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  1. #1
    Atomic Punk
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    12.12.17 @ 09:40 PM
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    Default Jerry Brown implements cap and trade in CA.

    A major piece of former Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger's plan to reduce greenhouse gas emissions will kick into gear Wednesday when regulated businesses throughout the state will be required to cut their pollution or pay the price.

    Under the state's new cap and trade program - the first of its kind in the nation - at 10 a.m. Wednesday morning, businesses such as refineries and industrial facilities will for the first time either bid on carbon credits to allow them to pollute more, or sell credits for having polluted less, under the California Air Resources Board (CARB)


    Los Angeles Department of Water & Power-Haynes Generating Station in Long Beach. (Sean Hiller/Staff Photographer)
    first pollution allowance auction.
    The idea is simple: The state sets a limit - a "cap" - on the amount of greenhouse gases each business or utility is allowed to emit. Companies that exceed their limits must buy additional allowances in the system. Companies that reduce their emissions below their cap can sell or "trade" their unused allowances.

    "For the first time, business will begin to understand what it means to put a price on carbon," said Stanley Young, a spokesman for the California Air Resources Board. "The program rewards efficiency. It will help move California away from its dependence on fossil fuels and toward a clean-energy economy."

    "It's the largest carbon market in the United States," Young added.

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    The program is a major component of AB32, the law signed by Schwarzenegger in 2006 that required California to lower its greenhouse gas emissions by 2020 to 1990 levels - the equivalent of a 17 percent reduction.

    AB32 includes many provisions - from increasing renewable energy production in the state to requiring decreased emissions from cars.

    Among the most controversial is the cap and trade program, which requires companies that emit more than 25,000 metric tons of CO2 equivalent to address those emissions in one of several ways.

    For each metric ton of emissions, companies must have one allowance.

    To begin, the companies have been given 90 percent of their allowances. They must make up the remaining 10 percent by the end of the year by either buying additional allowances on the open market, buying them at Wednesday's auction or by installing more efficient technology to reduce pollution.

    For example: If an oil refinery that emits 100,000 tons of carbon has been given credits for 90,000 tons, it either has to go on the market and buy credits for the extra 10,000 tons or lower the emissions. If it reduces its emissions, say to 80,000, then it could sell the unused allowances


    (Click to enlarge)
    to someone else.
    Each year, CARB issues a set number of allowances, but that number will be reduced each year by 2 to 3 percent, so by 2020, emissions will be reduced to 1990 levels.

    The program targets major sources of greenhouse gas emissions, including refineries, power plants, major factories, large food processors and cement companies. After 2015, the law also will include transportation fuels, meaning that oil refineries will need permits to account for the emissions from all the vehicles in the state.

    Wednesday's auction will be conducted using an Internet-based auction platform that allows bidders to submit their bids electronically and in secret.

    Money from the state auctions, which is expected to total more than $1 billion a year, must fund climate-related programs, such as making public buildings more energy efficient, providing rebates for efficient appliances or vehicles, or funding public transit projects such as high-speed rail.



    Read more: http://www.pasadenastarnews.com/news...#ixzz2C9VOTjY9
    This is probably not good for California.

  2. #2
    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    12.12.17 @ 05:27 PM
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    I will fully admit to it if I am proving wrong, but it seems to be a mistake at this point to try and force green energy. The cost-benefit does not seem to justify it...yet.

    The money being wasted on this could be used for developing green energies that effective in maybe five or ten years.

    Some things can be done right now. Cutting the number of lights on in empty buildings, etc., easy shit like that can be done tomorrow.

    Again, I could easily be wrong, but it just doesn't seem like any of this shit works yet.
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  3. #3
    Atomic Punk bsbll4's Avatar
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    12.12.17 @ 02:48 PM
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    California is going to be fun to watch over the next decade. As a state's rights guy, I say more power to them, but they are a liberal petri dish for the rest of the country. California is like a microcosm for where the left wants to take the country, and in many ways represents where we are now (high unemployment, unsustainable debt, etc.). So if California succeeds in lowering its unemployment and boosting its economy, those policies will then be sold to the rest of the country. If, however, it falls flat on its face like I believe it will, it will be impossible to convince the country that more government involvement is a good thing.
    CNN may think my opinion matters, but you shouldn't.

  4. #4
    Baluchitherium Ted Van Halen's Avatar
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    12.12.17 @ 06:53 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by bsbll4 View Post
    California is going to be fun to watch over the next decade. As a state's rights guy, I say more power to them, but they are a liberal petri dish for the rest of the country. California is like a microcosm for where the left wants to take the country, and in many ways represents where we are now (high unemployment, unsustainable debt, etc.). So if California succeeds in lowering its unemployment and boosting its economy, those policies will then be sold to the rest of the country. If, however, it falls flat on its face like I believe it will, it will be impossible to convince the country that more government involvement is a good thing.
    Agreed everywhere except the bold. A segment of society already wants the government handling everything for them.
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  5. #5
    Atomic Punk bsbll4's Avatar
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    12.12.17 @ 02:48 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Van Halen View Post
    Agreed everywhere except the bold. A segment of society already wants the government handling everything for them.
    I can't argue with that, but I think it might be a wake up call to the rest of the country if California's economy continues to be stagnated and unemployment remains high. Also, if you see a bunch of "offshoring" to other states there could be a big backlash as well.

    The Democrats have a supermajority in the legislature and own the governorship. It will be hard to blame anything on anyone else. They are going to own the future for better or worse.

    As someone who considers himself a conservative, even I won't argue with the policies being turned nationwide if we see a dramatic shift in California for the better. History tells me that won't happen, but if it did, I'd be willing to give it a try without opposition.
    CNN may think my opinion matters, but you shouldn't.

  6. #6
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    12.12.17 @ 09:32 PM
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    Here's some stats on California (I took these from Reason.com)

    Democrats have controlled all eight statewide executive offices since 2011, for only the second time since the 19th century.

    Democrats have a 28-12 edge in the state Senate, tied for its largest advantage since the 19th century. The party has held a majority there since the late 1950s.

    Democrats have a 54-26 edge in the state Assembly, its largest advantage since 1978. The party has run the Assembly since 1997.

    California has been represented in the U.S. Senate by Dianne Feinstein and Barbara Boxer for two decades.

    That 38-15 congressional delegation advantage, if it indeed holds, will be by far the largest spread in state history, and almost the largest percentage advantage as well (there was that 3-1 moment in the 1870s). Republicans last held more California congressional seats than Democrats in the late 1950s.


    What has that produced for the state I call home?

    The last month that California had an unemployment rate of less than 10% was January 2009. The last month its unemployment was lower than the national rate was April 1990. The 2010 Census marked the first time California didn't gain a seat in the House of Representatives since basically ever. For the first time since the Gold Rush, a majority of California residents were born in the state.

    Now we're starting cap and trade, but that's not all of it. It alo sets "new fuel efficiency standards for appliances and buildings," requirers "that 33 percent of the state’s energy be produced from renewable sources," sets "a low carbon fuel standard for vehicles, and changes zoning laws to discourage automobile travel," as well as "other new regulations and mandates."

  7. #7
    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    Yeah, watch all the businesses leave, that will really help the California economy. I swear some of these elected officials don't even have a rudimentary understanding of economics.

    If I was the governor of one of the adjacent states, I would be making some phone calls to CEO's in California.
    Taylor Swift is nice to look at. Adele can sing.

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  8. #8
    Unchained
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave's Dreidel View Post
    Yeah, watch all the businesses leave, that will really help the California economy. I swear some of these elected officials don't even have a rudimentary understanding of economics.

    If I was the governor of one of the adjacent states, I would be making some phone calls to CEO's in California.
    My company is in the midst of restructuring, and as part of things like this and the new taxation laws passed last week, we're seriously looking at not being based out of California anymore. When the company was founded, I specifically set it up as a CA corp, because I thought the whole idea of incorporating out of state was NOT a way to show your faith in your local and state economy, or supporting the infrastructure around you. After 3 years of getting hit on all side by CA laws that make it almost impossible for small to mid-sized business keep their heads above water (much less prosper and grow), it's almost impossible to justify staying.

    Perfect case in point; the original business plan allocated 15-20 internal production staffers that would be doing remastering, QA, and art touch up. These are "skilled" positions... not mindless McJobs. The amount of barriers CA has set time and time again made it impossible to do so without going into debt at 5x the value of the company, so what happens? we end up having no choice but to do a deal for the same services out of the country. There's a fundamental lack of comprehension by government that if shit doesn't change either companies will shut down, or more jobs leave the state/country. Either way, that means more Americans out of work.

    It's, to put it bluntly, fucked.
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