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  1. #1
    Atomic Punk Wruff_ajax's Avatar
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    12.14.17 @ 03:50 AM
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    Default Israel Has Until Week's End to Strike Iran Nuclear Facility...

    Russia thumbing their nose at US and UN sanctions against Iran. Set to load nuclear fuel into Iranian reactor this weekend.

    Iran's finally going nuclear.

    "Iran will have achieved something that no other opponent of Israel, no other enemy of the United States in the Middle East has, and that is a functioning nuclear reactor".
    "What this does is give Iran a second route to nuclear weapons in addition to enriched uranium. It's a very, very huge victory for Iran."



    Israel Has Until Week's End to Strike Iran Nuclear Facility, Bolton Says
    Israel has until the weekend to launch a military strike on Iran's first nuclear plant before the humanitarian risk of an attack becomes too great, former U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations John Bolton said Tuesday.

    A Russian company is expected to help Iran start loading nuclear fuel into its plant on Saturday, after which an attack on the Bushehr reactor could trigger harmful radiation, which Israel wants to avoid, Bolton said. So unless the Israelis act immediately to shut down the facility, it will be too late.

    "Once it's close to the reactor ... the risk is when the reactor is attacked, there will be a release of radiation into the air," Bolton said. "It's most unlikely that they would act militarily after fuel rods are loaded."

    "What this does is give Iran a second route to nuclear weapons in addition to enriched uranium," Bolton said. "It's a very, very huge victory for Iran."

    He noted that the reactor gives Iran something that both Iraq and Syria were never able to achieve because their facilities were destroyed.

    "Iran will have achieved something that no other opponent of Israel, no other enemy of the United States really in the Middle East has, and that is a functioning nuclear reactor".

    Iranian officials on Tuesday warned Israel not to take military action. Iranian media quoted Ahmad Vahidi, Iran's defense minister, as saying Israel would be taking a huge risk with such an attack.

    "We may lose a power plant, but the whole existence of the Zionist regime will be jeopardized," Vahidi was quoted as saying.


    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010...y-bolton-says/




    Meanwhile, in related news...

    Obama says new U.S. sanctions show international resolve in Iran issue
    "The United States and the international community are determined to prevent Iran from acquiring nuclear weapons."
    The sanctions and other steps "are striking at the heart of the Iranian government's ability to fund and develop its nuclear programs," the president said.

    "We are showing the Iranian government that its actions have consequences," Obama said.
    http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/07/...ons/index.html
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  2. #2
    Atomic Punk Wruff_ajax's Avatar
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  3. #3
    Sinner's Swing! graeme's Avatar
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    11.19.17 @ 09:41 AM
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    I've been following this for a while now, trying to get my information from as many sources as possible. It seems the more I know, the more confused I get. The propoganda on all sides makes it almost incomprehensible.

    Whatever happened to the deal Iran offered, to work with the French on fuel and waste that so many were pressing for? It seemed like a safe and pride keeping solution, but it just got swept away.

    Oh well. If Israel does take out the site, Iran will respond, there is no doubt of that. At the very least, Lebanon (and maybe Syria) will be involved in some form too.

    The worst case scenario does not bear thinking about.

    Let's hope cool heads prevail and that someone somewhere comes up with a workable strategy.

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    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    12.13.17 @ 09:31 PM
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    I wish we could just wipe our hands clean of the entire area.

    We have gotten nothing but heartache from having to deal with the bastards, and by bastards I mean all of them, I am not picking any one over the other.

    Israel is going to blow that sucker up, no question, the question is how will others involved respond?
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  5. #5
    Atomic Punk
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    07.24.11 @ 04:36 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by graeme View Post
    I've been following this for a while now, trying to get my information from as many sources as possible. It seems the more I know, the more confused I get. The propoganda on all sides makes it almost incomprehensible.

    Whatever happened to the deal Iran offered, to work with the French on fuel and waste that so many were pressing for? It seemed like a safe and pride keeping solution, but it just got swept away.

    Oh well. If Israel does take out the site, Iran will respond, there is no doubt of that. At the very least, Lebanon (and maybe Syria) will be involved in some form too.

    The worst case scenario does not bear thinking about.

    Let's hope cool heads prevail and that someone somewhere comes up with a workable strategy.

    Idiots, one and all.
    I had not heard a thing about this...sounds like another Cuban Missile Crisis.
    Stay out of it, dude.


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  6. #6
    Sinner's Swing! graeme's Avatar
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    11.19.17 @ 09:41 AM
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    Quote Originally Posted by broken9500 View Post
    I had not heard a thing about this...sounds like another Cuban Missile Crisis.
    I guess in some form or another this has been brewing the last few years. The thing that makes it more relevant at the moment is the huge trade deals that Russia (and I think China) have signed with Iran. The extra sanctions imposed unilaterally by the US have not been well received by Russia to say the least and have been, as is obvious, largely ignored. They didn't sign up to them anyway, so why shouldn't they?

    Also recently, Israel has been ratcheting up the pressure on Syria and Iran, with accusations that both are supplying Hizbullah in Lebanon with longer range, more effective and accurate missiles that Israel claims have the potential to reach anywhere inside it's territory. Whilst there is no concrete proof of this, it does appear likely.

    The ridiculous war between Israel and Hizbullah a few years back was country versus group. The problem here is that it would be an (illegal) attack on a sovereign nation and under international law, Iran would have the right to defend itself, but you can guarantee the missiles will not only be flying in two directions. Lebanon would be almost duty bound to enter the fray, as I believe would Syria.

    Even worse, there have been rumours that Saudi Arabia would allow a narrow air corridor for Israeli jets to use in it's airspace, without interference (Sunni vs Shia) which could start an Arab war and also that the USA/UK would allow Iraqi airspace to be used - hell only knows where that could lead. Neither of these rumours has been confirmed by any party, I should add.

    Even a mid-east Arab vs Arab vs Israeli war, localised as it might be, would be horrific enough, and even if the US/Russia/UK/China were to be able to act as diplomats to try to stop the mess, I think the nightmare scenario would be for Pakistan to get involved (not unthinkable at all) and then you would have two nuclear powers on opposing sides, neither of whom's regimes are noted for their restraint or good judgement.

    This ignores the huge fact that (I think) 40% of the world's oil is shipped through the Strait of Hormutz which Iran could (and probably would) block very easily. Worldwide energy crisis in days.

    Much as a nuclear armed Iran is not the best of ideas, they are still well away from being able to create a warhead and missile capable of delivering it. Even the CIA has said that. Let's hope that the fuel gets delivered. At least that takes the deadline out of the equation and perhaps people will calm down a bit and organise a serious round of talks where the parties actually listen to each other for once.

    Hopefully, this will all blow over like so many other tense moments in mid-east history, but this one has the potential to get very ugly, very quickly.

    If my understanding of this is incorrect, I will gladly admit it. Like I said, I have watched so many versiopns of this unfolding story that it has become next to impossible to get at the truth of what has been happening.
    Last edited by graeme; 08.18.10 at 07:38 AM.
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  7. #7
    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
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    12.14.17 @ 04:34 AM
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    thanks for the info Graeme

  8. #8
    PM Goo with your concerns OLO's Avatar
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    12.14.17 @ 01:36 AM
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    Thanks for the info Graeme.

    None of this makes me all happy inside.
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  9. #9
    Baluchitherium
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    12.11.17 @ 09:44 PM
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    If Iran gets that fuel, then a radical muslim regime has "the bomb". That regime will now become a beacon of rebellion against the West and be called upon to exercise their power, and knowing how Iran loves to stir the pot and comments regarding Israel they have made in the past, it will happen. This is the exact situation and why war with Iran has all but happened yet. The fact Russia is involved should be the most disturbing part of all because that has been the missing element of the new cold war. This has the potential to reach critical mass really fast and as of now it seems that Iran is all in.

    Any predictions of the outcome seeing as how things nuclear never really reach critical mas anymore?
    I believe Russia wants something from the US and this is their way of forcing our hand and a diplomatic solution is reached in agreement for Russia not to provide Iran with fuel. Anybody?
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  10. #10
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    10.05.17 @ 11:44 AM
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    Russia wants to see the US crumble just like how Russia crumbled.
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  11. #11
    Atomic Punk Wruff_ajax's Avatar
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    Don't forget that Israel has had practice recently destroying enemy reactors, having attacked and destroyed Syria's reactor in 2007, and also attacked and destroyed Iraq's reactor facilities in 1981.

    And yeah, once Iran gets this reactor fueled then they're on the fast-track to the bomb. The byproduct of the fuel rods in these reactors is plutonium,, so Iran finally going hot with the fuel rods this weekend is a HUGE game-changer.

    And what Graeme said about Saudi Arabia opening their airspace to Israel recently is true. Just days after Obama told Israel that Iraqi airspace is off-limits to them for such an attack the Saudi's agreed with Israel to stand-down in case of an Israeli strike on Iran and allow Israel to use Saudi airspace for the attack.
    http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle6638568.ece
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  12. #12
    Atomic Punk ziggysmalls's Avatar
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    12.14.17 @ 04:53 AM
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    Yeah no matter the outcome, it will not be good for any of us.

    I always wondered what would have happened had Carter took a more hard line attitude to Iran when the Shaw was overthrown. I don't blame him for what actually occurred but we may have not had this problem had we eliminated the fundamentalist uprising when it happened.

    For one Iraq and Iran would not have gone to war therefore we wouldn't have given Saddam a lot of the technology he eventually used later on against Kuwait and the Kurds. We may have eliminated the likely hood of him invading Kuwait and thus causing the first Gulf War. That would have most likely prevented Bin Ladin from getting pissed at us due to infidel troops being in Saudi Arabia. Therefore 9-11 may have not happened and we wouldn't have troops in Iraq and Afghanistan.

    Funny how one event can trigger a whole slew of events 30 years later.

  13. #13
    Sinner's Swing! graeme's Avatar
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    11.19.17 @ 09:41 AM
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    Quote Originally Posted by shamalama View Post
    If Iran gets that fuel, then a radical muslim regime has "the bomb". That regime will now become a beacon of rebellion against the West and be called upon to exercise their power, and knowing how Iran loves to stir the pot and comments regarding Israel they have made in the past, it will happen. This is the exact situation and why war with Iran has all but happened yet. The fact Russia is involved should be the most disturbing part of all because that has been the missing element of the new cold war. This has the potential to reach critical mass really fast and as of now it seems that Iran is all in.

    Any predictions of the outcome seeing as how things nuclear never really reach critical mas anymore?
    I believe Russia wants something from the US and this is their way of forcing our hand and a diplomatic solution is reached in agreement for Russia not to provide Iran with fuel. Anybody?
    I disagree, though I'm not saying you are wrong, mind. Just my opinion, but I'll tell you why.

    Firstly, having nuclear fuel does not constitute having the bomb. Having nuclear power does not either. It is a long and technologically difficult path to go from one to the other. It would be much easier and cheaper for a country wishing to be a nuclear weapon power to buy one on the black market. There are an astonishing number of warheads and smaller units that went "missing" with the fall of the USSR. If you wanted to bomb a city and, very importantly, get away with it, a suitcase nuke would be a much better option. Why go through all the bother of developing a program, for all the world to see, and then testing weapons (pretty necessary to see if they actually work) even more blatantly in the public eye and then actually firing that weapon. Iran would receive (rightly so) worldwide condemnation and, perhaps more relevantly, a slightly higher than usual for the time of year temperature.

    Second. Does Iran love to stir the pot. You bet. A lot of Ah-my-dinnerjackets proclamations are for domestic consumption. A lot are more like "If you hit me, I will hit you harder" and some, like the "wipe Israel off the map" are a bit of both combined with (so I am told) a subtle bit of mistranslation. Iran does not want to start a war it cannot win, because if this thing did expand, Iran would be the first casualty. That is a fact. Whatever your opinion of this regime (mine is pretty low), none of these guys is stupid or crazy. That myth needs to be rested. Besides, I haven't been counting, but the more aggressive, imflammatory and provocative statements do tend to come from other countries.

    Compare: We will cut off your dick because you just might become a rapist to
    I will cut off your dick if you cut mine off.

    Third. Russia needs a war on it's southern borders and satellites like a hole in the head. We've already seen how complex things are with the Chechnya (Muslim nationalist) uprisings and the recent fracas with Georgia over inguschetia (sp). Russia is stuck with half it's former regions wanting to join NATO and the other half becoming distinctly anti-western. I think Russia's trade deals with Iran are simply that - trade deals. Money that it desperately needs to prop up a huge but fragile economy, especially in light of the recent grain failures. Not saying there isn't more to it than that, but I believe that is the main point.

    Like I said, I've been following this a bit and the thing that worries me most is that the language about the potential for a nuclear Iran is so eerily reminiscent of the phrases used about Iraq's WMDs. Also, the West has a fairly recent history of screwing over Iran in the illegal coup that overthrew Mossadeq in 1953 (who campaigned on a platform of giving the Iranian oil back to the Iranian people, not British Petroleum - See Operation Ajax, now declassified) and then installing the Shah until his downfall in 1979, who was without question a brutal piece of shit on a par with Saddam Hussein. That same class of young intellectual, mostly student people who oversaw the Islamic revolution has transformed, a generation younger into the ones who want greater ties with the west and an end to the strict people in power, but make no mistake. A huge part of the country, mostly rural and less educated, wants the clerics in control, and they will fight if need be. In our world of assymetric warfare, we all know how that one works and I'm sure none of us wants to see it extend.

    This post could go on forever, and I'd rather talk boobies. Like I said. I am not saying "Me right. You wrong". Just respectfully disagreeing and giving my (very simplified) arguments for doing so.

    Hey, you never know. Ahmedinejad and Netanyahu may meet and fall in love and then everyone can watch the weirdest wedding of all time on TV.

    Beats all out global thermo nuclear war. Or even just a mid-east scrap in the car park.
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