Follow us on...
Follow us on Twitter Follow us on Facebook Watch us on YouTube
Register
Results 1 to 15 of 15
  1. #1
    Hot For Teacher
    Join Date
    10.05.09
    Posts
    288
    Last Online

    02.15.16 @ 02:56 PM
    Likes
    1
    Liked 5 Times in 4 Posts

    Default Boutique Guitars

    Okay I was reading the new issue of Guitarist Magazine and looking at the reviews and their was a review for a nice looking Strat called the Knaggs Chesapeake Choptank. I was thinking is this some new company, no it was not a company just the new monthly Boutique guitar maker. Seriously is it just me or do others think it is getting a little crazy with all these builders like Suhr, Anderson, McNaught, Melancon, McInturf, Knagg and a whole crew of others.

    The thing that burns my ass is that when you see Boutique it translates into= very expensive . Well as I was reading about the Chesapeake Choptank which talent aside is one of the worst names ever given to a guitar and found out he was PRS right hand man for years and his master builder.Okay those are serious credentials but the CC Strat reviewed was his low end model which was close to 4K and his high end model is in the 13K bracket.I am just bewildered as to who would pay that kind of scratch for a guitar- really just about any guitar yet alone by a guy whose name is not even really known.

    I think this whole boutique scene is really getting out of hand. At least when PRS started out the guy went to a ton of shows to try and get some name players to play his guitars like Ted Nugent amongst others and built a name for himself. Today it is the opposite and guys just appear asking outrageous prices without working there way up the ladder.

    There are a lot of talented guys on this forum who build and know just how expensive a guitar could be made for but there is no way the prices these guys ask are justified even if you had Bill Gates type money.Would anyone pay 10 to 15K for a guitar if they had it like that for anyother reason than to say look what I have. For some reason I do not associate most of these guitars with real players and more with collectors. My friend Mike that owns a guitar store in Brooklyn which is a 3 generation store, and has been here 80 years said to me one day check this out and opened a case to show me a wicked PRS.Now Mike is a ace player and tech, and when I go hangout at the store I go behind the counter and have an all access pass. So I went to take the guitar out and he said he was expecting the owner any minute and he did not want the guy to walk in with me holding his guitar-a first.lol But he stressed the point the guy actually made him uncomfortable to work on his guitar because of how many times he said please be careful, and the guy told him when he changes the strings he wears gloves- what the fuck is that! Is it a guitar or a piece of furniture.

    I have to believe without a doubt the main owners of a lot of these guitars just buy them because they can and are in it for the money. Because a working player is not going to buy a guitar they would be scared to play, or lose a few grand, not hundreds but thousands on a resale.On the Fender forum when word came out that GC was returning all the SRV Lenny Strats that originally sold for 17K, bombed and went down to 11K, a guy asked Mike Eldred in his room if Fender could burn the returns so guys who bought them could hold some value.lol Only in the crazy world of guitars.

  2. #2
    Good Enough SLEEPER5150's Avatar
    Join Date
    02.13.08
    Location
    Canada's West Coast
    Posts
    2,281
    Favorite VH Album

    Fair Warning
    Favorite VH Song

    Hear about it later
    Last Online

    12.03.10 @ 03:16 PM
    Likes
    0
    Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by straycat113 View Post
    Okay I was reading the new issue of Guitarist Magazine and looking at the reviews and their was a review for a nice looking Strat called the Knaggs Chesapeake Choptank. I was thinking is this some new company, no it was not a company just the new monthly Boutique guitar maker. Seriously is it just me or do others think it is getting a little crazy with all these builders like Suhr, Anderson, McNaught, Melancon, McInturf, Knagg and a whole crew of others.

    The thing that burns my ass is that when you see Boutique it translates into= very expensive . Well as I was reading about the Chesapeake Choptank which talent aside is one of the worst names ever given to a guitar and found out he was PRS right hand man for years and his master builder.Okay those are serious credentials but the CC Strat reviewed was his low end model which was close to 4K and his high end model is in the 13K bracket.I am just bewildered as to who would pay that kind of scratch for a guitar- really just about any guitar yet alone by a guy whose name is not even really known.

    I think this whole boutique scene is really getting out of hand. At least when PRS started out the guy went to a ton of shows to try and get some name players to play his guitars like Ted Nugent amongst others and built a name for himself. Today it is the opposite and guys just appear asking outrageous prices without working there way up the ladder.

