Follow us on...
Follow us on Twitter Follow us on Facebook Watch us on YouTube
Register
Results 1 to 12 of 12
  1. #1
    Atomic Punk MF5150's Avatar
    Join Date
    06.05.04
    Age
    29
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    16,328
    Favorite VH Album

    Balance
    Favorite VH Song

    Seventh Seal/Me Wise Magic
    Last Online

    12.14.17 @ 04:54 PM
    Likes
    298
    Liked 413 Times in 248 Posts

    Default Stand Your Ground...Even Against Alzheimer's Patient..

    My man, when you are fantasizing, don't go for attainable, you can get attainable at the local Applebee's. - Dave's Dreidel

  2. #2
    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
    Join Date
    03.26.06
    Age
    43
    Location
    Vaughan, Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    34,149
    Favorite VH Album

    like them all, no favourite
    Last Online

    12.15.17 @ 07:22 PM
    Likes
    1,318
    Liked 6,702 Times in 3,721 Posts

    Default

    nothing shows how brave you are more than pumping 4 bullets into an unarmed 72 year old man. And you know he'll walk.

  3. #3
    Atomic Punk
    Join Date
    01.29.02
    Age
    49
    Location
    somewhere over the rainbow
    Posts
    22,946
    Last Online

    12.11.17 @ 04:37 PM
    Likes
    842
    Liked 1,229 Times in 448 Posts

    Default

    I'm a "gun guy", and I still see this as a fucking pathetic excuse to pull the trigger...
    "Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack.” -- Gen. George S. Patton

  4. #4
    Atomic Punk BREW CREW's Avatar
    Join Date
    02.09.00
    Age
    45
    Posts
    11,665
    Favorite VH Album

    Van Halen 1
    Favorite VH Song

    Somebody Get Me A Doctor
    Last Online

    08.27.17 @ 09:39 AM
    Likes
    45
    Liked 185 Times in 105 Posts

    Default

    In that situation (if when dark) , I would have stayed in my house, turned on all exterior lights, called the cops, called my neighbors to turn on all lights and stay inside and wait for the cops. Only if the person entered my home would I shoot them.
    Just go for it!

  5. #5
    Good Enough pickslide's Avatar
    Join Date
    02.02.04
    Age
    49
    Location
    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts
    1,861
    Favorite VH Album

    Fair Warning
    Favorite VH Song

    Mean Street
    Last Online

    12.14.17 @ 01:09 PM
    Likes
    799
    Liked 801 Times in 436 Posts


    Premium Member

    Default

    Not terribly familiar with Georgia's Stand Your Ground provision, but I'm assuming that, as usual when a media story highlights it, it won't apply.

    Seems like this was completely unnecessary, even absent Stand Your Ground. Seems very incriminating to me he shot an old man that he actually knew. Just trigger happy.

    TK

  6. #6
    ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ Number 47's Avatar
    Join Date
    10.08.06
    Posts
    29,877
    Last Online

    12.15.17 @ 09:32 PM
    Likes
    1,881
    Liked 6,846 Times in 3,584 Posts


    Premium Member

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pickslide View Post
    Not terribly familiar with Georgia's Stand Your Ground provision, but I'm assuming that, as usual when a media story highlights it, it won't apply.

    Seems like this was completely unnecessary, even absent Stand Your Ground. Seems very incriminating to me he shot an old man that he actually knew. Just trigger happy.

    TK
    Actually it was the Sheriff that knew the victim from church, not the shooter.

    And if this guy was so threatened, don't gun users know how to maybe pop off a warning shot or maybe one shot to a leg or foot.

    First reaction is to pump four rounds right into someone.

    Poor old guy must have roused the shooter away from an episode of The Walking Dead or something.

  7. #7
    Good Enough pickslide's Avatar
    Join Date
    02.02.04
    Age
    49
    Location
    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts
    1,861
    Favorite VH Album

    Fair Warning
    Favorite VH Song

    Mean Street
    Last Online

    12.14.17 @ 01:09 PM
    Likes
    799
    Liked 801 Times in 436 Posts


    Premium Member

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Number 47 View Post
    Actually it was the Sheriff that knew the victim from church, not the shooter.

    And if this guy was so threatened, don't gun users know how to maybe pop off a warning shot or maybe one shot to a leg or foot.

    First reaction is to pump four rounds right into someone.

    Poor old guy must have roused the shooter away from an episode of The Walking Dead or something.
    Ah, misread that. Thanks for the correction.

    I'm no expert, but most cops and defense course instructors that I've talked to say don't fire a weapon as a warning. Shoot to kill or mame. Most will say don't "wing" a guy. Shoot for the thoracic cavity and hope for a sudden drop in blood pressure that drops the intruder. But those same people will say do not take the gun out until you are ready and willing to use it, meaning the gun should be a last resort, not the first response.

    Maybe the story is being spun. But it sounds like the guy overreacted.

