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  1. #1
    Eruption
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    04.07.16 @ 01:19 PM
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    Default Peavey Wolfgang-backbowed! OUCH!

    So,
    I picked my Wolfie up last week to play, and it was buzzing like crazy. I felt frets sticking out of the top and bottom of the neck. Upon inspection, I saw backbow. Grrr. Pulled the allen wrench out, backed it off, and wouldn't you know it, theres nowhere to back it off anymore. So, I took it into the local shop I go to, and left it to be looked at. Was called yesterday, and the shop did the same thing, backed the wheel off.

    More or less, he suggested that I jump up to 10 gauge strings. Its a bummer, as I'm more into 9-46's. Anyone have any insight to this? Andrew, how do you leave your Wolfies out without running into this problem?
    Eddie must think I'm a BOZO to want to drop THAT much on one of his new Charvel Guitars!

  2. #2
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    07.04.16 @ 08:03 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red43j View Post
    So,
    I picked my Wolfie up last week to play, and it was buzzing like crazy. I felt frets sticking out of the top and bottom of the neck. Upon inspection, I saw backbow. Grrr. Pulled the allen wrench out, backed it off, and wouldn't you know it, theres nowhere to back it off anymore. So, I took it into the local shop I go to, and left it to be looked at. Was called yesterday, and the shop did the same thing, backed the wheel off.

    More or less, he suggested that I jump up to 10 gauge strings. Its a bummer, as I'm more into 9-46's. Anyone have any insight to this? Andrew, how do you leave your Wolfies out without running into this problem?
    Dude, how the hell did it end up with a backbow? Those necks are so stable, I've only ever had to do a couple of small tweaks to the truss rod just after and slightly into seasonal changes.

    First of all, take the neck off and verify that the adjustment wheel is actually screwed into the end of the truss rod; there's a chance you're just turning the wheel in its little route. If that's not the problem, keep the wheel backed off and increase string tension--tune the guitar up about a half-step. Leave it like that for a day or two, then tune back to E Standard. (If you've been tuning down a half-step or anything like that, increase your string gauge to 10s.)

    I've never heard of a Wolfgang neck drying out and developing a backbow at the same time. Usually the dryness weakens the wood and causes it to bow up. Odd.

  3. #3
    Eruption
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    Andrew-
    You got me. I do live in an apartment, and it sat on my guitar stand with my Martin, My Kramer 1984, and my Baretta mutt. None of the rest of the fiddles have had problems. Maybe I do have to case it from here on out?
    Eddie must think I'm a BOZO to want to drop THAT much on one of his new Charvel Guitars!

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red43j View Post
    Andrew-
    You got me. I do live in an apartment, and it sat on my guitar stand with my Martin, My Kramer 1984, and my Baretta mutt. None of the rest of the fiddles have had problems. Maybe I do have to case it from here on out?
    You know, the case really doesn't protect it from lack of moisture all that much. Keep the neck oiled regularly, make sure the truss rod is properly adjusted, and keep the strings tuned to pitch. Don't keep your guitars near a radiator, vent, or drafty area. I've got 13-year-old Wolfgangs that have spent the better part of their lives outside their cases, and they're as stable as ever.

    If the fret ends are really bad, now is the time to bring your Wolf to a tech for filing. Get 'em while the season is driest.

  5. #5
    Eruption
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    07.13.12 @ 05:20 AM
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red43j View Post
    So,
    I picked my Wolfie up last week to play, and it was buzzing like crazy. I felt frets sticking out of the top and bottom of the neck. Upon inspection, I saw backbow. Grrr. Pulled the allen wrench out, backed it off, and wouldn't you know it, theres nowhere to back it off anymore. So, I took it into the local shop I go to, and left it to be looked at. Was called yesterday, and the shop did the same thing, backed the wheel off.

    More or less, he suggested that I jump up to 10 gauge strings. Its a bummer, as I'm more into 9-46's. Anyone have any insight to this? Andrew, how do you leave your Wolfies out without running into this problem?
    If you have exposed fret ends you need to turn up the humidity not file fret ends. It will be just bad in the opposite direction come sommuer time. The bump up in humidity will also likely address the back bow issue. Those unfinished necks are a real bitch if you can't maintain a steady humidity in your space

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheArchitect View Post
    If you have exposed fret ends you need to turn up the humidity not file fret ends. It will be just bad in the opposite direction come sommuer time. The bump up in humidity will also likely address the back bow issue. Those unfinished necks are a real bitch if you can't maintain a steady humidity in your space
    Filing fret ends is a very normal thing to have to do to a guitar that is several years old and been through many seasons and climate changes. The wood changes over time and continues to dry out. Yes, if the fret ends are sticking out just a little then it's usually just a matter of keeping the neck oiled and waiting for the humidity of summer to "re-expand" the neck. But they can get pretty bad over time, and keeping up with the frets--as in filing edges and doing levels--is normal care for guitars over time.

  7. #7
    Eruption
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    Andrew-
    What are you oiling your necks with? I saw a job you had done on one of your guitars over on FB, but wasn't sure what you used. Also, how are you applying? Maybe I should consider doing this with my other necks (my 2 unfinished maple necks on the 1984 and maple homemade Baretta)?
    Eddie must think I'm a BOZO to want to drop THAT much on one of his new Charvel Guitars!

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red43j View Post
    Andrew-
    What are you oiling your necks with? I saw a job you had done on one of your guitars over on FB, but wasn't sure what you used. Also, how are you applying? Maybe I should consider doing this with my other necks (my 2 unfinished maple necks on the 1984 and maple homemade Baretta)?
    Actually, what you saw was me "reconditioning" the necks. I was filing fret edges, giving them a thorough pass with steel wool (to clean up dirt), washing each with Murphy's Oil Soap and a solid brush, and then applying a coat of gunstock oil. (The "oil finish" of the Wolfgang neck really isn't oil at all; it's some version of gunstock oil and wax.) After the gunstock oil has dried (I give it about 24 hours) I steel wool the neck over again--giving the frets a good polishing in the process--then apply a light coat of wax followed by a coat of lemon oil. (The lemon oil "melts" any residual wax hiding in hard-to-get places.) This is all basically the exact same treatment Wolfgang necks got at the factory when new. I've noticed after several years I can start to feel more of the neck grain, and this process re-seals and protects the neck again. In the Minnesota climate it seems to be something I'll do only about once every ten years. A few of my Wolfgangs have reached that age, hence the reason they were getting the treatment.

    For regular oilings at string changes you can use either lemon oil or bore oil. If you don't change strings very often then give the backside of the neck an extra coating a couple of times during winter.

  9. #9
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    You know, I was looking at this thread. As far as that back bow, I wouldn't be surprised if it's something along the lines of the truss binding somehow. It's very rare to happen but CAN happen when people go adjusting the rod at full tension.
    Of course you're not supposed to do this, but some people do, and what will happen is that the neck will be adjusted, but the rod doesn't have the freedom to flex naturally, so the backward pressure tends to get applied and the rod will actually try pull away from each end inside the neck and can actually get stuck in a manner of speaking. It's a bit hard to explain, but I have a Warmoth neck that I got off a friend that had this very problem. I don't recommend doing this on your Wolfie, but what I ended up doing was bolting the neck down onto my bench, and added a couple more clamps for support as I had heard about this happening and read about this little technique. I wound in the adjustment to till I reached some resistance, (actually running out of thread is more like it) and rocked the neck from the headstock, and applying pressure in the middle of the neck with my palm, then loosened, and did the same thing. I let it rest for a bit, came back did the same thing a few more times, then I head and felt a bit of a "thunk" in the neck, like something slipped or shifted.
    Well something happened, so I bolted up the neck on the guitar, backed out the truss adjustment, and this time there was serious resistance compared to before where it just freewheeled, then strung it up to low tension, then gradually increased it. The neck had a serious normal bow. I took my time turning in the nut a 1/4 turn at a time, and the neck came back pretty well flat.
    I have no idea how long the neck had been under that condition, and I was told that I could get it back further by my repair guy if I had it steamed, but It's playable, and I save buying another neck.
    Not sure if this is the same problem, but thought I'd give my 2 cents.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by we die young View Post
    You know, I was looking at this thread. As far as that back bow, I wouldn't be surprised if it's something along the lines of the truss binding somehow. It's very rare to happen but CAN happen when people go adjusting the rod at full tension.
    Of course you're not supposed to do this, but some people do, and what will happen is that the neck will be adjusted, but the rod doesn't have the freedom to flex naturally, so the backward pressure tends to get applied and the rod will actually try pull away from each end inside the neck and can actually get stuck in a manner of speaking. It's a bit hard to explain, but I have a Warmoth neck that I got off a friend that had this very problem. I don't recommend doing this on your Wolfie, but what I ended up doing was bolting the neck down onto my bench, and added a couple more clamps for support as I had heard about this happening and read about this little technique. I wound in the adjustment to till I reached some resistance, (actually running out of thread is more like it) and rocked the neck from the headstock, and applying pressure in the middle of the neck with my palm, then loosened, and did the same thing. I let it rest for a bit, came back did the same thing a few more times, then I head and felt a bit of a "thunk" in the neck, like something slipped or shifted.
    Well something happened, so I bolted up the neck on the guitar, backed out the truss adjustment, and this time there was serious resistance compared to before where it just freewheeled, then strung it up to low tension, then gradually increased it. The neck had a serious normal bow. I took my time turning in the nut a 1/4 turn at a time, and the neck came back pretty well flat.
    I have no idea how long the neck had been under that condition, and I was told that I could get it back further by my repair guy if I had it steamed, but It's playable, and I save buying another neck.
    Not sure if this is the same problem, but thought I'd give my 2 cents.
    Come to think of it, now that you mention that, I've had a neck do the 'clunk' thing before. I wasn't cranking on it like you said you were, but I was working on adjusting too much relief on a not-so-great neck. It was a real crater at the 12th fret, and I can't remember what actually caused the shift, but something let loose inside. When I re-tightened everything, it went on working like a normal neck, and I was able to flatten it out.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrjstudios View Post
    Come to think of it, now that you mention that, I've had a neck do the 'clunk' thing before. I wasn't cranking on it like you said you were, but I was working on adjusting too much relief on a not-so-great neck. It was a real crater at the 12th fret, and I can't remember what actually caused the shift, but something let loose inside. When I re-tightened everything, it went on working like a normal neck, and I was able to flatten it out.
    Haha! Well, I wasn't cranking on it really, but just rocking gently while trying to free it. What prompted me to do this was reading somewhere that what can happen if the neck is adjusted under tension is that the plate behind the wheel which is what applies pressure to the flexing side of the rods can actually dig or bite into into the rod not allowing it to come back on it's own without a little coaxing because it has to slip past the little ridge it creates. When the rod is under tension like that it is not perpendicular to the neck anymore, so it's on just enough of an angle to dig in. I can't say for sure this is what is going on with the wolfie neck, but mine is pretty good now. It's funny what people will do instead of just taking their time or getting advice before ranking on the truss adjustment.
    Hell....a luthier I've gone to in the past said he's seen guys reef on them so much the fret board has actually popped up off the neck. Takes real talent to do that!

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by we die young View Post
    Haha! Well, I wasn't cranking on it really, but just rocking gently while trying to free it. What prompted me to do this was reading somewhere that what can happen if the neck is adjusted under tension is that the plate behind the wheel which is what applies pressure to the flexing side of the rods can actually dig or bite into into the rod not allowing it to come back on it's own without a little coaxing because it has to slip past the little ridge it creates. When the rod is under tension like that it is not perpendicular to the neck anymore, so it's on just enough of an angle to dig in. I can't say for sure this is what is going on with the wolfie neck, but mine is pretty good now. It's funny what people will do instead of just taking their time or getting advice before ranking on the truss adjustment.
    Hell....a luthier I've gone to in the past said he's seen guys reef on them so much the fret board has actually popped up off the neck. Takes real talent to do that!
    Haha, ya. I've always been more scared to touch them if anything. But once I got more into building and repair, obviously I had to learn how to adjust them well. I've only broken 1 so far........ I got this old acoustic at a garage sale, and it's worth a decent amount of money if repaired, so I was working on it. The guitar is nice, but the neck is horrible... the bow was so bad that there was about 3/8" action at the upper frets... I tried tightening the truss rod just a bit to see if I could straighten it out before figuring out how much neck shimming and re-setting I'd have to do... and POP. Hardly applied any torque and the nut snapped off.... whoops.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrjstudios View Post
    Haha, ya. I've always been more scared to touch them if anything. But once I got more into building and repair, obviously I had to learn how to adjust them well. I've only broken 1 so far........ I got this old acoustic at a garage sale, and it's worth a decent amount of money if repaired, so I was working on it. The guitar is nice, but the neck is horrible... the bow was so bad that there was about 3/8" action at the upper frets... I tried tightening the truss rod just a bit to see if I could straighten it out before figuring out how much neck shimming and re-setting I'd have to do... and POP. Hardly applied any torque and the nut snapped off.... whoops.
    I had that happen but on mine, the bullet type adjuster on my frankie'd Strat snapped a long time ago. In my case, the bullet itself split in two when I turned the Allen wrench. The bullet's thread was still intact, but where the wrench went in was history. Fortunately though that was the one and only time I ever had to adjust it, at least so far, so I've just left it there. It's been a real stable neck. Solid one piece maple with the skunk stripe. I had removed the finish, and used tung oil on it, and dress it once a year or so, and I've been real lucky with it, and it's my favorite neck of all my guitars.
    Last edited by we die young; 01.24.11 at 01:17 PM.

 

 

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