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  1. #1
    Atomic Punk bklynboy68's Avatar
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    Default Canadian Government Facing Pressure to Outlaw Muslim Brotherhood

    With growing evidence of the Muslim Brotherhood’s presence and activity in Canada–together with their ties to terror around the world–the government is coming under increased pressure to declare the Muslim Brotherhood a terror group, thereby making the organization illegal in Canada.

    According to QMI Agency, the “two main offshoots” of the Muslim Brotherhood are Hamas and Egyptian Islamic Jihad, both of which “are listed as terror organizations in Canada.”

    QMI reports that “top Muslim Brotherhood leaders have lived in Canada for decades” and that “they have sent pro-Sharia organizations and sent money and resources to groups that the Royal Canadian Mounted Police and the Canadian Revenue Agency say are owned or controlled by Hamas.”

    The current focus on the Muslim Brotherhood comes nearly one year to the day after the National Post reported on a study that determined a thorough investigation of the group was overdue.

    According to the Post, the study was authored by Tom Quiggin, formerly a Privy Council intelligence analyst. His study “intended to focus public attention on the requirement to have a national level discussion on the Muslim Brotherhood and its role in Canada.”

    Although founded in the 1920s, the Muslim Brotherhood rose to prominence most recently in June 2012, when Mohammed Morsi won the Egyptian presidential election as a member of the national Muslim Brotherhood party. Breitbart News reported Egypt’s military removed Morsi from office one year later, as part of an effort to protect democracy in that country.

    Pressure is now mounting for the Canadian government to do something about the elements of the Muslim Brotherhood in their country.


    http://www.edmontonsun.com/2015/03/0...cope-in-canada

    http://news.nationalpost.com/2014/05...nto-the-group/

    http://www.breitbart.com/national-se...m-brotherhood/
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  2. #2
    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
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    not sure how outlawing them is helpful, it's not like it's a political party. So doing this is more cosmetic than anything. But that would be a very political thing to do so the government might do it just to score some poltical points with the election upcoming. Personally I'd prefer just putting more resources into finding these people and deporting them if possible or if they are Canadian born then charging them with any crimes they have committed. I do have some confidence in our federal govt to handle this sort of thing.

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    Sinner's Swing! evhintexas's Avatar
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    Outlawing radical Muslims should be encouraged
    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."

    “A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government.”

  5. #4
    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by evhintexas View Post
    Outlawing radical Muslims should be encouraged
    it's a nice thing to say but you can't outlaw them no different that you can't outlaw racism or sexism. These are thoughts some people have. You can, however, pump money into resources to ensure that anyone who is planning on doing anything is caught before they get too far into planning. You can also ensure that your immigration process ensures you're not letting these animals into the country.

  6. #5
    Atomic Punk bklynboy68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by It's Mike View Post
    it's a nice thing to say but you can't outlaw them no different that you can't outlaw racism or sexism. These are thoughts some people have. You can, however, pump money into resources to ensure that anyone who is planning on doing anything is caught before they get too far into planning. You can also ensure that your immigration process ensures you're not letting these animals into the country.
    I don't know man, Germany has made anything Nazi illegal and these bastards are cut from the same cloth.
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  7. #6
    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bklynboy68 View Post
    I don't know man, Germany has made anything Nazi illegal and these bastards are cut from the same cloth.
    little bit of a different situation, don't you think?

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    ohcanadamovie.com

    you guys watch this yet. Its pretty interesting, I wouldn't be surprised if they outlawed all religion.

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    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bklynboy68 View Post
    I don't know man, Germany has made anything Nazi illegal and these bastards are cut from the same cloth.
    Thought legislation is scary to me. I mean, we already have some of it, and that's the way you get somewhere scary is to do it a bit at a time. So with hate crime legislation, we've made it worse for you to kill someone because they're Black than if they just looked at you wrong.

    I think current precedent on this is Virginia v Black, where a few people were convicted of violating a Virginia statute against burning crosses. The court struck that down, but it did leave open the possibility that if intent to intimidate is proven, then you can arrest someone for burning a cross.

    A blanket ban against thought, I think, is wrong and completely against the first amendment. You can think all the nasty shit you want. That's the point of the first amendment. It protects unpopular speech. Unless they are doing something that is directly meant to intimidate another, I am not sure what else can be done.

  10. #9
    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vanhalendlrband View Post
    ohcanadamovie.com

    you guys watch this yet. Its pretty interesting, I wouldn't be surprised if they outlawed all religion.
    Lol. Yeah a govt full of Christians is gonna ban religion.

  11. #10
    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bklynboy68 View Post
    I don't know man, Germany has made anything Nazi illegal and these bastards are cut from the same cloth.
    I do believe that is incorrect. Being a Neo-Nazi or fascist is not illegal in Germany, just denying the holocaust is.

    The National Democratic Party in Germany is an official political party, and it is generally considered a Neo-Nazi party, and while they don't yet have members in their version of Congress, they do have members of the NDP in their version of state legislatures.
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  12. #11
    Atomic Punk bklynboy68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave's Dreidel View Post
    I do believe that is incorrect. Being a Neo-Nazi or fascist is not illegal in Germany, just denying the holocaust is.

    The National Democratic Party in Germany is an official political party, and it is generally considered a Neo-Nazi party, and while they don't yet have members in their version of Congress, they do have members of the NDP in their version of state legislatures.
    Ok, here's what I was thinking. I found this 2010 article that touches on this.

    Despite banning Nazi symbols, Germany's constitution and legal tradition complicate cases against neo-Nazis


    BERLIN, Germany — The government of the state of Bavaria has said it will soon request that Germany's highest courts ban the country's largest far-right party, the National Democratic Party (NPD), for subverting the tenets of the national constitution.

    It's a policy that is popular among most of the public, and has earned backing from both of the country's major parties. But it's also a course of action that most political elites acknowledge has little chance of success.

    "There's very little chance of the courts accepting this argument," said Wolfgang Hoffmann-Riem, a former justice on Germany's Constitutional Court.

    This is not the first time the German government has considered how to position itself toward the crimes of the country's past. Indeed, the history of post-World War II Germany is fraught with morally dubious decisions toward the legacy of Nazism — from Konrad Adenauer's choice in the 1950s to avoid a thorough de-Nazification of his government, to the Red Army Fraction's campaign in the 1970s to purify West Germany of its Nazi-era sins by means of terrorism and murder.


    Nonetheless, the contemporary German state has mostly tried in good faith to feel its way toward an ad hoc accomodation of its Nazi past, one that acknowledges the unique scourge of the Third Reich, while protecting the core freedoms of a liberal democracy. Symbols from the Nazi-era, such as the swastika or the "Heil Hitler" salute, are illegal in Germany, but far-right political groups have also been granted equal right to hold demonstrations to air their views. Holocaust denial is punishable by imprisonment, but neo-Nazi parties have been tolerated as long as they draw no explicit links with the Nazi regime.The policies might sometimes may seem contradictory, but they are meant to hang together as a carefully managed compromise, one that pays respect both to the tragic origins and the decades-long success of the modern, democratic German state.

    But, when it comes to the NPD, the country's largest far-right party, many Germans insist that the government redraw the boundaries between freedom of expression and historical deference. Indeed, the calls for action against the NPD have gotten louder in recent years, a development coincident with the party's increasing successes, especially in eastern Germany.

    The party has earned seats in a number of state legislatures by winning more than 5 percent in several state-wide elections, which has also given it the right to receive government campaign financing. Charlotte Knoblauch, head of the Central Council of Jews in Germany, supports the renewed effort to ban the party, insisting that it's unacceptable that the party receives tax money to spread its "racist propoganda."

    However personally sympathetic German judges may be to such pleas, they say they can't do anything about the party unless the state can conclusively prove that it is explicitly subverting the German constitution. That sets the bar very high: Party leaders would have to be documented laying out plans to install a dictatorship, or belittling the victims of totalitarianism. Gathering such evidence in the public sphere is a madenning process, as NPD lawyers carefully monitor party rhetoric so that it tiptoes up to, without crossing, the legal boundaries.

    The German government has tried other methods to gain damning evidence against the NPD, but those have only led to other legal difficulties. Indeed, an attempt by the federal government in 2003 to ban the party relied heavily on evidence gathered by government agents who operated as undercover spies within the NPD organization. The Constitutional Court claimed it couldn't distinguish between the government agents' observations of the NPD activities, and their own participation and possible instigation of those activities. Legal experts, including former justice Hoffmann-Riem, have suggested that the very fact that undercover government agents are still in force in the NPD organization means that any legal case against the party would be weakened from the get-go.

    Interestingly, it's primarily politicians from eastern Germany, where the NPD is strongest, who have most strongly resisted calls to ban the party. They argue that the only sustainable way to combat neo-Nazi radicalism is through the normal channels of the liberal state — namely, open debate and argument. "Even if you banned the NPD party, they would just rename themselves and come back the next week," said Andreas Adammer, a resident of Potsdam in the state of Brandenburg, where the NPD has enjoyed success in past elections.

    Of course, the contrasting strategies for dealing with the NPD can and will most likely be pursued in parallel. Indeed, while Bavaria pursues its case against the NPD, some 8000 neo-Nazis are expected to gather in Dresden Saturday to mark the 65th anniversary of the Allied bombing of that city in the final year of World War II. A police presence will be on hand to ensure that the Nazi sympathizers have the opportunity to air their slogans, which compare Allied firebombing to Nazi atrocities. But, they are also expected to be met by a group of counter-protesters whose numbers will double their own.


    http://www.minnpost.com/global-post/...tion-complicat
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  13. #12
    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
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    I think the German experience is a very unique one. They've had to go over board on this particuarl issue to ensure it's a piece of their history that is never repeated. I completely understand why they would do that.

    I don't you can compare that to how western nations would deal be potential terrorists or those who share their beliefs. They need to handled harshly obviously and if they're dumb enough to create a political party that publically endorses terrorism then i can imagine they'll have their communications monitored going forward.

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    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    I don't think there is any way to reconcile something similar without completely changing our ideas about free speech and freedom of religion. That said, we did fundamentally change our ideas of parts of the first and fifth amendments as part of the civil rights act, and that was made possible through a fundamental shift in the commerce clause around WWII. So it's not unheard of in the US, I suppose.

 

 

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