Follow us on...
Follow us on Twitter Follow us on Facebook Watch us on YouTube
Register
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 23
  1. #1
    Atomic Punk Bad to the Bone's Avatar
    Join Date
    03.05.02
    Age
    45
    Location
    Detroit MI
    Posts
    8,950
    Favorite VH Album

    FUCK or 5150
    Favorite VH Song

    Mine All Mine, 5150
    Last Online

    12.13.17 @ 12:34 PM
    Likes
    1,064
    Liked 1,885 Times in 1,102 Posts

    Default Did WB Really Consider Sam Prior to the first Van Halen record?

    I was rewatching Van Halen Unleashed the other day and was thinking about the story Alex tells about WB considering Sammy to be in the band prior to the first record.

    They told the story pretty consistantly the entire time Sammy was in the band and I think Mike still mentions it in interviews (I think he said it in the Eddie Trunk interview a few weeks back but I could be wrong).

    so, the question is did this really happen or were they just embelishing things back then?

    please don't turn this into a Sam vs Dave debate, just answer the question if you think it actually happened or not.

    I don't really know what to think. It's possible IMHO. WB knew Sam from the Montrose days as did Ted and Donn Landee but I wouldn't be shocked if there is no truth to the tale at all.

  2. #2
    Eruption
    Join Date
    02.18.00
    Posts
    1,267
    Favorite VH Song

    Secrets
    Last Online

    11.01.17 @ 03:25 PM
    Likes
    227
    Liked 607 Times in 299 Posts

    Who knows? I'm sure it'll be covered in the new VH Rising book due out next year. My only thought is why would WB wanna replace Dave? His voice back then was pretty good. Certainly fit the music. And even back then people will tell you he had great stage presence.
    Only reason I could see WB wanting to force Hagar into this new band would be if they had him under contract and felt it'd be a good way to put the contract to use. But we know he wasn't under contract to WB. So again.... Who knows?
    A new short film I made, please like/follow:
    http://facebook.com/umbrellashortfilm

  3. #3
    Atomic Punk Little Dreamer's Avatar
    Join Date
    12.25.99
    Age
    45
    Location
    Pasadena, CA, USA
    Posts
    8,937
    Favorite VH Album

    Fair Warning
    Favorite VH Song

    Hear About It Later
    Last Online

    12.13.17 @ 11:33 AM
    Likes
    1,001
    Liked 1,385 Times in 760 Posts

    Default

    Well before VH was famous, they were unknown, it goes without saying. Sammy Hagar was the former singer of Montrose, so in 1977 was a lot more famous than a then-unknown David Roth (as he is credited on the back of VHI). WB was just thinking about the best way to sell more records - best way to make money. In the end they wisely decided to keep D(L)R and not mess with a winning formula.
    Little Dreamer

  4. #4
    Atomic Punk Bad to the Bone's Avatar
    Join Date
    03.05.02
    Age
    45
    Location
    Detroit MI
    Posts
    8,950
    Favorite VH Album

    FUCK or 5150
    Favorite VH Song

    Mine All Mine, 5150
    Last Online

    12.13.17 @ 12:34 PM
    Likes
    1,064
    Liked 1,885 Times in 1,102 Posts

    Default

    I wonder if Ted Templeman has ever been asked about this.

    Ted worked with Sam on the first 2 montrose records and from what I understand he liked Sam and what he brought to the table.

    he might have been thinking that Montrose could have been alot bigger had they lasted a bit longer and maybe he thought Sam was a better fit. I'm totally guessing on that.

  5. #5
    Atomic Punk Get The Show On The Road's Avatar
    Join Date
    01.05.12
    Age
    42
    Location
    6300 feet above sea level
    Posts
    11,069
    Favorite VH Album

    Van Halen
    Favorite VH Song

    I'm The One
    Last Online

    12.13.17 @ 12:19 PM
    Likes
    16,726
    Liked 10,856 Times in 5,712 Posts


    Premium Member

    Default

    If this was considered it would have been a dumb move IMO. I do not think that a young EVH would have meshed with Sam. I think that the music that Ed was writing at the time was much more suited for DLR than it would have been for Sam. I also remember Sam's comment about Ronnie not letting him play guitar and that's why he bailed. You really think a 22 year old up and coming EVH would have allowed Sam to touch a guitar? It would've ended the same way as Montrose IMO a couple of albums and "poof!"

    Sam came along at the right time where Ed was maturing as a musician and needed a more diverse voice than what Dave was able to offer. It wouldn't have worked the other way around.
    The only genre I really know is Van Halen.

