (or not, as the case may be) in their shoes.
    I'm FEMALE...Deal with it!

    "Whatever you do, wherever you go, there you are..." Edward Van Halen 1986

    "You spend the first part of your life trying to make your mark, and the second part just trying to cover up your tracks"... Weesfreewheelin, 2012

    "Life's too short to stuff a mushroom"... Shirley Conran, 1975

    "You turn if you want to...The LADY is NOT for turning!"...Margaret
    Thatcher, 1980


 

 

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