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  1. #1
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    Default MSNBC: Kids don't just belong to their parents

    "So part of it is to break through our kind of private idea that kids belong to their parents..."

    Last edited by lovemachine97(Version 2); 04.08.13 at 10:13 AM.

  2. #2
    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
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    nothing wrong with the idea in theory. My wife (a teacher) refers to her students as "her kids". That's as it should be, there should be that sort of connection between a teacher and his/her students since they probably spend as much time with those kids as many of their parents do.

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    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    They can start helping out by sending me a check every month.

    The rest I have covered.
    Taylor Swift is nice to look at. Adele can sing.

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  4. #4
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    I think of them as "my students," not "my kids". Part of that is secondary versus elementary thinking. But to me, saying that raising kids is a shared responsibility and that they don't fully belong to you is a way to A) excuse dead beat parents (Go ahead, Black fathers. 70% illegitimacy is no big deal because they're not your kids. They're our responsibility), and B) disengage parents from their child's education (Once you drop them off at school their our kids, pay no attention to what they're being taught).

    One word for this ad? Creepy.

  5. #5
    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lovemachine97(Version 2) View Post
    I think of them as "my students," not "my kids". Part of that is secondary versus elementary thinking. But to me, saying that raising kids is a shared responsibility and that they don't fully belong to you is a way to A) excuse dead beat parents (Go ahead, Black fathers. 70% illegitimacy is no big deal because they're not your kids. They're our responsibility), and B) disengage parents from their child's education (Once you drop them off at school their our kids, pay no attention to what they're being taught).

    One word for this ad? Creepy.
    certainly high school / elementary thing, yeah.

    It's not a shared responsibility, no. But they do share in the actual raising of the kids though, if that makes sense.

    My wife and I are not the only ones who will raise our kids. We're a big part of it, grandparents have a role, teachers have a role, lot of different poeple do. We're the only ones who have to I guess is your point.

    I really wish school boards and governments would start doing real world ads though instead of these "we all raise your kids". How bout a "if you don't plan on being a father then don't knock anyone up asshole" campaign? That would be a nice start. How bout a "if you're not in a committed relationship with this dude then stopping banging him" tv spot? These would be good ideas. Or "if you're on welfare and you get pregnant, you're on your own people" movement.

  6. #6
    Atomic Punk bsbll4's Avatar
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    So do our kids belong to the State? Is this like a joint custody thing or something?

    Creepy indeed. I know you're never supposed to bring up Nazis when discussing anything on the internet, but man...that's the kind of thinking they (and the Soviet bloc) used.

    No thanks. My kids belong to me, exclusively. It may take a "village" to raise a child, but last time I checked, our collective "village" is completely fucked up. No thanks, I'll raise my own kid.
    CNN may think my opinion matters, but you shouldn't.

  7. #7
    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bsbll4 View Post
    It may take a "village" to raise a child, but last time I checked, our collective "village" is completely fucked up. No thanks, I'll raise my own kid.

  8. #8
    Atomic Punk bklynboy68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lovemachine97(Version 2) View Post
    I think of them as "my students," not "my kids". Part of that is secondary versus elementary thinking. But to me, saying that raising kids is a shared responsibility and that they don't fully belong to you is a way to A) excuse dead beat parents (Go ahead, Black fathers. 70% illegitimacy is no big deal because they're not your kids. They're our responsibility), and B) disengage parents from their child's education (Once you drop them off at school their our kids, pay no attention to what they're being taught).

    One word for this ad? Creepy.
    She says , "We haven't had a very collective notion of these are our children" . Gee, I wonder why? I can't believe this racist is still on the air. Wait, yes I can believe it.

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  9. #9
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by It's Mike View Post
    certainly high school / elementary thing, yeah.

    It's not a shared responsibility, no. But they do share in the actual raising of the kids though, if that makes sense.

    My wife and I are not the only ones who will raise our kids. We're a big part of it, grandparents have a role, teachers have a role, lot of different poeple do. We're the only ones who have to I guess is your point.

    I really wish school boards and governments would start doing real world ads though instead of these "we all raise your kids". How bout a "if you don't plan on being a father then don't knock anyone up asshole" campaign? That would be a nice start. How bout a "if you're not in a committed relationship with this dude then stopping banging him" tv spot? These would be good ideas. Or "if you're on welfare and you get pregnant, you're on your own people" movement.
    We're on the same wavelength here. I realize others have a role, but this spot seems to want to divert responsibility from the parents when we should actually be encouraging responsibility.

    Yes, I think real world campaigns would make sense, but America is too PC. The right has difficulty admitting there are exceptions to rules--sometimes you end up in a tight spot through no fault of your own--and the left has a hard time admitting that anyone who is poor may have some responsibility for ending up there.

  10. #10
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    Haven't watched the ad. I must admit. Our kids are of course, fundamentally, the parents' responsibility.

    However, I see no issue in any attempt to raise awareness of the fact that, in actuality, we ALL (childless or not) have a part to play in making this world a better place for future generations - ie, by looking after our environment, endorsing common decency and morality, promoting good manners, rejecting prejudice and hatred in all its various forms...In that sense, I can see an argument for this notion of children 'belonging' to each and every one of us; recognising that we're all humans, here for a short span of time; that we're all 'in it together' and that we owe it to ourselves and each other to make this world as good a place as possible - for EVERYBODY. I assume that's what the ad. was getting at - but I may be wrong in giving them the benefit of the doubt!

    However, yes I agree with the rest of you in that good parenting starts in the home - and that, sadly, there are a great many people who have kids without being willing - or able - to take responsibility for them. And that is something we need to tackle as a matter of urgency.
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  11. #11
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dibblekins View Post
    Haven't watched the ad. I must admit. Our kids are of course, fundamentally, the parents' responsibility.

    However, I see no issue in any attempt to raise awareness of the fact that, in actuality, we ALL (childless or not) have a part to play in making this world a better place for future generations - ie, by looking after our environment, endorsing common decency and morality, promoting good manners, rejecting prejudice and hatred in all its various forms...In that sense, I can see an argument for this notion of children 'belonging' to each and every one of us; recognising that we're all humans, here for a short span of time; that we're all 'in it together' and that we owe it to ourselves and each other to make this world as good a place as possible - for EVERYBODY. I assume that's what the ad. was getting at - but I may be wrong in giving them the benefit of the doubt!

    However, yes I agree with the rest of you in that good parenting starts in the home - and that, sadly, there are a great many people who have kids without being willing - or able - to take responsibility for them. And that is something we need to tackle as a matter of urgency.
    Here's the text :-D

    We have never invested as much in public education as we should have because we have this private notion of children. 'Your kid is yours, and totally your responsibility.' We haven't had a very collective notion of 'these are our children.' So part of it is to break through our kind of private idea that kids belong to their parents, or kids belong to their families, and recognize that kids belong to whole communities.

    Once it's everybody's responsibility, and not just the household's, then we start making better investments.
    MSNBC has these "ads" where their hosts talk for 30 seconds on "American" ideals.

  12. #12
    Atomic Punk ziggysmalls's Avatar
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    I don't agree with this at all. I mean if one truly believes that your kids are actually "my" kids too, then I am going to swat them if I see them mouthing off to an elderly person. I am sure you guys would really hate that. If its the collectives responsibility to raise our young so that they will be contributing adults, well give me some leeway when I see one misbehaving.

    Of course that will never happen. I will be thrown in jail or possibly sued by a parent.

    I also don't believe that I want my teachers to be active in raising any kid. Teach. How many of them even have kids of their own? It seems that teachers right now are really only concerned with their pay and benefits. A Cleveland suburb right now has a teachers strike where kids have been getting a 2nd class education for over a month. I thought parents are supposed to be selfless when it comes to their child's needs. I don't think any teacher given a few years in their union feels that way.

    The responsibility of raising a kid goes back to the people who had sex. Don't try to place this responsibility onto the community. Once again this shows our country's ability to shift accountability to some other group.

    I do know quite a few teachers. Some are great human beings. Others I would not even loan money to. Sorry for the rant but the problem we have is in the home. Not in the classroom. You fix the home, the classroom will follow. You can't do it the other way.

  13. #13
    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    I love the little jab that we haven't spent enough on education.

    We spend more per student than almost all countries, we just spend it poorly and we have an idiot population of parents that are of course going to raise an idiot generation of children.
    Taylor Swift is nice to look at. Adele can sing.

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    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave's Dreidel View Post
    I love the little jab that we haven't spent enough on education.

    We spend more per student than almost all countries, we just spend it poorly and we have an idiot population of parents that are of course going to raise an idiot generation of children.
    most excellent point.

  15. #15
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave's Dreidel View Post
    I love the little jab that we haven't spent enough on education.

    We spend more per student than almost all countries, we just spend it poorly and we have an idiot population of parents that are of course going to raise an idiot generation of children.
    I can't understand what others don't understand about money not equaling results. It's like your kid being a C student and deciding to pay them $20 for each A they get. When they get straight Cs next semester, you up it $50 for each A. Straight Cs again and your friends, family, and most of society says, "You're not spending nearly enough for these As," so you offer $1000 per A. Straight Cs.

    No one stops to consider that a couple hundred dollars could pay for a tutor.
    Last edited by lovemachine97(Version 2); 04.08.13 at 02:07 PM.

 

 

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