  6. The Following Member Likes This Post:


  7. #6
    Baluchitherium Harpospoke's Avatar
    Join Date
    03.12.12
    Location
    Dallas, TX
    Posts
    4,288
    Favorite VH Album

    Van Halen II
    Favorite VH Song

    Dance the Night Away
    Last Online

    12.12.17 @ 10:04 AM
    Likes
    10,122
    Liked 2,801 Times in 1,450 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Get The Show On The Road View Post
    If this was considered it would have been a dumb move IMO. I do not think that a young EVH would have meshed with Sam. I think that the music that Ed was writing at the time was much more suited for DLR than it would have been for Sam. I also remember Sam's comment about Ronnie not letting him play guitar and that's why he bailed. You really think a 22 year old up and coming EVH would have allowed Sam to touch a guitar? It would've ended the same way as Montrose IMO a couple of albums and "poof!"

    Sam came along at the right time where Ed was maturing as a musician and needed a more diverse voice than what Dave was able to offer. It wouldn't have worked the other way around.
    Not to mention that the band may have gone in a much heavier direction without Dave and his pop/R&B influence. Would there ever have been a Dance the Night Away for instance? The band may have gone back to what Eddie and Alex were doing prior to Dave.

  8. #7
    Good Enough
    Join Date
    05.23.00
    Location
    ..this desperate part of town.
    Posts
    2,306
    Last Online

    12.09.17 @ 09:22 AM
    Likes
    562
    Liked 280 Times in 134 Posts

    Default

    I always thought it was something blown out of proportion. Maybe it was mentioned in passing by TT one day, but never all that serious. I can't believe anyone at WB would believe you can just 'install' Sammy. VH got signed because of 4 guys... not in spite of DLR.

    It makes for a cool story to tell during an interview though.
    Sings like a bird. Rocks like a pig.

  9. #8
    Unchained
    Join Date
    02.26.06
    Posts
    476
    Last Online

    12.12.17 @ 12:50 PM
    Likes
    47
    Liked 237 Times in 80 Posts

    Default

    I'm relatively certain this is an absolute truth from WB perspective. Hell, even Templeman admits that his draw to VH was Ed. He didn't become a Dave convert until Dave began singing on the albums. So absolutely I believe it.

    Also, and I'm just guessing here, this may have been the genesis of Daves ill will toward Sam (although it would be unfair from Sams perspective at the time)

  10. #9
    Eruption AFU's Avatar
    Join Date
    06.20.00
    Location
    Rumford, R.I. USA
    Posts
    868
    Last Online

    12.10.17 @ 09:00 AM
    Likes
    208
    Liked 378 Times in 224 Posts

    Default

    I always thought it was a lie. Something about the way Alex says it. Like he's a little uncomfortable with the lie. And we know he's not uncomfortable because he's trashing Dave. He struck me as a bit more angry about Roth leaving and trashed him every chance he got. Even in '88 talking about the Monsters Of Rock tour he gets a dig in at Dave. So I never bought it.

  11. #10
    Good Enough nobozos's Avatar
    Join Date
    02.16.00
    Location
    Pekin, Il U.S.A.
    Posts
    1,745
    Last Online

    12.12.17 @ 03:16 PM
    Likes
    22
    Liked 724 Times in 341 Posts

    Default

    Would not be at all surprised if some suit at WB mentioned it. It would have made sense for somebody to say, "Hey, Sammy was in a band with a monster guitar player and he's looking for work. Why don't we stick him in this new band with a monster guitar player."

    I don't think the band probably gave it any consideration though. Would have been a huge mistake. The thing that made Van Halen the show to see when they started was the balance between the over-the-top frontman and the insanely good guitar player. Changing out the frontman with someone else would have alienated the fan base that they had, and probably would have made the band a one and done.

    I wouldn't go so far as to say that David Lee Roth wrote the book on being a frontman, but his combination of a hyperactive Jim Dandy cutout, mixed with the gymnastics and charisma re-wrote the book for the majority of the hair metal bands in the 80s to follow.

    Van Halen was known for their live performances and antics as much as Eddies musicianship. Without Dave there in the beginning, I don't know if it would have been as big a hit.
    "Having an opinion that people disagree with doesn't make you a Douche, arguing with the people who disagree with your opinion and calling them stupid does!" -Me.

  12. #11
    Sinner's Swing!
    Join Date
    11.26.10
    Age
    46
    Posts
    3,353
    Last Online

    11.25.17 @ 09:06 AM
    Likes
    1,679
    Liked 1,374 Times in 803 Posts

    Default

    I do know that some of the execs did take issue with Dave. I'm glad as hell he wasn't replaced. VH would simply not be what it was without his voice and persona. As another poster said, Sam's timing in joining VH was pretty much perfect. I couldn't see it working in the beginning either. Sam was the right fit at the time he came in in regards to the direction the music was going. It worked.

    As far as Sam being suggested early on, as the band has stated.....Dunno....I've never really bought that for some reason. Just never seemed to jive. I always thought it was the a kind of PR inspired "it was fate" type of deal that they spun to the press.
    Could be totally wrong though.

  13. #12
    Banned!
    Join Date
    09.21.13
    Age
    47
    Location
    Space Station 5
    Posts
    1,380
    Favorite VH Album

    Balance
    Favorite VH Song

    Mine All Mine/The Seventh Seal
    Last Online

    05.16.15 @ 10:42 AM
    Likes
    370
    Liked 213 Times in 135 Posts

    Default

    I think it's true. I think VH could have been successful with Sammy early on, but I agree that his entrance came at a more ideal time. I wish Ronnie Montrose would have listened to Sammy about the direction of Montrose, though.

  14. #13
    Sinner's Swing! Heisenberg's Avatar
    Join Date
    04.28.12
    Location
    vancouver
    Posts
    3,642
    Favorite VH Album

    all 7
    Favorite VH Song

    ATBL & The Full Bug
    Last Online

    12.10.17 @ 09:09 PM
    Likes
    1,508
    Liked 1,978 Times in 892 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by nobozos View Post
    Would not be at all surprised if some suit at WB mentioned it.
    Yeah neither would I. It reminds me of this old quote from Mo Ostin around the time Steve Stevens and Vince Neil worked together.


    " To help record the song, Vince put together a solo band, bringing Stevens in to handle shredding duties. The following year, a $4 million deal was closed for Neil at Warner Bros.(at which Warner Bros. CEO Mo Ostin said, "We should take Vince and that other rock kid we've got...David Lee Roth and put them in a band together." His son Michael replied, "But Dad, they're both singers.")"
    " On a scale that ranges from deep dark depression to rip roaring fun ... most people idle between pissed off ...and not too pissed off " DLR 1997

    " I am the danger ... I am the one who knocks " Walter White 2011

  15. #14
    Baluchitherium thismusicsux's Avatar
    Join Date
    05.31.12
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    4,427
    Favorite VH Album

    FAIR WARNING
    Favorite VH Song

    Dirty Movies & Girl Gone Bad
    Last Online

    12.13.17 @ 10:54 AM
    Likes
    13,453
    Liked 5,127 Times in 2,425 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Heisenberg View Post
    Yeah neither would I. It reminds me of this old quote from Mo Ostin around the time Steve Stevens and Vince Neil worked together.


    " To help record the song, Vince put together a solo band, bringing Stevens in to handle shredding duties. The following year, a $4 million deal was closed for Neil at Warner Bros.(at which Warner Bros. CEO Mo Ostin said, "We should take Vince and that other rock kid we've got...David Lee Roth and put them in a band together." His son Michael replied, "But Dad, they're both singers.")"
    ha, hilarious.

    I worked with those guys at a record label they ran after they left Warner Bros in the late 90's. So I saw Mo Ostin, Lenny Warnoker and Michael Ostin every day for a few years... but never thought to ask them about this Sammy story. Too bad!

  16. #15
    Sinner's Swing! Heisenberg's Avatar
    Join Date
    04.28.12
    Location
    vancouver
    Posts
    3,642
    Favorite VH Album

    all 7
    Favorite VH Song

    ATBL & The Full Bug
    Last Online

    12.10.17 @ 09:09 PM
    Likes
    1,508
    Liked 1,978 Times in 892 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by thismusicsux View Post
    ha, hilarious.

    I worked with those guys at a record label they ran after they left Warner Bros in the late 90's. So I saw Mo Ostin, Lenny Warnoker and Michael Ostin every day for a few years... but never thought to ask them about this Sammy story. Too bad!
    Yeah just goes to show how they think. Whoever they have under contract is just merely a commodity at any given time like athletes on professional sports teams.

    As previously stated hopefully this subject is included and put to rest in the Van Halen Rising book.

    I think this first came up in '86 from on of Alex's interview comments I don't recall hearing anything about it before then. Of course it then gets retold all over the place. Even mentioned as a fact in David Konow's " Bang Your Head " book although I'm not so sure it is true or not most likely not but who knows for sure. That book also told conflicting stories and quotes from Billy Sheehan about the circumstances surrounding the breakup. Good book but not sure if it's all 100% accurate.

    So many unanswered questions.
    Last edited by Heisenberg; 11.04.14 at 06:29 PM.
    " On a scale that ranges from deep dark depression to rip roaring fun ... most people idle between pissed off ...and not too pissed off " DLR 1997

    " I am the danger ... I am the one who knocks " Walter White 2011

 

 

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 226
    Last Post: 02.07.12, 04:50 PM
  2. Hagar Talked With Alex Prior To Hall of Fame
    By Grover in forum Main VH Discussion
    Replies: 52
    Last Post: 03.24.07, 04:48 PM
  3. VAN HALEN RECORD LABEL
    By VH RACING in forum Main VH Discussion
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 12.06.02, 11:36 AM
  4. Did anyone catch Van Halen "Off the Record"...
    By cf in forum Main VH Discussion
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 11.12.00, 10:20 PM
  5. Songs prior to 1978?
    By RAFTER in forum Van Halen 101
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 10.24.00, 02:50 PM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •