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    Default Are business's responsible for creating jobs?

    This question was asked at a lecture i attended.
    WOW I can’t believe that this is even a question. How can anyone truly believe that it is the responsibility of business’s to create jobs? A business is created to generate a return on investment for the business’s owner(s)/investors. In general, the more successful and profitable a business is the business will grow. The growth of the business will lead to the creation of jobs. It is a business’s responsibility to treat employees fair and to fairly compensate the employee(s) for the work being performed however, it is not the responsibility of a business to create jobs and to retain or pay for employees if employee expenses cause a negative effect on the financial health of the business. It is very simple economics; if the cost of a job position exceeds the cost or benefit to the business then that job should be eliminated. On the flip side, if a business cannot be successful by fairly compensating employees then the business should fail. As a country though we are “regulating” away the ability for companies to exist and that hurts everyone.

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    If every business eliminated jobs the second they become a drain, you'd be sitting on 30% + unemployment.

    The answer to the question is yes. If the answer is no. Then the follow up is who is responsible? And you don't want the answer to be government.

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    Quote Originally Posted by It's Mike View Post
    If every business eliminated jobs the second they become a drain, you'd be sitting on 30% + unemployment.

    The answer to the question is yes. If the answer is no. Then the follow up is who is responsible? And you don't want the answer to be government.
    I think that's making it too simple. A company may keep a job filled if it is being a drain, if in the future it may not be. That's okay to do, because sometimes the cost of filling the job again will cost the company more money than simply keeping the job filled for a couple of months--especially if hiring someone new requires training to get the same output as the person currently performing in the position.

    Companies are not responsible for creating jobs because they should never be compelled to create a job simply because someone needs a paycheck. That's completely inefficient and does a disservice to the company itself, and ultimately, other employees and consumers. The OP covered it pretty well, that the responsibility of a company is only to create value for its stakeholders.

    Government is only responsible (at least in the United States) to create the most efficient environment for the market to operate in. "Make work" projects (as well as "shovel ready") are complete failures in getting the economy moving again.

    The real answer is that no one is responsible for creating jobs. Job creation is a result of everyone doing what they are responsible for, and doing it well.
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    I'd like to know what was being discussed when the question was raised. But in a general sense, the private sector is "responsible" for job creation (at least it better be).

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    Would you start a business that cost you money? Would you hire an employee you couldn’t afford? A business wouldn’t last long if that is how you run a business. A business doesn’t “have to” hire employees; therefor it is not the responsibility of a business to create jobs. Job creation is a positive by-product of a successful and growing business. To even suggest that it is a “responsibility” to hire employees just because you have a business is economic suicide.
    The responsibility of government to businesses is to ensure and enforce fair business practices AND to ensure a fair business environment that allows good business to grow and succeed creating jobs and to allow bad business fail.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WhenPushComesToMud View Post
    Would you start a business that cost you money? Would you hire an employee you couldn’t afford? A business wouldn’t last long if that is how you run a business. A business doesn’t “have to” hire employees; therefor it is not the responsibility of a business to create jobs. Job creation is a positive by-product of a successful and growing business. To even suggest that it is a “responsibility” to hire employees just because you have a business is economic suicide.
    The responsibility of government to businesses is to ensure and enforce fair business practices AND to ensure a fair business environment that allows good business to grow and succeed creating jobs and to allow bad business fail.

    I don't know where you're going with this. I am not saying that business should hire staff they don't need just because I think they should. I'm saying that business is responsible for job creation. And they are. You don't get jobs created with businesses. This is why I'm asking how this came up. The simple answer is yes. But it's a stupid question if is asked in the manner you mentioned it.

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    Atomic Punk bsbll4's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by It's Mike View Post
    I'd like to know what was being discussed when the question was raised. But in a general sense, the private sector is "responsible" for job creation (at least it better be).
    Not to go all Slick Willy on you, but I guess it depends on what your definition of "responsibility" is. Is the private sector compelled to hire people as their duty? No. Should they be the major driver of job growth? Absolutely.

    Based on the OP's post, I took it to mean the discussion was whether companies are compelled to hire people as some form of patriotic responsibility.

    I would agree with you if are saying government should not be the one "responsible" for hiring people simply to create jobs. That doesn't end well for anyone.
    CNN may think my opinion matters, but you shouldn't.

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    Quote Originally Posted by It's Mike View Post
    I'd like to know what was being discussed when the question was raised. But in a general sense, the private sector is "responsible" for job creation (at least it better be).
    The context of the discussion was minimum wage increases, the increase in health care cost to businesses and other cost increases to businesses caused by the new laws and regulations being implemented by the government. When many of the business owners stated that they would have to downsize, cut cost and in some cases close their doors all together, the statement was made that it is the responsibility for businesses to create jobs and hire people. They went on to say that business owners were greedy and rich and that they had a responsibility to their employees and community first and any profits made by the company above a certain percentage should be funneled back to the employees and community. And it was the responsibility of the government to ensure that business comply.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WhenPushComesToMud View Post
    The context of the discussion was minimum wage increases, the increase in health care cost to businesses and other cost increases to businesses caused by the new laws and regulations being implemented by the government. When many of the business owners stated that they would have to downsize, cut cost and in some cases close their doors all together, the statement was made that it is the responsibility for businesses to create jobs and hire people. They went on to say that business owners were greedy and rich and that they had a responsibility to their employees and community first and any profits made by the company above a certain percentage should be funneled back to the employees and community. And it was the responsibility of the government to ensure that business comply.
    in what part of North Korea are you studying?

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    Quote Originally Posted by bsbll4 View Post
    Not to go all Slick Willy on you, but I guess it depends on what your definition of "responsibility" is. Is the private sector compelled to hire people as their duty? No. Should they be the major driver of job growth? Absolutely.

    Based on the OP's post, I took it to mean the discussion was whether companies are compelled to hire people as some form of patriotic responsibility.

    I would agree with you if are saying government should not be the one "responsible" for hiring people simply to create jobs. That doesn't end well for anyone.
    Patriotic responsibility (in my opinion) should serve as a factor. It should not be the primary factor. IE if an American Company A can hire an Indian call agent for X dollars and can hire an American call agent for the slightest bit more then I think they should hire the American. Having a successful business comes with it a certain level of corporate responsibility. But is seems that the discussion was far beyond what a normal person would consider being a moral entity.

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    Quote Originally Posted by It's Mike View Post
    Patriotic responsibility (in my opinion) should serve as a factor. It should not be the primary factor. IE if an American Company A can hire an Indian call agent for X dollars and can hire an American call agent for the slightest bit more then I think they should hire the American. Having a successful business comes with it a certain level of corporate responsibility. But is seems that the discussion was far beyond what a normal person would consider being a moral entity.
    I think we can all agree with your example, but I don't think that's what the OP was implying.

    I know you said it sounds like North Korea, but when it's a commonly held belief with some people that paying the most in taxes possible is a "patriotic" responsibility, it's not a giant leap to get to the thinking that a business should purposely hurt itself for the good of the people.
    CNN may think my opinion matters, but you shouldn't.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bsbll4 View Post
    I think we can all agree with your example, but I don't think that's what the OP was implying.

    I know you said it sounds like North Korea, but when it's a commonly held belief with some people that paying the most in taxes possible is a "patriotic" responsibility, it's not a giant leap to get to the thinking that a business should purposely hurt itself for the good of the people.
    I just think the question was incredibly vague. There a thousand instances were a company would be well served to keep people hired even if cost them X dollars. But, no that shouldn't be the rule.

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    Are Companies Responsible for Creating Jobs?
    John Bussey - The Wall Street Journal
    October 28, 2011

    For anyone stepping gingerly through the encampment of Occupy Wall Street in Manhattan, it might be easy to dismiss the protest as just a living diorama of a 1960s Happening. That is, were it not for its intriguing challenge to American business, and Milton Friedman.

    Let's stipulate that the demonstrators have a fuzzy agenda. It's a smorgasbord of gripes ranging from income inequality to poor housing to executive pay—viewed as out of touch with executive value, which maybe we should stipulate too. The protest is diffuse, and young, and cohabitating under tarps. A passerby guiding his three children through the thicket of tents is overheard saying to his wife: "Let's get outta here before the kids see something they shouldn't."

    But what about one of the group's chief beefs: that business is falling short of its social responsibility, including creating jobs at home? Some politicians have given a nod of legitimacy to the protests. A CNN poll found that 32% of Americans favor the demonstrations while many others are still making up their minds.

    Milton Friedman, the Nobel laureate economist, blasted the very idea of corporate social responsibility four decades ago, calling it a "fundamentally subversive doctrine." Speaking for many capitalists then and now, he said, "there is one and only one social responsibility of business—to use its resources and engage in activities designed to increase its profits so long as it stays within the rules of the game."

    Companies shouldn't spend profits on unrelated job creation or social causes, he said. That money should go to shareholders—the owners of the companies. Pronouncements about corporate social responsibility, he added, are the indulgence of "pontificating executives" who are "incredibly shortsighted and muddleheaded in matters that are outside their businesses." And that indulgence can lead to inefficient markets.

    What then to make of Howard Schultz, the chief executive of Starbucks, who in a letter earlier this month to fellow business leaders asked them to help "get Americans back to work and our economy growing again."

    He described Starbucks's own growth and hiring plans—a net of several thousand new jobs—and announced a $5 million donation by the Starbucks Foundation to a group that helps finance local businesses. Starbucks will also encourage customers and employees to donate. He's calling the program "Create Jobs for USA." Occupy Wall Street would like this.

    In a blog post last week, Mr. Schultz elbowed aside Mr. Friedman's triumph of profit: "Companies that hold on to the old-school, singular view of limiting their responsibilities to making a profit will not only discover it is a shallow goal but an unsustainable one," the post on the Harvard Business Review website read. "Values increasingly drive consumer and employee loyalties. Money and talent will follow those companies whose values are compatible."

    Is this just window dressing, a new spin on PR and marketing? A group of CEOs and executives from large companies, including Exxon, Cisco and McDonald's, echo Mr. Schultz's view, though perhaps with a tighter link between largess and corporate self interest.

    The group, through their New York-based Committee Encouraging Corporate Philanthropy, highlights projects such as Wal-Mart's effort to reduce packaging in its supply chain (good for the environment, good for Wal-Mart's costs); IBM's "Service Corps," which sends young executives to help developing countries (good for the countries, good for scouting for future IBM business) and PepsiCo's program to train corn farmers in Mexico (good for the farmers, good for PepsiCo, which needed an improved supply of corn).

    To do it right, the group says, companies should pick issues that "are integral to the achievement of larger business goals...issues that drive growth or reduce costs" and also help society. That's a higher bar than pure charity.

    John Mackey, co-chief executive of Whole Foods, goes a bit farther. In a duel with Mr. Friedman in an issue of Reason magazine in 2005, he wrote: "From an investor's perspective, the purpose of the business is to maximize profits. But that's not the purpose for other stakeholders—for customers, employees, suppliers and the community. Each of those groups will define the purpose of the business in terms of its own needs and desires, and each perspective is valid and legitimate."

    In that exchange, Mr. Friedman acknowledged the value of corporate goodwill in a community—and tending to it—and counseled business to stick to a tight definition of shareholder interest.

    Mr. Friedman died the following year, but clearly his ideas on the subject didn't. Economic growth creates jobs, not the other way around, his adherents say. And it helps if government regulates less.

    "Jobs are an input, not an output; they're a cost of doing business, not a goal of doing business," says William Frezza, a Boston-based venture capitalist and fellow at the Competitive Enterprise Institute.

    "From the perspective of defending capitalism, if you accept the premise of your opponent that business has to give back to society, you've already lost," he says. "To put sack cloth and ashes on—you've delegitimized capitalism, which is the goal of the protesters. Businesses give back to society every day by pleasing their customers and employing their employees. There's nothing business owes other than selling the best product at the best price."

    Down at the demonstration, they've broken out the incense and are starting the drum-athon again.

    Over at Starbucks, Mr. Schultz is counseling his fellow CEOs that "business leaders have to step up and do our part."

    And across America, the 14 million unemployed are waiting for someone to be right.

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    Everyone is looking at it incorrectly in my mind.

    Is their responsibility? No.

    Is it an ESSENTIAL by-product of well functioning business? Absolutely. As businesses grow, they create jobs, growing profitable businesses are a key to the captitalistic model, and when they are successful job creation takes care of itself.

    Everyone seems to phrase their questions and arguments that profitable healthy companies and hiring employees are contradictory, when in fact they go hand in hand.
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    Is the population responsible for creating less people?

 

 

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