    There are a lot of talented guys on this forum who build and know just how expensive a guitar could be made for but there is no way the prices these guys ask are justified even if you had Bill Gates type money.Would anyone pay 10 to 15K for a guitar if they had it like that for anyother reason than to say look what I have. For some reason I do not associate most of these guitars with real players and more with collectors. My friend Mike that owns a guitar store in Brooklyn which is a 3 generation store, and has been here 80 years said to me one day check this out and opened a case to show me a wicked PRS.Now Mike is a ace player and tech, and when I go hangout at the store I go behind the counter and have an all access pass. So I went to take the guitar out and he said he was expecting the owner any minute and he did not want the guy to walk in with me holding his guitar-a first.lol But he stressed the point the guy actually made him uncomfortable to work on his guitar because of how many times he said please be careful, and the guy told him when he changes the strings he wears gloves- what the fuck is that! Is it a guitar or a piece of furniture.

    I have to believe without a doubt the main owners of a lot of these guitars just buy them because they can and are in it for the money. Because a working player is not going to buy a guitar they would be scared to play, or lose a few grand, not hundreds but thousands on a resale.On the Fender forum when word came out that GC was returning all the SRV Lenny Strats that originally sold for 17K, bombed and went down to 11K, a guy asked Mike Eldred in his room if Fender could burn the returns so guys who bought them could hold some value.lol Only in the crazy world of guitars.
    Very hard to argue with you man! I remember 3 or 4 years back even, when Charvel were trying to sell....with a straight face reissues of the old San Dimas with the bullseye paintjob for between $10.000.00 to $12.000.00. It went up by which bridge was on it. The "Low end" was steel, the high end, a brass reproduction. It was seriously the biggest joke I'd seen up to that point.

    I mean c'mon. a bare bones, single pickup, bolt-on neck, CNC'd guitar with a stencil painted bullseye finish!....And they had the balls to justify the price by calling them a limited run of 3.000 of each model. I get that it carries some history to the originals....but it's still a copy. Period.
    So turning to the "boutique" stuff.......I hear you. It's like they think "well hey, if the big boys are comanding a huge price for their stuff, I should be able to ask 3,4,5 times as much for my high quality low run stuff." No doubt, you're most likely going to get a very detailed quality instrument, but yeah.......it's getting rediculous.
    I know some woods are getting tougher to come by ....and it does get costly, but when you start factoring hardware, which BTW is having alot if not all it's componentry being made offshore....It doesn't make a lot of sense does it.
    That said, it's a capitalist society, and people can charge...or at least try to charge what they want, but it is crazy.

    The boutique pedal thing is pretty out there too.
    She looks so $#@!'n good ,so sexy and so frail....Somethin's got the bite on me, I'm goin' straight to Hell.

  3. #3
    Good Enough
    Join Date
    01.03.02
    Posts
    2,395
    Last Online

    12.19.16 @ 05:15 PM
    Likes
    6
    Liked 8 Times in 8 Posts


    Donor

    Default

    Gear rich, talent poor. 80% of your tone is in your hands. The instrument is only as good as the person playing it. I can cliche this all day...

  4. #4
    Romeo Delight Strat God's Avatar
    Join Date
    08.11.06
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    85
    Favorite VH Album

    Van Halen
    Favorite VH Song

    Ain't Talkin' Bout Love
    Last Online

    01.23.17 @ 01:54 PM
    Likes
    0
    Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    Not only are they expensive, but most have no resale value either, so unless you plan on keeping one forever you've lost your investment when you get rid of it - I know first hand.
    ~ Strat God
    Check Out Strat God Music:
    http://www.esnips.com/web/Strat-God-Music/

  5. #5
    5150 bunnyman's Avatar
    Join Date
    08.04.08
    Age
    45
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    669
    Favorite VH Album

    Most
    Favorite VH Song

    Jamie's Crying
    Last Online

    11.06.14 @ 04:06 AM
    Likes
    0
    Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    Rarely, people care about boutique guitars, and the whole deal is that somebody famous who is RELEVANT at the time they had appeared on TV and such is how a boutique guitar will ever gain value. PRS was a boutique guitar brand years ago, and they were the exception to the rule. Now they are in the leagues of Gibson and Fender in resale value, for the most part.

    If you're going to have a custom guitar that will have no resale value in the least, have a small builder make one for you or get the materials and roll your own. That's what I do. I have built many crappily painted, great playing "boutique" guitars for the price of one Suhr!!!! I bet you can't get a rattlecan paintjob from these guys!!!!
    Last edited by bunnyman; 08.23.10 at 05:26 AM.
    Dammit!!! I still smell like cotton candy!!!

