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  1. #1
    Atomic Punk
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    12.11.17 @ 04:37 PM
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    Default Friday's visit to Hiroshima by U.S. Ambassador John Roos

    The son of the U.S. Air Force pilot who dropped the first atomic bomb in the history of warfare says the Obama administration's decision to send a U.S. delegation to a ceremony in Japan to mark the 65th anniversary of the attack on Hiroshima is an "unsaid apology" and appears to be an attempt to "rewrite history."

    James Tibbets, son of Brig. Gen. Paul W. Tibbets, Jr., says Friday's visit to Hiroshima by U.S. Ambassador John Roos is an act of contrition that his late father would never have approved.

    "It's an unsaid apology," Tibbets, 66, told FoxNews.com from his home in Georgiana, Ala. "Why wouldn't it be? Why would [Roos] go? It doesn't make any sense.

    "I know it's the anniversary, but I don't know what the hell they're trying to do. It needs to be left alone. The war is over."

    Tibbets, whose father died in 2007 at the age of 92, said he receives dozens of calls from veterans every year around this time thanking him for his father's service. "If it wasn't for your dad, I wouldn't be here,'" Tibbets said many veterans tell him. "This has been going on since he dropped that bomb."

    Tibbets said he sees Roos' impending visit -- it will be the first time the U.S. has sent a delegation to the anniversary commemoration in Hiroshima -- as an attempt to revise history.

    "It's making the Japanese look like they're the poor people, like they didn't do anything," he said. "They hit Pearl Harbor, they struck us. We didn't slaughter the Japanese -- we stopped the war."

    Roughly 140,000 people were killed or died within months after an American B-29 -- nicknamed the Enola Gay -- bombed Hiroshima on Aug. 6, 1945. Three days later, roughly 80,000 people died when the U.S. dropped a second bomb on Nagasaki. Japan surrendered nine days later, bringing an end to World War II.

    White House officials on Wednesday referred calls to the State Department, which did not respond to several inquiries about how the decision was made or if national veterans organizations were contacted prior to the announcement that a delegation would attend the commemoration.

    During Wednesday's daily press briefing, State Department officials defended the visit, saying Roos' attendance at the ceremony "was the right thing to do," spokesman PJ Crowley said.

    The ceremony will begin early Friday with the ringing of a bell and the release of doves. Roos visited Hiroshima weeks after he arrived in Tokyo as a U.S. ambassador last year, and the response was generally positive.

    Lt. Col. Rob Manning, director of public affairs at the Joint Force Headquarters National Capital Region U.S. Military District of Washington, which oversees ceremonies at Arlington National Cemetery, said Japanese officials are "fairly frequent" visitors to the national site.

    "Emperor Hirohito visited the cemetery and placed a wreath at the Tomb of the Unknowns in the early 1970s," Manning wrote in an e-mail. "Most of the more recent prime ministers have also placed wreaths at the Tomb as a part of their official visits to Washington. Service chiefs and ministers of defense also are invited to Washington on official visits and conduct official ceremonies at the Tomb."

    In April, Manning said, Prime Minister Naoto Kan, who was Japan's deputy prime minister for finance at the time, placed a wreath at the Tomb and visited sections of Arlington National Cemetery where Iraq and Afghanistan war veterans are buried.

    Manning said Gen. Ryoichi Oriki, the Japanese Army's chief of staff, also visited the cemetery and placed a wreath on a grave on June 24.

    President Obama is expected to visit Japan in November, and calls have been growing there for him to visit Hiroshima and Nagasaki, since he has spoken of his vision of a nuclear-free world.

    Tibbets said he hopes Obama will decide to forgo visiting to the two cities.

    "What's his purpose? I don't know what it'd do," Tibbet said. "History is history, the past is the past. You can't change it and I don't know why he'd visit Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

    "This all sounds like, 'Oh, we did you wrong.' That's what it sounds like."

    Ryan Gallucci, a spokesman for AMVETS, an organization representing more than 180,000 veterans, said his organization supports the decision to send Roos, but he said the visit should not be seen as a conciliatory act.

    "Considering how our relationship with Japan has evolved into a peaceful partnership over the years, we support the U.S. decision to send an envoy acknowledging the human toll of WWII," Gallucci said in a statement to FoxNews.com. "To AMVETS, the U.S. visit is an appropriate act of reciprocation for Japan's solidarity over the years, such as last summer's visit to the Punch Bowl National Cemetery (the National Memorial Cemetery of the Pacific) by Emperor Akihito, where he laid a wreath in honor of America's sacrifices in WWII.

    "However, in no way should the United States be expected to apologize for its actions, and we hope that this visit will not be misconstrued as an act of contrition."

    Paul Schalow, a professor of Japanese at Rutgers University, told FoxNews.com that Japanese media outlets are linking Roos' visit to Obama's desire to rid the world of nuclear weapons.

    "They're linking it to Obama's speech in Prague," he said. "They connect Roos being there as proof of interest by the Obama administration to reduce the number of atomic weapons worldwide."

    Schalow said Roos' visit appears to "pave the way" for Obama to visit the two cities that were decimated by atomic bombs 65 years ago.

    "I imagine the Japanese would be eager to receive a U.S. president," he said. "The real question is the domestic reaction to it. [White House officials] are probably observing reactions of veterans' groups to this official visit by Roos."

    Schalow speculated that Roos' visit could be a step toward positioning the U.S. to condemn any future use of atomic weapons, perhaps by North Korea.

    "If we show some regret of our own use of the weapon, if it happens again, we're in a moral position to criticize," he said. "As of now, we're not in a position to denounce it."

    Kia Tibbets, James Tibbets' daughter, said her grandfather would be disappointed with Friday's ceremony if he were alive today.

    "Embarrassed might be the word, that the government wasn't backing him up anymore," said Tibbets, 35, of Columbus, Ohio. "But then again, that's politics for you."

    The Associated Press contributed to this report.
    "Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack.” -- Gen. George S. Patton

  2. #2
    Good Enough VH Wahoo's Avatar
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  3. #3
    Atomic Punk
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    07.24.11 @ 04:36 PM
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    hmm....I'm sure this will turn into the whole "obama apologizing to the world" bit and that's fine...everyone needs to vent or whatever but, at this moment, I'm not sure I have a huge problem with this.

    The US and Japan have come a long way since WWII. The two countries are long time allies. This is a good thing.

    There is a great desire on the part of many many people in many different countries to avoid ever having another bomb dropped anywhere else. This is a good thing.

    I see nothing inherently wrong in the US acknowledging the horrible reality of WWII, the death toll in Japan (yes we all know that most likely a ground invasion would have been necessary without the bomb, an invasion that would have cost hundreds of thousands of US lives) after the bombs were dropped and then pointing to our peaceful alliance with Japan, their incredible development and using that as a foundation to call for dismantling and reduction of nuclear weaponry around the world.

    There's nothing wrong with both countries standing up and using their collective expierences as the only countries involved in actual atomic bomb dropping as a call for peace.

    I don't think it shows weakness on the part of the US to acknowledge the past and attempt to use it as means of moving forward. I think it shows fortitude of character...granted, if it turns into a whole "the US is very sorry and we shouldn't have done that and we used to be evil imperialist bastards" that's a whole other story...but showing respect and reverence and yes even regret that humanity had to reach a point where an atomic bomb had to be dropped, is not a bad thing.
    Stay out of it, dude.


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  4. #4
    Atomic Punk Viking's Avatar
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    11.02.17 @ 09:45 PM
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    I read this last night and I don't have a problem with it, as long as it's not overdone.
    "Viking - last to sleep, first to rise, last to leave, that's how the Nords of old rocked the house." ~ timmac in the 'Texas Linkers' thread talking about yours truly. :-)

  5. #5
    PM Goo with your concerns OLO's Avatar
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    12.11.17 @ 08:07 AM
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    Default

    Hmmmm....Maybe they should not have bombed Pearl Harbor.
    ((Just My Two Cents))
    And thats about what its worth.

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    12.11.17 @ 04:50 PM
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    I am ok with an apology if Japan apologizes to every country it harmed in WW2. Like OLO said if they never bombed Pearl Harbor, then there would have never been an atomic bomb dropped on their country.

    The country was given an opportunity to unconditionally surrender prior to the bomb yet they turned it down. In fact if it wasn't for the Emperor finally having enough the generals wanted an invasion of Japan. It saved lives no matter what revisionist's say and according to our war plans, we were going to drop a whole lot more on the beachheads which would have really fucked up their country and killed a lot of our soldiers with radiation poisoning.

    It was the worse war ever conducted in human history. Compared to the Jews, Soviet Union, Poland, Ukraine, Italy, Korea, China, Phillipines and even Germany they got off really light for the damage they did.

  7. #7
    Atomic Punk Wruff_ajax's Avatar
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    12.11.17 @ 10:29 PM
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    The Japanese dude putting on this Hiroshima ceremony said that anything less than an apology from the U.S. is unacceptable.
    I'm okay with attending the ceremony, but if this administration bows down again and apologizes to the Japanese now for bombing them then we have a problem.




    Check out this video of Obama in Japan last year when asked by Japanese reporters about the subject of bombing Hiroshima and Nagasaki......


    JAPANESE REPORTER: What is your understanding of the historical meaning of the A-bombing in Hiroshima and Nagasaki? Do you think it was the right decision?

    Obama took a deep breath, paused . . . and punted.

    PBO gave a halting response that utterly failed to answer the question. The closest he came was to observe that Japan "has a unique perspective on the issue of nuclear weapons as a consequence of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, and I'm sure it helps to motivate the Prime Minister's deep interest in this issue."

    The reporter tried again: "do you believe the US dropping of nuclear weapons on --"

    Obama cut him off, choosing to answer an unrelated question on the situation in North Korea.

    Duck Dodger Obama
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  8. #8
    PM Goo with your concerns OLO's Avatar
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    12.11.17 @ 08:07 AM
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    How about this for an answer - Dont attack us and we wont blow your shit up!!!!!
    ((Just My Two Cents))
    And thats about what its worth.

  9. #9
    Hang 'Em High
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    12.10.17 @ 08:06 AM
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    the thing people have to remember is its not countries as an entity that make these choices. I'm pretty sure those 140,000 people who died didn't all agree to bomb Pearl Harbor. Nor did every American believes(s) the atomic bomb was the right answer. Patriotism and nationality are meaningless, the fact thousands of people died is the bottom line and for that reason its good of the U.S. to attend.

  10. #10
    Imperial Fascist Overlord Down In Flames's Avatar
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    Japan loves nothing more than to wrap itself in the shroud of victimhood. 65 years ago it was, literally, a fascist nation. It was, literally, imperialist.

    What changed that? Those two fucking atomic bombs. Yes, innocents died. And because they did, millions didn't. It's because of America that an island nation could rebuild and truly transform itself into a (relatively) peaceful, prosperous democratic entity.

    Japan asking for an apology is hypocrisy of the highest order. Seriously, Google this phrase - "Japan has never apologized" - and behold the warmth and kindness of the Japanese who've always been so kind and generous to their neighbors.

    As I understand it, they don't teach their students about their WWII atrocities. Rape of Nanking, "comfort wives," Pearl Harbor... It's bizarre.
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  11. #11
    Sinner's Swing! VH122's Avatar
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    12.10.17 @ 12:18 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ain't Talkin' Bout' Love View Post
    the thing people have to remember is its not countries as an entity that make these choices. I'm pretty sure those 140,000 people who died didn't all agree to bomb Pearl Harbor. Nor did every American believes(s) the atomic bomb was the right answer. Patriotism and nationality are meaningless, the fact thousands of people died is the bottom line and for that reason its good of the U.S. to attend.
    I totally disagree!
    This ceremony should be about the family and friends who have lost loved ones in the bombing of these two cities.Not political divas who seek nothing but media attention and popularity points.

  12. #12
    Atomic Punk
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    07.24.11 @ 04:36 PM
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    DIF brings up a very important point which is why I'm not in favour of an "apology." I don't want to see the US apologize from dropping the bombs. That's a bunch of bullshit.

    What I do think could be beneficial is to see remembrance and remorse on the part of BOTH countries. Honestly, unless this is part of something that will involve the Japanese sending a delegate to Pearl Harbour to look back on what happened there, I see no reason to take part in this.

    I do think that enough time has past that both countries, and the world, could benefit greatly from coming together, not for apologies, but for rememberance and acknowledgement of the evil and violence that led to such events as Pearl Harbour and the bombs.

    What I don't want to see is representatives of our country bowing to another and saying "yeah we shouldn't have done that...we were wrong."

    I'd much rather see both countries marking the harm that was done collectively, celebrate the good that has been made of it and look forward to more good that can be done in partnership.
    Stay out of it, dude.


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  13. #13
    Atomic Punk stilleddiesangel's Avatar
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    08.25.17 @ 05:45 PM
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    My Dad fought the Japanses in India and Burma. The stories he told me of the way the Japanese worked is horrific and he saw a lot of that at close quarters. He always believed the bombings had to be done. When you are dealing with Kamikaze fighters there is no negotiationing. They would have fought on and on and on. The bombings saved a lot of lives.. period.
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    05.21.17 @ 06:42 PM
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    Christopher Titus has a unique perspective on contrition. LOL

    For some reason, I'm getting an error message, but in case others can watch this.

    The whole thing is funny, and when he get's to the part about the A-Bomb, I think it's "fitting" for the thread.

    "Jesus, that fucker just crawled out of his hen house that was destroyed by the Alabama tornados. Fucking 280mph plus winds sucked the gleam off this bitch and passed it on to a bird in Rhoad Island." - Hurricane Halen 5/3/11 (about my birthday chicken from seenbad)

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  15. #15
    Atomic Punk Little Dreamer's Avatar
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    12.11.17 @ 05:57 PM
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    True but what about the toddlers who died? You can't blame Pearl Harbor on them, nobody asked them.
    The bombs did end the war. But was it necessary to drop them on civilians? Couldn't they have chosen a military target instead? Or a field? I mean after seeing the explosion I'm pretty sure Japan would've surrendered. It's not like the citizens of Hiroshima had voted for the war or for Pearl Harbor. They were not part of that decision, they were minding their business in a small provincial town of Japan, which at the time was a dictatorship with no elections. I'm not sure why dropping an atomic bomb on babies, elderlies, etc. was necessary. It's like if some dictator took control of the US, invaded another country, and the other country's response was to nuke Cleveland, Milwaukee or Topeka!

    And also I truly do not understand the second bomb. For sure that one was not necessary. It wasn't the age of the internet back then, you needed to let the news travel for a few days and for sure the first bomb would've done the trick and Japan would've surrendered.
    Little Dreamer

 

 

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