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  1. #1
    Atomic Punk
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    12.11.17 @ 04:37 PM
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    Default Herman Cain's '999 plan'

    Herman Cain's political star is lately on the rise, thanks in no small part to the persistent marketing of his '9-9-9 plan' to reform the tax code. Independent economists say the plan takes us into uncharted territory.

    Herman Cain's political star is lately on the rise, thanks in no small part to the persistent marketing of his so-called 9-9-9 plan – the presidential candidate's blueprint for reforming what many see as a complex and unpopular US tax code.

    But Mr. Cain, who won a Florida straw poll of the GOP faithful Saturday and who now is tied for third with Newt Gingrich among Republican presidential candidates in a recent average of three nationwide polls of Republicans, promises that 9-9-9 will do much more than simplify the tax code. Cain, the former chairman of Godfather’s Pizza says it represents "a bold solution" for reinvigorating the whole US economy.

    The elements of the Cain plan are 9 percent flat tax on household income, a 9 percent corporate tax, and a 9 percent national sales tax. There are no deductions except for charity. It's a graspable concept – and one that increasingly has been getting bursts of applause during GOP presidential debates.

    “This is an attempt to shift the tax burden away from production and towards consumption, to balance the load,” says Rich Lowrie, Cain’s Cleveland-based senior economic advisor. “This taxes everything once but nothing twice.”

    Mr. Lowrie, who is not an economist, says by “ripping out a whole bunch of taxes” prices of goods will fall, US exports will be more competitive and business will thrive. He claims the plan will create 6 million new jobs as business becomes more competitive.

    “In the price of things is the embedded cost of all taxes,” he says. “We will be exporting goods without the taxes built into them and hitting imports with the sales tax. It will level the playing field.”

    Independent economists who have studied Cain's 9-9-9 plan say the plan would take the nation into uncharted waters. The US has never had a national sales tax except for gasoline. It’s not clear what would happen to state and local services. States and municipalities would be carrying a new burden since they would have to pay the tax too. And, economists say the plan would favor those with high incomes.

    “I can understand how a presidential candidate may want to start out and go a different way,” says John Silvia, chief economist at Wells Fargo Securities in Charlotte, N.C. “But, we have to know how we’re going to get from here to there – there are a lot of implications for this.”

    One of the major implications would be moving the nation away from consumption. That may not be so bad, says Mark Zandi, chief economist at Moody’s Analytics in West Chester, Pa. “The more we save and invest, the stronger our economy would be.” But, he quickly adds, “It’s not exactly what I would do, but I sympathize with the spirit.”

    http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Electio...-or-job-killer
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  2. #2
    Hang 'Em High sickman's Avatar
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    12.13.17 @ 03:10 AM
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    And here I thought he was speaking German, nein, nein, nein.

    Last edited by sickman; 10.13.11 at 08:48 AM.
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  3. #3
    ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ ○ Number 47's Avatar
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    12.15.17 @ 02:26 AM
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    Sounds like something that they can argue over for four years and never get anywhere with... fuck! elect the guy.

  4. #4
    Atomic Punk
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    12.15.17 @ 01:59 AM
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    Quote Originally Posted by voivod View Post
    Herman Cain's political star is lately on the rise, thanks in no small part to the persistent marketing of his '9-9-9 plan' to reform the tax code. Independent economists say the plan takes us into uncharted territory.

    Herman Cain's political star is lately on the rise, thanks in no small part to the persistent marketing of his so-called 9-9-9 plan – the presidential candidate's blueprint for reforming what many see as a complex and unpopular US tax code.

    But Mr. Cain, who won a Florida straw poll of the GOP faithful Saturday and who now is tied for third with Newt Gingrich among Republican presidential candidates in a recent average of three nationwide polls of Republicans, promises that 9-9-9 will do much more than simplify the tax code. Cain, the former chairman of Godfather’s Pizza says it represents "a bold solution" for reinvigorating the whole US economy.

    The elements of the Cain plan are 9 percent flat tax on household income, a 9 percent corporate tax, and a 9 percent national sales tax. There are no deductions except for charity. It's a graspable concept – and one that increasingly has been getting bursts of applause during GOP presidential debates.

    “This is an attempt to shift the tax burden away from production and towards consumption, to balance the load,” says Rich Lowrie, Cain’s Cleveland-based senior economic advisor. “This taxes everything once but nothing twice.”

    Mr. Lowrie, who is not an economist, says by “ripping out a whole bunch of taxes” prices of goods will fall, US exports will be more competitive and business will thrive. He claims the plan will create 6 million new jobs as business becomes more competitive.

    “In the price of things is the embedded cost of all taxes,” he says. “We will be exporting goods without the taxes built into them and hitting imports with the sales tax. It will level the playing field.”

    Independent economists who have studied Cain's 9-9-9 plan say the plan would take the nation into uncharted waters. The US has never had a national sales tax except for gasoline. It’s not clear what would happen to state and local services. States and municipalities would be carrying a new burden since they would have to pay the tax too. And, economists say the plan would favor those with high incomes.

    “I can understand how a presidential candidate may want to start out and go a different way,” says John Silvia, chief economist at Wells Fargo Securities in Charlotte, N.C. “But, we have to know how we’re going to get from here to there – there are a lot of implications for this.”

    One of the major implications would be moving the nation away from consumption. That may not be so bad, says Mark Zandi, chief economist at Moody’s Analytics in West Chester, Pa. “The more we save and invest, the stronger our economy would be.” But, he quickly adds, “It’s not exactly what I would do, but I sympathize with the spirit.”

    http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Electio...-or-job-killer
    A plan that favors those with high income? What a surprise.

  5. #5
    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    12.15.17 @ 02:34 AM
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocknblues81 View Post
    A plan that favors those with high income? What a surprise.
    There are many economists that believe a simple tax plan that has a broad low tax rate is the best type of plan.

    Ours is flawed in multiple ways for both the rich and the working class.

    I don't think Warren Buffett should have a 15% rate, but I also don't think almost half of Americans should have a zero income tax bill, or be getting refunds due to child tax credits, additional child tax credits, and the Earned Income Tax Credit either.
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  6. #6
    Atomic Punk Wruff_ajax's Avatar
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    12.14.17 @ 10:36 PM
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    From what I gather about "999" then those that make enough money to save their money get taxed the least, while the poorest who must spend all that they have in order to just survive are taxed the most. So yeah, it benefits the rich.

    And I'm really tired of hearing his ass always crankin' on about "Nine nine nine".

    I believe that Herman Cain would make a terrible president.


    And Perry's just an idiot. Can't stand that dumbass.

    Romney I think is probably the best candidate to run against Obama.
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  7. #7
    Eruption
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    10.05.17 @ 11:44 AM
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    Currently, all the tax code is set up so that people who don't earn their money through wages pay less taxes. People who earn through a wage pay more, and this is the biggest issue the Occupy Wall St people don't like.

    Granted, if someone made a lot of money and now they are rich and can live off the money shouldn't have to pay stupid taxes on it (provided they did when they were earning it), however, with all the tax loopholes, it's easy to get around paying things.

    Poor people, middle class, and workers don't have loopholes because the only way they make money is through wages.

    Now, Cain's plan: It's bad.

    I liked Cain starting out, however his national sales tax plan stinks. It's a regressive tax. It hurts the poor more than anything else. Imagine earning less than $1000 a month, and food cost is $250, but with a 9% tax on that, you're now paying $272 a month for groceries. What else would a poor person have to buy? A 9% tax increase on anything they buy across the board will hurt.
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  8. #8
    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
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    12.14.17 @ 08:25 PM
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    Default

    The thought behind this is not a bad one but there needs to a personal exemption for a certain level of income (aka someone making 10 grand should not be paying income tax, it's silly). But I guess "9 9 9 with and a 50 thousand personal exemption" doesn't sound as cool as "9 9 9".

  9. #9
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    12.14.17 @ 10:06 PM
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    If I am not mistaken there is a threshold where it doesn't apply, and the real rate to be revenue neutral is 9.1%

    The big thing here is that there are no deductions. There are no loopholes. There's no more 35% rate but then hiring a guy to find every deduction you can so you only pay 10%. There's no more 25% rate and end up getting money back. There's no more GE paying $0 in taxes.

    Do I think it's the best plan? No. But it's way better than our current tax code.

    As far as who should and who shouldn't pay, well, the way it is now doesn't work. In 2009, nearly 50% of households did not pay any income tax. This is good for politicians who love to spend--and love to give it to that 50%--because tax cuts are a threat to the handouts that 50% receive.

    In the words of James Madison, "It is nevertheless certain, that there are various ways in which the rich may oppress the poor; in which property may oppress liberty; and that the world is filled with examples. It is necessary that the poor should have a defense against the danger. On the other hand, the danger to the holders of property cannot be disguised, if they be undefended against a majority without property."

    Once a majority of people are living at the expense of the minority, we have major problems.

  10. #10
    Little Dreamer HankWilliamsJrJr's Avatar
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    11.10.11 @ 10:35 AM
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    Did you hear Bachmann referring to the 999 plan?

    She said "turn it upside down, and you'll see that the devil is in the details."

    She may not be the brightest bulb, but she has a way with words.

  11. #11
    Atomic Punk Little Dreamer's Avatar
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    12.14.17 @ 01:39 PM
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    Turn it upside down, and you got an Iron Maiden song! Yeah, baby!
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  12. #12
    Sinner's Swing!
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    Quote Originally Posted by HankWilliamsJrJr View Post
    Did you hear Bachmann referring to the 999 plan?

    She said "turn it upside down, and you'll see that the devil is in the details."

    She may not be the brightest bulb, but she has a way with words.
    She needs to go away.

    The "999" plan isn't perfect, but it's a start. I think a minimum exemption is needed, but I think simplifying the code would be great. I think a flat income tax rate is fair. I do think it would kick start some growth.
    Last edited by Rebel; 10.13.11 at 11:19 AM.

  13. #13
    Little Dreamer HankWilliamsJrJr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rebel View Post
    She needs to go away.

    The "999" plan isn't perfect, but it's a start. I think a minimum exemption is needed, but I think simplifying the code would be great. I think a flat income tax rate is fair. I do think it would kick start some growth.
    Agreed on Bachmann. I was an early supporter of her since Mike Huckabee decided not to run. I do like Herman Cain. His 999 plan would actually work, its alot like Huckabee's Fair Tax. The Fair tax was a flat 23% rate across the board, so I agree flat = fair.

  14. #14
    Good Enough BlindtotheWorld's Avatar
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    12.14.17 @ 01:07 PM
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    Default

    I am scared to death about the federal government taxing something they previously didn’t (sales). Sure we start out at “9 9 9” and then 10 years later it’s “11 15 12”. Don’t forget that this would be on top of state and local sales tax. Most people would be paying 15% in sales tax like the Canadians.

    I like Cain’s attitude and confidence but selling this “9 9 9” crap makes him come off as a used car salesman.
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  15. #15
    Atomic Punk Little Dreamer's Avatar
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    12.14.17 @ 01:39 PM
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    Any state with no sales tax would see its economy crippled.
    The high income earner paying more would simply get wealthier.
    There are many downsides to this plan.
    In California we'd be paying 18%, 9% state and 9% federal.
    Basically, Cain's plan raises taxes more than any plan coming from the Democrats.
    Little Dreamer

 

 

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