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  1. #1
    Eruption
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    10.31.17 @ 04:36 AM
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    Default Why no jam or improvisation?

    Not that would ever expect Van Halen to become a "jam band" . . . but why, in the forum's opinion, has VH done so little to let the audience, the night, the "liveness" of an event influence the tunes? I have heard Sammy and DLR both say "you never know what's going to happen", but 99.5% of the time the tunes are the same live. Scripted.

    The exceptions I remember are Unchained from this past tour, FWYS where they did a little outro jam, Amsterdam had a little outro jam at the end, etc. But for the most part, they never deviate from the script. Why is that?

    I was reminded of how great live music can be (as opposed to playing a tune note-for-note to the record) while watching this clip --

    To me, live music (at least rock, I realize it doesn't work in classical, etc.) is most amazing when there's an element of authenticity of playing "in the moment" and not simply regurgitating the same thing 80 times on tour.

    What's your opinion on why the band is this way? Scared to walk out on the branch for fear it will break? Lack of musicianship? Don't care to make it unique each night?

  2. #2
    Atomic Punk CaboChris's Avatar
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    12.09.17 @ 12:23 AM
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    Default

    Because the point of a Rock show is to entertain. Not bore people to death.

    Also, a band like VH is on a tight schedule when they tour. Get in, give the fans a good show, and get out. How many songs would be left out, to a improvised extended jam?

    Most fans don't want to hear Greatful Dead style jams from any band imo.

  3. #3
    Atomic Punk Raldo's Avatar
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    12.11.17 @ 10:23 AM
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    Default

    I wouldn't mind seeing VH take one of their songs and extend it with a little jam.
    Remember the Heroes - 9/11/01

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  4. #4
    Sinner's Swing! DFVH5150's Avatar
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    12.11.17 @ 04:48 PM
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    Default

    During one song, and one song only, would be good.

    If Chickenfoot subscribed that in '09 we could've gotten 5 more songs per set from them...
    Dave
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  5. #5
    Eruption Railrunner130's Avatar
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    12.10.17 @ 03:58 PM
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    Default

    I think it had to do with Ed being a control freak. He was afraid of providing a poor quality product. I get what he meant, but I think that with VH that would not be a problem.

  6. #6
    Eruption F'nRockstar's Avatar
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    10.08.17 @ 07:28 PM
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    Default



    Summer nights 5150 tour...solo is insane. Should have been the lead single.
    Lets just throw a pound of weed in the fire place, f@#% it!

    Proud owner: Purple Flame Ernie Ball Music Man Axis and a 5150 Combo Amp.

  7. #7
    Baluchitherium
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    08.21.17 @ 09:32 PM
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    Default

    It's pretty simple. They're not a jam band. And the fans didn't fall in love with a jam band. The first 6 records hardly had any songs over 5 minutes long.
    Like most classic bands, they're their to play the hits. Turning RWTD into a ten minute jam is not what the people want.

    Bands like this usually take one song during the show an improv it a bit. Just like how they did with SGMAD last tour.

    Really, there's more improvisation than you think. Ed, never plays stuff note for note. Back in the day Ed played the solo's and outro's different. Sometimes better then the studio version.

  8. #8
    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    12.11.17 @ 05:03 PM
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    Default

    Critics and historians talk about how Led Zep would play 45 minute versions of "Whole Lotta Love" with great reverence.

    That would bore me to tears, and I would be drunk and broke by the end of it based upon how many times I would have gone to the beer stand.

    No thanks. Wanna hear extended improvisation pieces? - go see a jazz outfit, not Van Halen. At least in my humble opinion. Them adding "I'm So Glad" or other small snippets in the breakdown of a song is plenty.
    Taylor Swift is nice to look at. Adele can sing.

    Emperor Brett - "I can't believe you guys are analyzing song-by-song Van Halen III? What next, analyzing the script of Stroker Ace looking for some shred of Citizen Kane?"

    David Lee Roth did the impossible. He made Van Halen better. Deal with it!

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  9. #9
    Eruption NoBrownM&M's's Avatar
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    12.11.17 @ 01:49 PM
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    Default

    Why-o-why do people think the world revolves around their views? Why in the world do you assume that the best way to deliver a performance is with a 'jam'? Are you an expert for the rest of us as to what makes a winning rock show?

  10. #10
    Eruption Casemeister's Avatar
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    03.22.17 @ 07:01 AM
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    Default

    Truthfully?

    Ed doesn't seem to be consistently great at "jamming." I consider him the greatest rock guitarist of all time, but improvisation doesn't appear to be his strong suit.
    Waylon Jennings: 1937-2002.
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    RIP, Hoss!

  11. #11
    Good Enough extreme red roth's Avatar
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    06.16.17 @ 09:53 AM
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    Default

    The variations of 5150 on the 5150 tour are superb, best captured on Live Without a Net.

    The fake "the band is fucking around" during You Really Got Me, leading into Cabo Wabo is forced. I don't care for it.

    I have a DVD of them playing in Cabo in like 1991....a lot of improvisational jamming going on...they were pretty hammered...I enjoyed it for 4 seconds, and then I was like, "play something else".

    We had a block party a few years ago...the band we got turned every song into a 19-minute jam. Worst. Band. Ever.
    The Barn Burned Down, Now I can See the Moon

  12. #12
    Little Dreamer
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    12.23.15 @ 02:32 PM
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave's Dreidel View Post
    Critics and historians talk about how Led Zep would play 45 minute versions of "Whole Lotta Love" with great reverence.

    That would bore me to tears, and I would be drunk and broke by the end of it based upon how many times I would have gone to the beer stand.

    No thanks. Wanna hear extended improvisation pieces? - go see a jazz outfit, not Van Halen. At least in my humble opinion. Them adding "I'm So Glad" or other small snippets in the breakdown of a song is plenty.
    when zep played WLL they mixed in some of their favorite songs by other artists so it wasnt all one song,kind of a medley, which is cool as they would mix it up a lot.having some fun...plus they were filling a 3 hour show with no opener...45 min versions of moby dick or no quarter is something else..

  13. #13
    Sinner's Swing! Zahzoo's Avatar
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    11.04.17 @ 06:01 AM
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    Default

    I think there's a broad misconception regarding jams and improv in show business. It's really much more of a rarity than most people realize.

    A great performance is generally repeated at every show... you are led to believe that night you received something special... Until the advent of the internet and increased mobility in travel... every audience member leaving thinking their experience was unique.

    Even bands or performances that are allegedly jams or live improvisation are heavily scripted and practiced prior to hitting the road. They leave a little room in the schedule for "things" to happen.

    Some of the more famous unique events more often were just accidents or an artist being heavily intoxicated and leaving the script...

    Bottom line... Van Halen members aren't all that smart nor regimented to work without a script and safety nets. There's less to remember and no one gets lost.
    Woke up this mornin, got Blue Moon in your eyes...
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  14. #14
    Little Dreamer
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    12.23.15 @ 02:32 PM
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Zahzoo View Post
    I think there's a broad misconception regarding jams and improv in show business. It's really much more of a rarity than most people realize.

    A great performance is generally repeated at every show... you are led to believe that night you received something special... Until the advent of the internet and increased mobility in travel... every audience member leaving thinking their experience was unique.

    Even bands or performances that are allegedly jams or live improvisation are heavily scripted and practiced prior to hitting the road. They leave a little room in the schedule for "things" to happen.

    Some of the more famous unique events more often were just accidents or an artist being heavily intoxicated and leaving the script...

    Bottom line... Van Halen members aren't all that smart nor regimented to work without a script and safety nets. There's less to remember and no one gets lost.
    thats when most of these bands were at their best. snortin whiskey and drinkin cocaine

  15. #15
    Atomic Punk Eddymon's Avatar
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    12.11.17 @ 02:30 PM
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    Default

    I loved the quick jam at the end of Without You that led into the verse from We Can Work It Out and too bad they didn't make that a bit longer.
    'Old Van Halen, when I was in it-classic Van Halen-makes you wanna drink, dance and screw, right? And the new Van Halen encourages you to drink milk, drive a Nissan and have a relationship.' - David Lee Roth.

 

 

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