    TK

  8. #8
    ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ Number 47's Avatar
    Join Date
    10.08.06
    Posts
    29,877
    Last Online

    12.15.17 @ 09:32 PM
    Likes
    1,881
    Liked 6,846 Times in 3,584 Posts


    Premium Member

    Default

    Shooting of Georgia Alzheimer's patient reignites 'Stand Your Ground' debate



    A Georgia sheriff's department is still deciding whether to take legal action against a man who shot and killed a 72-year-old Alzheimer's patient whom he thought was a prowler.

    The Nov. 27 death of Ron Westbrook has re-ignited the debate over "Stand Your Ground" laws.

    Investigators said that Westbrook had walked nearly three miles in sub-freezing temperatures and was lost and confused when he knocked on the door of home of Joe Hendrix's fiancé just before 4 a.m. Hendrix was asleep in the house when Westbrook came calling, but went outside to confront whom he thought was an intruder.

    "[Hendrix] ordered him to raise his hands, yelled, 'Who are you? What are you doing here?'" Walker County Sheriff Steve Wilson told MyFoxAtlanta.com.

    Hendrix told investigators that the shadowy figure didn't speak and wouldn't stop walking towards him
    , so he shot him four times.

    Authorities said that Westbrook's case of Alzheimer's was so advanced that at times he could barely speak. He was wearing a light jacket on the night he was shot.

    In the wake of Westbrook's death, the question has become whether Hendrix will face charges. So far in the investigation, authorities have neither made an arrest nor pressed any charges.

    "By him going outside his home, he didn't break any laws," Wilson said. "He chose to go out. Me personally, I wish he'd have stayed inside."

    Attorney Lance LoRusso told MyFoxAtlanta that Hendrix was in the right to go outside and confront Westbrook under Georgia's "Stand Your Ground" law. A similar law in Florida gained national attention during the trial of neighborhood watch volunteer George Zimmerman for second-degree murder in the death of 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, though the law was not a part of Zimmerman's defense strategy.

    "You don't have a duty to retreat if, number one, you're in a lawful activity at the time," said LoRusso. "And number two, you're in a place where you have a lawful right to be."

    However, LoRusso said a different set of laws spelled out whether he was in the right to use deadly force. The criteria include, "If you're protecting yourself, you're protecting a third person from an imminent threat of serious bodily injury or death, or you're protecting someone from a forcible felony being committed."

    LoRusso believes a grand jury will ultimately decide whether to charge Hendrix with a crime in relation to the shooting.

    "We're going to have people looking at things like proximity between [Hendrix] and the person who was shot," he said. "You're going to have [to decide] things like what actions were taken, what words were used."

    The decision whether to proceed will be taken by the county's District Attorney after a meeting with the sheriff's office.

    http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/12/04...ground-debate/

  9. #9
    Good Enough pickslide's Avatar
    Join Date
    02.02.04
    Age
    49
    Location
    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts
    1,861
    Favorite VH Album

    Fair Warning
    Favorite VH Song

    Mean Street
    Last Online

    12.14.17 @ 01:09 PM
    Likes
    799
    Liked 801 Times in 436 Posts


    Premium Member

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Number 47 View Post
    Shooting of Georgia Alzheimer's patient reignites 'Stand Your Ground' debate



    A Georgia sheriff's department is still deciding whether to take legal action against a man who shot and killed a 72-year-old Alzheimer's patient whom he thought was a prowler.

    The Nov. 27 death of Ron Westbrook has re-ignited the debate over "Stand Your Ground" laws.

    Investigators said that Westbrook had walked nearly three miles in sub-freezing temperatures and was lost and confused when he knocked on the door of home of Joe Hendrix's fiancé just before 4 a.m. Hendrix was asleep in the house when Westbrook came calling, but went outside to confront whom he thought was an intruder.

    "[Hendrix] ordered him to raise his hands, yelled, 'Who are you? What are you doing here?'" Walker County Sheriff Steve Wilson told MyFoxAtlanta.com.

    Hendrix told investigators that the shadowy figure didn't speak and wouldn't stop walking towards him
    , so he shot him four times.

    Authorities said that Westbrook's case of Alzheimer's was so advanced that at times he could barely speak. He was wearing a light jacket on the night he was shot.

    In the wake of Westbrook's death, the question has become whether Hendrix will face charges. So far in the investigation, authorities have neither made an arrest nor pressed any charges.

    "By him going outside his home, he didn't break any laws," Wilson said. "He chose to go out. Me personally, I wish he'd have stayed inside."

    Attorney Lance LoRusso told MyFoxAtlanta that Hendrix was in the right to go outside and confront Westbrook under Georgia's "Stand Your Ground" law. A similar law in Florida gained national attention during the trial of neighborhood watch volunteer George Zimmerman for second-degree murder in the death of 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, though the law was not a part of Zimmerman's defense strategy.

    "You don't have a duty to retreat if, number one, you're in a lawful activity at the time," said LoRusso. "And number two, you're in a place where you have a lawful right to be."

    However, LoRusso said a different set of laws spelled out whether he was in the right to use deadly force. The criteria include, "If you're protecting yourself, you're protecting a third person from an imminent threat of serious bodily injury or death, or you're protecting someone from a forcible felony being committed."

    LoRusso believes a grand jury will ultimately decide whether to charge Hendrix with a crime in relation to the shooting.

    "We're going to have people looking at things like proximity between [Hendrix] and the person who was shot," he said. "You're going to have [to decide] things like what actions were taken, what words were used."

    The decision whether to proceed will be taken by the county's District Attorney after a meeting with the sheriff's office.

    http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/12/04...ground-debate/
    Going outside to "confront" the intruder was stupid. He knocked on the door, for Christ's sake. Call the police, move back into the house and wait.

    Some of you gun people have to know more about this than me. Wouldn't a defense instructor say to find cover, stay armed and wait for police help unless absolutely necessary?

    TK

  10. #10
    Atomic Punk bklynboy68's Avatar
    Join Date
    01.10.12
    Posts
    18,835
    Favorite VH Album

    The Magnificent 7
    Last Online

    12.15.17 @ 04:49 PM
    Likes
    12,920
    Liked 11,777 Times in 6,523 Posts


    Premium Member

    Default

    This is not a "Stand Your Ground" case. It's getting silly now how they try to describe every shooting as such. Also, warning shots and 'shoot to wound' are in the movies.
     "He has a swaggering retro machismo that will give hives to the Steinem cabal" -Camille Paglia on Donald Trump

    "Make way for the bad guy"- Tony Montana

    'This hamburger don't need no helper"- David Lee Roth

    "I wish Bon Jovi would've given me a call before he recorded all of his hits, because the lyrics would've been smarter, the melodies would've been much more smashing, and they would've sold a lot fewer records." -David Lee Roth

    "My beef is people thinking Bon Jovi is good cuz they sold lots of records to housewives." -tango

    "But being number one doesn’t really mean jack fuck all. We sold twice as many records as other records that year (1984) that landed in the Number One position." ~Eddie Van Halen

  11. #11
    ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ Number 47's Avatar
    Join Date
    10.08.06
    Posts
    29,877
    Last Online

    12.15.17 @ 09:32 PM
    Likes
    1,881
    Liked 6,846 Times in 3,584 Posts


    Premium Member

    Default

    I'll bet the old man saw a shadowy figure also.


  12. #12
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
    Join Date
    06.05.03
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    13,990
    Last Online

    12.15.17 @ 02:13 PM
    Likes
    816
    Liked 3,116 Times in 1,827 Posts


    Premium Member

    Default Stand Your Ground...Even Against Alzheimer's Patient..

    If it is your house/property and you feel an imminent threat of great bodily harm, you have no duty to retreat. The key there is imminent threat.

    This is more fundamental than stand your ground which pushes no duty to retreat to anywhere someone is lawfully allowed to be.

    The former, known as the castle doctrine, is a response to intruders getting shot after breaking into homes and then suing. It makes sense that you wouldn't have a duty to retreat from your own home.

    That said, that is different, IMO, than going outside, putting a gun on an unarmed man, then shooting. On the other hand, the 3am "distressed citizen" knocking on the door is a tactic of home invaders to rush you after you open the door. Obviously that didn't happen here, and as a gun owner you must be responsible enough to recognize the situation.

    I will say this: My cousin lives in Atlanta and his view on shooting people on his property is much different than mine. He came out to visit last June. I remember this vividly. We were in line for the Twilight Zone Tower of Terror at Disney California Adventure and he was telling me how he noticed people from the power company were on his property. He went out and approached them. He was told they had every right to be there. He said that is true as long as he is notified first and he wasn't. They wouldn't leave. He called the power company and complained. He told them that the next time he isn't notified and he sees people on his property "dressed" as power workers, he's taking no chances with a wife and two young daughters at home. The next phone call to the power company would be to tell them to pick up the bodies.

    I have a feeling that that is not an uncommon attitude in the south.

 

 

Similar Threads

  1. Mosque near Ground Zero to open on 9-11-11
    By voivod in forum VH Fans Meeting Place (Non-Music)
    Replies: 204
    Last Post: 04.29.13, 06:28 AM
  2. More From On The Ground In Iraq (Two Updates)
    By Axxman300 in forum VH Fans Meeting Place (Non-Music)
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 09.27.07, 09:21 AM
  3. Alzheimer's Disease...
    By ebmm_axis in forum VH Fans Meeting Place (Non-Music)
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 01.26.05, 09:34 AM
  4. Planet Us getting off the ground?
    By Eddymon in forum Main VH Discussion
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 12.12.02, 01:58 AM
  5. Home Ground (rare fair warning)
    By Eddie_italian in forum Bootleg Network
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 10.16.00, 10:51 AM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •