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  1. #1
    Atomic Punk bklynboy68's Avatar
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    Default Lesbian Activist: GAY MARRIAGE FIGHT IS A LIE TO DESTROY MARRIAGE

    A 2012 speech by Masha Gessen, an author and outspoken activist for the LGBT community, is just now going viral and it includes a theory that many supporters of traditional marriage have speculated about for years: The push for gay marriage has less to do with the right to marry – it is about diminishing and eventually destroying the institution of marriage and redefining the “traditional family.”


    The subject of gay marriage stirs powerful reactions on both sides of the argument. There are those who argue that legalizing it would diminish traditional marriage. And those advocating for gay marriage have long stated that the issue will not harm traditional marriage.Ms. Gessen’s comments on the subject seem to contradict the pro-gay-marriage party lines.

    Gessen shared her views on the subject and very specifically stated;

    “Gay marriage is a lie.”

    “Fighting for gay marriage generally involves lying about what we’re going to do with marriage when we get there.”

    “It’s a no-brainer that the institution of marriage should not exist.” (This statement is met with very loud applause.)


    As mentioned above, Gessen also talked about redefining the traditional family. This may have something to do with the fact that she has “three children with five parents”:

    “I don’t see why they (her children) shouldn’t have five parents legally. I don’t see why we should choose two of those parents and make them a sanctioned couple.”

    The entire presentation is here, but the most curious portion starts about six minutes into the the audio:



    The excerpt above was recorded on May 19, 2012 when Ms. Gessen appeared at the Sydney Writer’s Festival on a panel titled,“Why Get Married When You Can Be Happy?” She has been speaking on the subject of gay marriage, gay divorce, her curious custody situation and more for many years.
    Last edited by bklynboy68; 04.29.13 at 03:05 PM.
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  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by bklynboy68 View Post
    A 2012 speech by Masha Gessen, an author and outspoken activist for the LGBT community, is just now going viral and it includes a theory that many supporters of traditional marriage have speculated about for years: The push for gay marriage has less to do with the right to marry it is about diminishing and eventually destroying the institution of marriage and redefining the traditional family.


    The subject of gay marriage stirs powerful reactions on both sides of the argument. There are those who argue that legalizing it would diminish traditional marriage. And those advocating for gay marriage have long stated that the issue will not harm traditional marriage.Ms. Gessens comments on the subject seem to contradict the pro-gay-marriage party lines.

    Gessen shared her views on the subject and very specifically stated;

    Gay marriage is a lie.

    Fighting for gay marriage generally involves lying about what were going to do with marriage when we get there.

    Its a no-brainer that the institution of marriage should not exist. (This statement is met with very loud applause.)


    As mentioned above, Gessen also talked about redefining the traditional family. This may have something to do with the fact that she has three children with five parents:

    I dont see why they (her children) shouldnt have five parents legally. I dont see why we should choose two of those parents and make them a sanctioned couple.

    The entire presentation is here, but the most curious portion starts about six minutes into the the audio:



    The excerpt above was recorded on May 19, 2012 when Ms. Gessen appeared at the Sydney Writers Festival on a panel titled,Why Get Married When You Can Be Happy? She has been speaking on the subject of gay marriage, gay divorce, her curious custody situation and more for many years.
    This is bullshit.

    Do you really believe that gay people just don't want to get married like everyone else? Do you really believe gay people are just out to "destroy marriage?"

    If you honestly look... It's the straight people that are destroying marriage. Something like 50% of people are getting divorces.... Mostly straight people. Yet, all the gays just want to destroy marriage. If they want that, all they have to do is sit back and wait because the straight people are doing a good job of destroying it themselves.
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  3. #3
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    A thing for me is that while I doubt I will ever get married, for those of who do, I lose respect for them if they get married many times over. If people can break that kind of commitment over and over again, I have to say that I have trouble seeing them as reliable people. Marriage actually does mean something to me even if I never actually get married.
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    "I have never seen it, but by all accounts it is terrible. However, I have seen the house that it built and it is terrific."

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  4. #4
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    Fuck this thread right from the start.

  5. #5
    Gird your loins Daisy Hill's Avatar
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  6. #6
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  7. #7
    ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ Number 47's Avatar
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    Missing from the original post:

    Link to The Blaze article. Please be sure to watch the Glenn Beck video and read the comments that follow the story.

    http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013...troy-marriage/

    Complete audio from 2012 Sydney Writers Festival

    This is just a short cut to what is included in The Blaze article.

    http://mpegmedia.abc.net.au/rn/podca...20611_0905.mp3

    There's absolutely nothing curious about Gessen's comments. Well... maybe there is when you edit it out of the entire rather lighthearted discussion and twist it to fit the agenda that marriage is under attack.
    Last edited by Number 47; 04.30.13 at 03:52 AM.

  8. #8
    Atomic Punk edwardv's Avatar
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    If you look at divorce rates and the number of repeat marriages that don't last the institution has been under attack for a long time. Its not for everyone homo or hetero .
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  9. #9
    Atomic Punk ziggysmalls's Avatar
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    There are extremists on both side of the fence and I hate them both. I have zero problem with gays wanting to be married. Not enough zest to go out an blast conservatives for preventing it but I also don't want to stand in their way. That said I understand why people have problems with gays being married. Who am I to say "well you are just an ignorant asshole who isn't tolerant?" That doesn't solve anything. just makes them dig their heels in.


    What gays, lesbians, proponents of gay marriage, etc need to do is show the afraid there is nothing to be of scared of. Change their opinions by your actions. Not by acting like a left wing nut or defending those who spout extremist held opinions like the women in this article.

    I love how they want everybody to be tolerant of their opinions yet they hold no tolerance to those who oppose them. Fucking hypocrites. The right shows the same hypocrisy preventing gays to marry claiming it is sacred yet they divorce freely.

    Sorry for my rant. Just hate the fact that people can't even respect an opposing opinion anymore. Everything just falls under right wing/left wing propaganda. Glenn Beck is an ass but there are asses on the left too.

  10. #10
    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    A lady down our street hired a private investigator to follow her husband.

    Found out he was going to a sex club in DC and ass fucking anonymous women while other people watched.

    I think heterosexuals are doing just fine destroying marriage all by themselves, they don't even need the help.

    I can't even look at the guy anymore.
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  11. #11
    Atomic Punk bklynboy68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Number 47 View Post
    Missing from the original post:

    Link to The Blaze article. Please be sure to watch the Glenn Beck video and read the comments that follow the story.

    http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013...troy-marriage/

    Complete audio from 2012 Sydney Writers Festival

    This is just a short cut to what is included in The Blaze article.

    http://mpegmedia.abc.net.au/rn/podca...20611_0905.mp3

    There's absolutely nothing curious about Gessen's comments. Well... maybe there is when you edit it out of the entire rather lighthearted discussion and twist it to fit the agenda that marriage is under attack.

    What was twisted? Those are her words and opinions. The link to the entire podcast was included in the article I just forgot to post them. You're right, it was a lighthearted open and honest conversation and she layed out how she felt. I found it curious that an LGBT activist agreed with an accusation that has been leveled at the movement from the start. So did the host when she opened by saying that there are many diverse opinions in the discussion about this issue.

    Btw, I have said before that I believe that government has no right to be involved in marriage. Therefore, everyone should be with whoever they want.
    Last edited by bklynboy68; 04.30.13 at 06:32 AM.
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  12. #12
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    I have NO WISH to offend anybody here - truly - so I apologise in advance if I do; I'm just trying to stumble my way through some thoughts I have on this issue...

    My thinking is that the institution of marriage is a little bit like Freemasonry...It's an ancient tradition, born out of beliefs held sacred to many, it has long-standing, well-established and much-loved roots in society - in this case the heterosexual majority. And like Freemasonry, it's seen almost like a club to which only certain people can gain access - and its that exclusivity that is cherished by those who are part of it. Women can whinge and moan all they like about not being allowed access to the all-male bastion of the Masonic Lodge - but aren't those men entitled to something of their very own? Women have the option to set up an all-female equivalent - and they have, in the form of the Women's Institute, for example. The reason I draw this comparison is that I CAN see why heterosexual couples might feel like something very precious and unique to them and them alone is being altered in some very real and fundamental way - and that is naturally quite worrisome for a lot of them.

    Now, that is not to say - and I emphasise this - that gay 'marriage' (please forgive the use of inverted commas: I use them only to show that alternative terminology could perhaps be utilised) shouldn't be its own institution, with its own conventions and traditions - and, MOST IMPORTANTLY, the same legal standing as its heterosexual equivalent - of course it can - and it should! It's disgraceful, for example, that whilst a heterosexual couple can leave each other their worldly goods in their wills, tax-free, the same doesn't apply to homosexual couples. That is BLATANTLY wrong and discriminatory.

    Where I think a compromise can and should be reached is in the terminology and the appropriation of certain traditions / conventions. I suppose I'm not really sure WHY gay couples would want to necessarily call their unions, 'marriage', with all its long-established connotations... Why not celebrate the DIFFERENCE, rather than want it to be the SAME (when ,as others have said, it so clearly isn't working in so many ways?)

    At the end of the day, what's in a word? I suppose I can see both sides here - and what I would dearly like is for a mutually satisfactory compromise to be reached - just like we have with FreeMasons and the Women's Institute - separate, distinct, but EQUAL.
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  13. #13
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    Give them "civil unions" with all of the benefits of "marriage" but for the sake of the other side of this coin, do not call it marriage when referring to homos.

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  14. #14
    Atomic Punk bsbll4's Avatar
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    I'm curious to see what will happen after gay marriage is law of the land (because it will be eventually...it's inevitable). Will there be a similar push for polygamous marriages? Will there be a similar push for incestuous marriages? I know they both sound stupid, but the push for gay marriage is that it's all about love, and that if people love each other and want to commit themselves to each other, why should government step in the way? It's hard to argue against that. I'm just not sure there is a legal argument against either incest or polygamy besides they are both "icky" to the average person--which is what prevents gay marriage from popular acceptance.

    Polygamy can be done on a legal level as a person can enter in to multiple "contracts" as it is. If you turn marriage into a strictly "civil union" where it's simply a contract between two people, then there isn't anything preventing multiple people from entering that type of arrangement. After all, if we are "changing the definition of marriage" as those on the right like to say from a "union between a man and a woman" to a "union between two people," why can't you change it further to a "union between multiple people?"

    The only argument against incest is that we, as a society, wouldn't want offspring from such an arrangemnet. But would that mean if it's incest between two people of the same sex (where offspring isn't biologically possible) that it should be allowed? If not, why not?

    I guess my point is that relying on the government to define marriage is a recipe for a mess. Marriage is a religious concept. It's only appropriated by the government to sort contracts, taxes, and chain of custody. Frankly, everyone should have a civil union, men and women included. If you want to get "married," you need to go to the church for that.
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  15. #15
    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bsbll4 View Post
    I'm curious to see what will happen after gay marriage is law of the land (because it will be eventually...it's inevitable). Will there be a similar push for polygamous marriages? Will there be a similar push for incestuous marriages? I know they both sound stupid, but the push for gay marriage is that it's all about love, and that if people love each other and want to commit themselves to each other, why should government step in the way? It's hard to argue against that. I'm just not sure there is a legal argument against either incest or polygamy besides they are both "icky" to the average person--which is what prevents gay marriage from popular acceptance.



    Polygamy can be done on a legal level as a person can enter in to multiple "contracts" as it is. If you turn marriage into a strictly "civil union" where it's simply a contract between two people, then there isn't anything preventing multiple people from entering that type of arrangement. After all, if we are "changing the definition of marriage" as those on the right like to say from a "union between a man and a woman" to a "union between two people," why can't you change it further to a "union between multiple people?"



    The only argument against incest is that we, as a society, wouldn't want offspring from such an arrangemnet. But would that mean if it's incest between two people of the same sex (where offspring isn't biologically possible) that it should be allowed? If not, why not?



    I guess my point is that relying on the government to define marriage is a recipe for a mess. Marriage is a religious concept. It's only appropriated by the government to sort contracts, taxes, and chain of custody. Frankly, everyone should have a civil union, men and women included. If you want to get "married," you need to go to the church for that.
    We've had it here for years. No real impact on anyone else.

 

 

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