  6. #6
    Eruption
    Join Date
    02.23.04
    Age
    46
    Location
    Peoria, IL
    Posts
    712
    Favorite VH Album

    Fair Warning
    Favorite VH Song

    Unchained & Romeo Delight
    Last Online

    04.07.16 @ 01:19 PM
    Likes
    0
    Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    I think the whole thing is silly, unless theres just something you have to have, and you can't get your favorite manufacter to do it, then MAYBE...and even then, is it worth it?
    Furthermore, howz about the term boutique coming up with amps, and someone charging a ton for them...I guess we DO decide with our wallets.
    Eddie must think I'm a BOZO to want to drop THAT much on one of his new Charvel Guitars!

  7. #7
    Romeo Delight
    Join Date
    07.25.09
    Posts
    55
    Last Online

    07.25.11 @ 08:00 PM
    Likes
    0
    Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default

    It is insane what people pay for a few pieces of wood and some rudimentary electronics. Interestingly enough these guys seem to be missing a major point when it comes to guitars - making music.

    I truly don't think there is a guitar in this world that is "worth" more than $2,000.

    Funny that the best music from the greatest players was created on mass produced guitars. I mean, the guy who this site is devoted to made most of his music on a piece of crap, slapped together guitar. SRV's #1 was used when he bought it. Jimi Hendrix played whatever was on the wall at the music store. I could go on, but I'm sure you all get the point.

  8. #8
    Good Enough SLEEPER5150's Avatar
    Join Date
    02.13.08
    Location
    Canada's West Coast
    Posts
    2,281
    Favorite VH Album

    Fair Warning
    Favorite VH Song

    Hear about it later
    Last Online

    12.03.10 @ 03:16 PM
    Likes
    0
    Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by slick4772 View Post
    It is insane what people pay for a few pieces of wood and some rudimentary electronics. Interestingly enough these guys seem to be missing a major point when it comes to guitars - making music.

    I truly don't think there is a guitar in this world that is "worth" more than $2,000.

    Funny that the best music from the greatest players was created on mass produced guitars. I mean, the guy who this site is devoted to made most of his music on a piece of crap, slapped together guitar. SRV's #1 was used when he bought it. Jimi Hendrix played whatever was on the wall at the music store. I could go on, but I'm sure you all get the point.
    I agree. I have no problem paying a larger sum for something nicer or more desirable in terms of it maybe being an actual historical piece, or a rare landmark instrument, but the whole boutique, and reissue deal is nuts.
    Take the Attila Odyssey I bought a few weeks back. It is what today would be called a "boutique" guitar. As said above, some 32 years on, it has no resale value whatsoever. I got it for a few hundred, but it's an awesome sounding and playing guitar. It really does make you wonder how some builders, either mass production or small run, can justify charging the money that seems commonplace these days for solid bodies. Like it was said above also, people forget that the primary purpose of the guitar is to be heard. I've picked up and played some of these ultra expensive guitars, and honestly, if you closed your eyes, you'd be hard pressed to tell many of them from any run of the mill Tele, Strat, or Paul clone.
    She looks so $#@!'n good ,so sexy and so frail....Somethin's got the bite on me, I'm goin' straight to Hell.

  9. #9
    Atomic Punk
    Join Date
    06.15.06
    Location
    Houston, TX
    Posts
    13,741
    Favorite VH Album

    VHIII/WACF/OU51BALUCK
    Last Online

    07.24.11 @ 04:36 PM
    Likes
    0
    Liked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Default

    In a lot cases, boutique builders really do provide products that are just fantastic with incredible attention to detail but very seldom are those prices justified any more than those of the companies they love to hate.
    Stay out of it, dude.


    I am Van Halen.

  10. #10
    Good Enough SLEEPER5150's Avatar
    Join Date
    02.13.08
    Location
    Canada's West Coast
    Posts
    2,281
    Favorite VH Album

    Fair Warning
    Favorite VH Song

    Hear about it later
    Last Online

    12.03.10 @ 03:16 PM
    Likes
    0
    Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by broken9500 View Post
    In a lot cases, boutique builders really do provide products that are just fantastic with incredible attention to detail but very seldom are those prices justified any more than those of the companies they love to hate.
    Absolutely. There are some guitars out there that are works of art. Take some of the acoustic guitars Shuriya in Vancouver build. Every aspect of the woodwork is made with old fashioned hand tools. His fretboard inlays put even Paul Reed Smith to shame when he was a "boutique" builder. They are almost too sexy to be played. The woods are all select and the time it takes to build one, from the seasoning of the wood to fastening the last screw is very long, but you'd be very hard pressed to find him charging more than 3 thousand. I think in his case it's justified simply because of the old world crafsmanship, and the fact that none of his tools have a power cord, battery, or air in receptacle. Everything is done by hand. Compare that to mass production houses like Gibson and Fender where the majority is done very quickly by CNC or in a production line format. In the case of Fender, alot of stuff is shipped out of country to boot for the initial fabrication. It just doesn't jive for them to charge above and beyond for some of their stuff does it? A Fender I checked out recently had a very obvious routing check at the neck pocket that was filled acceptably, but it did not match perfectly during the staining stage. Granted this guitar was around $1.900.00, but sorry Fender....this body was a second at best, or at the very least, should have been a solid colour where no one would be the wiser. That's the stuff that really burns me up. They think "Hey, were Fender....We can charge what we want on our name alone!" I think this is the crap that boutique builders latch on too when they charge what they do. Their mentality is, you're gonna pay more, but you won't have imperfections to deal with on our product. That's fine, but is it really worth that much more? for something that should be common sense in manufacturing?
    No offense to the new Wolfie; It's a nice guitar, but aside from the carved top, it still doesn't hold a candle to the EBMM in it's sound and feel...At least to me, and it's more than a grand less new. As far as the Wolfie goes, I'd take the Peavey over the Fender made model, though I would consider checking out the Special when it comes out.
    Last edited by SLEEPER5150; 08.26.10 at 09:13 AM.
    She looks so $#@!'n good ,so sexy and so frail....Somethin's got the bite on me, I'm goin' straight to Hell.

  11. #11
    Atomic Punk
    Join Date
    06.15.06
    Location
    Houston, TX
    Posts
    13,741
    Favorite VH Album

    VHIII/WACF/OU51BALUCK
    Last Online

    07.24.11 @ 04:36 PM
    Likes
    0
    Liked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Default

    You know, a guy building an entire guitar with old-world tools SHOULD be charging more than a guy using a CNC machine or even worse, ordering necks and bodies from suppliers and assembling them. Damn straight.

    I've seen "boutique builders" charge 4K for something that a machine made in their garage. That's ridiculous and to argue that it is somehow superior in quality because it's a "one-off" or because you're offering "custom" options that the manufacturer whose designs you've ripped off anyway is equally ridiculous.

    Fender and Gibson and the rest have plenty of problems...plenty. They are bloated arrogant companies that sell overpriced items with sketchy quality control, spotty customer service who seem to have lost all true passion for what they do.

    They get it right plenty of times though. For every strat that rolls off with with a neck issue like you describe, 500 roll off perfect. It's easy to make a one-off guitar with all the computer guided equipment, taking 12 weeks to crap it out...it's another thing to try and supply the world with enough strats, teles and every other model in every possible configuration and colour scheme that makes sense and get them shipped to all the retailers.

    I'm not a big pro-corporation guy by any means I just think that this whole notion of the humble and skilled but victimized by evil giant corporations toiling away in his meager woodshop for the sole reason of expressing his passion for a lost art and charging only a pittance when taking into consideration the labour, talent, spirit, materials and artistry involved is total bullshit. total bullshit.

    There are some wildly talented builders...spectacular builders. I LOVE checking out anyone and everyone's work I can but as soon as they start in with either the victim bullshit, try to rationalize stealing other people's intellectual property and designs or start in with "it's a one-of-a-kind so I'm charging 5K for it" I tune them out and find another builder.

    The same way I don't want to give my money to shitty corporations who don't appreciate my dollar and are just bending me over to get every dime they can out of me, I'm sure not going to overspend on some arrogant self-absorbed sheister builder who doesn't appreciate my dollar and just wants to bend me over to get every dime they can out of me.

    there are assholes in big corporations and there are assholes toiling away in their basement. I prefer to stay away from all of them.
    Stay out of it, dude.


    I am Van Halen.

  12. #12
    Good Enough
    Join Date
    03.12.04
    Posts
    1,584
    Last Online

    12.14.17 @ 12:39 PM
    Likes
    10
    Liked 214 Times in 92 Posts

    Default

    While I generally agree that you get what you pay for, when it comes to guitars my cutoff point is somewhere in the $1500-2000 range. Above that price point I don't think you are getting a better guitar in terms of woods, metals, hardware, electronics etc, I think you are just getting gouged. I would even be hesitant to spend $2000 on an axe. No reason why these guitar companies can't charge $1200-1500 and still make a good profit. At the moment I'm really curious about Carvin guitars, where you can really customize your axe with good components and stay under $1500. I think that's a fair price. Maybe one day I'll pick up a used Fender Wolf, but there's no way I'm paying 3k for a new one.

