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  1. #1
    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    12.11.17 @ 05:21 PM
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    Default Two Hand Tapping

    Not meant as a dig on Ed, but why is he widely credited with coming up with the technique?

    And I am sure some guys did it before Chet Atkins did as well.



    Also, how do you embed, so that next time I can save everyone a click?
    Last edited by Dave's Dreidel; 08.30.10 at 11:41 AM.
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  2. #2
    Atomic Punk
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    Emmet Chapman was working on the Chapman stick in the late sixties and the first production models were coming out in the early 70s.

    I'm also sure there were tons of jazzers and spanish and flamenco players using two-handed tapping going as far back as the guitar goes back...it just never caught on with mainstream rockers.
    Stay out of it, dude.


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  3. #3
    Good Enough SLEEPER5150's Avatar
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    Well....More that he took it and used it in a rock and roll format and made it a mainstay technique in his style. Stanley Jordan is probably the most well known who used the technique to the level he did in a jazz format. Eddie just made it work in an amazing way in the rock format without sounding too neoclassical or jazz based. To credit him with inventing the technique is just ignorance, but up till him it's just no one really monopolized on the technique in hard rock as a standard component in their playing. he claims he got the idea from watching Page during his Heartbreaker solo. I believe him. I don't think he was trying to pull the wool over anyone regarding his influence, though some will always say he was, but it's actually a pretty basic idea, so seeing and trying what Page did could only lead to innovating on the idea to a guy like Ed.
    Take his intro to Mean Street. It's actually a slap bass technique, but by mixing it up a little, adding the cyclic percussive mutes, he came up with this absolutely amazing sound.
    Last edited by SLEEPER5150; 08.30.10 at 12:33 PM.
    She looks so $#@!'n good ,so sexy and so frail....Somethin's got the bite on me, I'm goin' straight to Hell.

  4. #4
    Good Enough ignorance_is_bliss's Avatar
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    Default

    It's just one of those things. It's a case of the "Innovator" gaining further credit than the "Pioneer". IMO

    Also not meant as a dig on EVH.

    Ironically the role has since reversed. EVH pioneered a new style of rock guitar playing, combining all the elements of the look and feel of rock guitar playing, includingtwo handed tapping, artificial harmonics, tremolo picking, as well as type of guitar used (what is now called the super strat), effects used et cetera.

    As a result, the wider public (mostly a generation removed) pass him off as a hair band playing has-been, pointing to the newer generation of guitarists as innovators, "better" than EVH. What this same wider general public don't realise is a lot of these players themselves point to thier influence... EVH! (among others, of course)

  5. #5
    Good Enough SLEEPER5150's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ignorance_is_bliss View Post
    It's just one of those things. It's a case of the "Innovator" gaining further credit than the "Pioneer". IMO

    Also not meant as a dig on EVH.

    Ironically the role has since reversed. EVH pioneered a new style of rock guitar playing, combining all the elements of the look and feel of rock guitar playing, includingtwo handed tapping, artificial harmonics, tremolo picking, as well as type of guitar used (what is now called the super strat), effects used et cetera.

    As a result, the wider public (mostly a generation removed) pass him off as a hair band playing has-been, pointing to the newer generation of guitarists as innovators, "better" than EVH. What this same wider general public don't realise is a lot of these players themselves point to thier influence... EVH! (among others, of course)
    Well said!
    She looks so $#@!'n good ,so sexy and so frail....Somethin's got the bite on me, I'm goin' straight to Hell.

  6. #6
    Eruption
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave's Dreidel View Post
    Not meant as a dig on Ed, but why is he widely credited with coming up with the technique?
    Ed definitely did not invent the technique, but he can easily be credited with exploring and expanding it further that anyone else before him.
    WGAF?!!

  7. #7
    Atomic Punk
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimi11580 View Post
    Ed definitely did not invent the technique, but he can easily be credited with exploring and expanding it further that anyone else before him.

    anyone in mainstream rock or anyone period?
    Stay out of it, dude.


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  8. #8
    Eruption
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    Quote Originally Posted by broken9500 View Post
    anyone in mainstream rock or anyone period?
    Of course, mainstream rock! Since when is Ed known for playing in Jazz or Flamenco circles? C'mon!
    WGAF?!!

  9. #9
    Atomic Punk
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimi11580 View Post
    Of course, mainstream rock! Since when is Ed known for playing in Jazz or Flamenco circles? C'mon!
    well had to clarify. It wouldn't be the first time that people actually thought Ed's work supercedes genre or style.

    It goes without saying he at or near the top of a very very very elite list of way-pavers and innovators of rock music. That's a big enough credential without getting silly and saying his legacy stretches beyond its sizeable reach.

    There are guitarists outside mainstream rock who have explored and expanded on two-handed tapping and were doing so before he came along.
    Stay out of it, dude.


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  10. #10
    Eruption
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    Quote Originally Posted by broken9500 View Post
    well had to clarify. It wouldn't be the first time that people actually thought Ed's work supercedes genre or style.
    I hope you don't presume to count me among them...

    Quote Originally Posted by broken9500 View Post
    It goes without saying he at or near the top of a very very very elite list of way-pavers and innovators of rock music. That's a big enough credential without getting silly and saying his legacy stretches beyond its sizeable reach.
    Yeah? Wait 'til he kicks the bucket. What will be said about his legacy on that day will stretch far beyond anything that you can imagine.

    Quote Originally Posted by broken9500 View Post
    There are guitarists outside mainstream rock who have explored and expanded on two-handed tapping and were doing so before he came along.
    And there are guitarists in those genres that continue to do so... really, what's the point of this discussion? It's an established fact that Ed didn't invent it!
    WGAF?!!

  11. #11
    Emperor of VHLinks.com Brett's Avatar
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    Default

    I think Ed deserves all the accolades he gets when it comes to tapping. Nobody and I mean nobody in the mainstream rock world was more of a influence on that technique than Ed. I don't care who invented it, or who does it better.

    I don't mind slamming Ed when necessary, but I don't believe any one is being a sycophantical idiot by giving him his earned due when it comes to two-handed tapping. He deserves all the credit in the world for what he did with it, and what affect it had on popular guitar playing. And players outside of rock have used the technique and have credited Ed for taking it to another level.

    Most of us (for sure myself) wouldn't have put two hands on the fretboard if we didn't learn it from Ed, let's be honest. Yeah is there an exception, of course. But I certainly didn't pick it up from any of the jazz guys who were doing it before Ed.
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  12. #12
    Eruption TheMightyCopenHalenII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brett View Post
    I think Ed deserves all the accolades he gets when it comes to tapping. Nobody and I mean nobody in the mainstream rock world was more of a influence on that technique than Ed. I don't care who invented it, or who does it better.

    I don't mind slamming Ed when necessary, but I don't believe any one is being a sycophantical idiot by giving him his earned due when it comes to two-handed tapping. He deserves all the credit in the world for what he did with it, and what affect it had on popular guitar playing. And players outside of rock have used the technique and have credited Ed for taking it to another level.

    Most of us (for sure myself) wouldn't have put two hands on the fretboard if we didn't learn it from Ed, let's be honest. Yeah is there an exception, of course. But I certainly didn't pick it up from any of the jazz guys who were doing it before Ed.
    Well said. Harvey Mandel, Steve Hackett, Chet Atkins, Harry DeArmond, Jimmy Webster - there was surely guys doing "something" in the 1920's (and earlier) and beyond - but that's when the technique caught on among the masses after VH's debut. I think Eddie refined it and developed so many permutations of it you just can't ignore him as the badass that exploded the technique. I'm sorry, but I think that the tapped arpeggios in Eruption are one of the most beautiful and killer pieces of music laid to tape - and that it was such a great piece of music surely caused many to go "What the hell was that!?! I've got to do that!" When I hear some of the pre EVH tapping stuff it doesn't sound as inspiring or shine as such a refined technique.

    There's guys that claim they were the ones that showed EVH the technique - and many other rumors to be sure - to me its immaterial once that beautiful tapped passage starts.
    FUCK THE DUMB SHIT!!!!

  13. #13
    Good Enough SLEEPER5150's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brett View Post
    I think Ed deserves all the accolades he gets when it comes to tapping. Nobody and I mean nobody in the mainstream rock world was more of a influence on that technique than Ed. I don't care who invented it, or who does it better.

    I don't mind slamming Ed when necessary, but I don't believe any one is being a sycophantical idiot by giving him his earned due when it comes to two-handed tapping. He deserves all the credit in the world for what he did with it, and what affect it had on popular guitar playing. And players outside of rock have used the technique and have credited Ed for taking it to another level.

    Most of us (for sure myself) wouldn't have put two hands on the fretboard if we didn't learn it from Ed, let's be honest. Yeah is there an exception, of course. But I certainly didn't pick it up from any of the jazz guys who were doing it before Ed.
    Exactly, and that's why I said I believe him when he says he got the seed of the idea from Page. The way he taps, on multiple strings, even in octaves, combining taps with finger slides, bends, and let's not forget his old table tray concept is mindblowing. He took it to an amazing level.
    When people argue that Hendrix was better, and other people tapped first, I just tell them, their talking out their ass. It's not about who's better. He's an innovator in his own right. The successor to Hendrix. He basically carried on where he left off. I can't think of one other player who revolutionized rock guitar so extensively. Manipulated the instrument to fit his style. Name one player in rock and roll since Ed came on the scene who hasn't used at least one of his techniques, or innovations.
    She looks so $#@!'n good ,so sexy and so frail....Somethin's got the bite on me, I'm goin' straight to Hell.

  14. #14
    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SLEEPER5150 View Post
    When people argue that Hendrix was better, and other people tapped first, I just tell them, their talking out their ass. It's not about who's better. He's an innovator in his own right. The successor to Hendrix. He basically carried on where he left off. I can't think of one other player who revolutionized rock guitar so extensively. Manipulated the instrument to fit his style. Name one player in rock and roll since Ed came on the scene who hasn't used at least one of his techniques, or innovations.
    That was not what I intended when I asked the question.

    My original post was meant as a question, not as a slag on Ed.

    I know it is hard to believe with some of the postings on this site, but it was actually just conversational curiousity that drove the posting.
    Taylor Swift is nice to look at. Adele can sing.

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  15. #15
    Good Enough SLEEPER5150's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave's Dreidel View Post
    That was not what I intended when I asked the question.

    My original post was meant as a question, not as a slag on Ed.

    I know it is hard to believe with some of the postings on this site, but it was actually just conversational curiousity that drove the posting.
    Oh....That wasn't directed at you DD! I'm talking about musicians in my circle!
    I'm always confronted at our rehearsal space it seems when guys see my franky, and we start woodshedding about stuff. it always seems to come down to the juvenile "This guys better than that guy" argument. It's silly.
    So no offence intended to you man! Sorry if you thought I was going off on your question.
    She looks so $#@!'n good ,so sexy and so frail....Somethin's got the bite on me, I'm goin' straight to Hell.

 

 

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