  13. #13
    Atomic Punk
    Join Date
    06.15.06
    Location
    Houston, TX
    Posts
    13,741
    Favorite VH Album

    VHIII/WACF/OU51BALUCK
    Last Online

    07.24.11 @ 04:36 PM
    Likes
    0
    Liked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by vhin04 View Post
    While I generally agree that you get what you pay for, when it comes to guitars my cutoff point is somewhere in the $1500-2000 range. Above that price point I don't think you are getting a better guitar in terms of woods, metals, hardware, electronics etc, I think you are just getting gouged. I would even be hesitant to spend $2000 on an axe. No reason why these guitar companies can't charge $1200-1500 and still make a good profit. At the moment I'm really curious about Carvin guitars, where you can really customize your axe with good components and stay under $1500. I think that's a fair price. Maybe one day I'll pick up a used Fender Wolf, but there's no way I'm paying 3k for a new one.
    speaking of Carvin, I received their catalog in the mail a couple weeks ago. I was really impressed. I'm very intrigued by their recent (well, over the last few years) changes in their business model. I may give them an order some time if I get the itch to grab a new guitar.
    Stay out of it, dude.


    I am Van Halen.

  14. #14
    Good Enough SLEEPER5150's Avatar
    Join Date
    02.13.08
    Location
    Canada's West Coast
    Posts
    2,281
    Favorite VH Album

    Fair Warning
    Favorite VH Song

    Hear about it later
    Last Online

    12.03.10 @ 03:16 PM
    Likes
    0
    Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by broken9500 View Post
    speaking of Carvin, I received their catalog in the mail a couple weeks ago. I was really impressed. I'm very intrigued by their recent (well, over the last few years) changes in their business model. I may give them an order some time if I get the itch to grab a new guitar.
    Carvin are an example of a very good business model. They always make a good product, don't overinflate it's performance or value above what it is. Take what Gibson is doing for comparison. Since they started hiking their US prices into the stratosphere, sales in the middle class average sales market
    started gravitating away from them in favour of brands like ESP, who offer a very comparable/affordable Paul like guitar and since Gibson's Epiphone line moved to China as an exclusive in house production, Epiphone sales have been revitalized, bolstered by a decent product for rediculously low prices. Folks who at one time wouldn't be caught dead with an Epiphone now play them with pride. offshore made or not.
    Fast forward two years, and now Gibson is beginning to charge more for their Epiphone brand. Even building some limited edition Epiphone models in the U.S.
    They now seem to view Epiphone, their entry level priced stepping stone as the next possible big money venture.
    I think this will backfire on them big time. A dealer I know quite well has been hearing much larger prices being bantered about for their Pauls, Explorers, and V's. Not as big a price as the US models, but the very prices many struggled trying to afford to buy their first "Real Gibson".
    Again....I think this will be a very short lived experiment.
    With brands like Reverend as well as others making a very decent guitar for the money, people will simply side step Gibson/Epiphone all together.
    She looks so $#@!'n good ,so sexy and so frail....Somethin's got the bite on me, I'm goin' straight to Hell.

  15. #15
    Good Enough
    Join Date
    03.12.04
    Posts
    1,584
    Last Online

    12.14.17 @ 12:39 PM
    Likes
    10
    Liked 214 Times in 92 Posts

    Default

    Well, I'm almost certain my next guitar purchase will be a Carvin. I've put together a few builds on their website and the most expensive once came to a little over $1200, and that was with a Walnut top! Their assemble yourself kits can be had for well under $1000...I'm a lefty and they offer the same product to us lefties that the righties get, including a left-handed Floyd, at the same price.

    I'm happy to buy from a company like this...they make a profit and I get a quality instrument in return, without being taken advantage of. Plus, being in Canada, Carvin seems to have some kind of deal where you don't pay brokerage fees or duty or something. I don't know exactly how it works but you don't pay anything other than regular shipping when you order from Canada. Last year I ordered on of their DCM 150 ss power amps and I only paid what they charged me from their website, arrived at my door within a week and that was it.

 

 

Similar Threads

  1. Boutique Plexi poll: D Bray vs. Metro or other
    By YMI5150? in forum Guitar Room
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 02.09.10, 04:39 PM
  2. Replies: 5
    Last Post: 07.22.08, 01:53 AM
  3. Boutique "Brown Sound" amps whats the best?
    By DuffHalen in forum Guitar Room
    Replies: 30
    Last Post: 12.10.06, 11:13 AM
  4. Boutique Amps?
    By Ed shred in forum Guitar Room
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 01.18.06, 08:26 PM
  5. Dean guitars, the best guitars on earth?
    By rickyg in forum Guitar Room
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 08.04.05, 03:32 PM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •