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  1. #1
    Atomic Punk
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    Default Unemployment Map - Month by month decline in employment

    Unemployment Map - Month by month decline in employment



    http://www.youtube.com/user/latoyaegwuekwe
    "Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack. -- Gen. George S. Patton

  2. #2
    Good Enough
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  3. #3
    Hot For Teacher Superbird's Avatar
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  4. #4
    Romeo Delight godisEd's Avatar
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    How's that hope and change working out for you America?

    Last edited by godisEd; 07.18.10 at 11:51 PM.

  5. #5
    Atomic Punk Viking's Avatar
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    Wow! Looks like I need to move to Nebraska.

    Obama didn't tell everybody that "hope and change" meant that we'll need to have hope because change is all we'll have left!
    "Viking - last to sleep, first to rise, last to leave, that's how the Nords of old rocked the house." ~ timmac in the 'Texas Linkers' thread talking about yours truly. :-)

  6. #6
    Atomic Punk edwardv's Avatar
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    12.16.17 @ 11:32 PM
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    Bush started it and Obama is not ending it. Looks like Dumb and Dumber.
    EVH 1979: Well, actually it's not much of a vacation, because we run everything ourselves. We design our own album cover, we have to be in the office every day to sign checks - the whole corporation revolves around us. Nothing can be done without our approval. We even have photo approval.

  7. #7
    Atomic Punk Viking's Avatar
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    12.14.17 @ 03:26 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by edwardv View Post
    Bush started it and Obama is not ending it. Looks like Dumb and Dumber.
    No doubt that Bush should shoulder some of the blame, as well as should Clinton. Throw in Christopher Dodd, Maxine Waters, and Barney Frank for good measure, especially for the housing bubble. Subprime Mortgages anyone? Bush tried to regulate it and these clowns said that there was nothing wrong. That was what got the snowball rolling towards hell in the first place.
    "Viking - last to sleep, first to rise, last to leave, that's how the Nords of old rocked the house." ~ timmac in the 'Texas Linkers' thread talking about yours truly. :-)

  8. #8
    Hang 'Em High Wray's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Viking View Post
    No doubt that Bush should shoulder some of the blame, as well as should Clinton. Throw in Christopher Dodd, Maxine Waters, and Barney Frank for good measure, especially for the housing bubble. Subprime Mortgages anyone? Bush tried to regulate it and these clowns said that there was nothing wrong. That was what got the snowball rolling towards hell in the first place.
    I thought this was about unemployment?

    Regardless, Bush wanted to regulate Fannie and Freddie, which isn't a bad thing, but the devil is in the details. He wanted to do it by creating another new agency, this time within the Treasury Department. I thought Republicans were against big government?

    Bush's proposed regulations also did nothing to address subprime loans within the private sector, which was over 2/3 of the problem.

  9. #9
    Atomic Punk Viking's Avatar
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    It is about unemployment. It had to start somewhere. I'm no fan of George Bush, I'll tell you that much but I'm tired of this administration putting it all on Bush. At what point does this not become Bush's fault? If everything is still bad by the 2012 elections, is it still Bush's fault?
    "Viking - last to sleep, first to rise, last to leave, that's how the Nords of old rocked the house." ~ timmac in the 'Texas Linkers' thread talking about yours truly. :-)

  10. #10
    Gird your loins Daisy Hill's Avatar
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    12.16.17 @ 07:41 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wray View Post
    I thought this was about unemployment?

    Regardless, Bush wanted to regulate Fannie and Freddie, which isn't a bad thing, but the devil is in the details. He wanted to do it by creating another new agency, this time within the Treasury Department. I thought Republicans were against big government?

    Bush's proposed regulations also did nothing to address subprime loans within the private sector, which was over 2/3 of the problem.

    the greed of the banks and their desire to make themselves and stockholders ever more wealthy, was the cause of this. This was not limited to the mega banks. I know of several small banks, in areas where one cannot say that minority loans or ACORN were pushing this, who kept themselves VERY busy marketing refi-s to good customers who were encouraged to shake their homes like piggy banks and take out far too much in home equity loans.... and these loans got resold and refi-ed so often it was like kids trading baseball cards at the park...and every transaction meant somebody got paid...those loan officers got paid bonus fees based on VOLUME VOLUME VOLUME...and they took good customers and, figuratively speaking, held the door to bankruptcy court for them

    they turned good clients into sub prime clients

    these were small local banks....one of these small local banks who recruited me to take my business to them couldn't be bothered to take the time to read a business plan or submit a commercial loan request because they were swamped with refi's....it was an important loan to me, and would have created 2 fulltime and 3 part time jobs in our small town but it was meaningless to them....their priorities had changed


    the housing market was like an avalanche....other problems with the economy were there waiting like a giant snowpack...the greed in going after the sub prime loans was just the shot fired into the snowpack ....and then the whole thing came down and buried us all....it'll take a long time to dig out too.

    survivor of the Bowling Green Massacre 9-3-2016 BGSU 10 OSU 77

    She was warned. She was given an explanation. Nevertheless, she persisted.

  11. #11
    Hang 'Em High Wray's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Viking View Post
    It is about unemployment. It had to start somewhere. I'm no fan of George Bush, I'll tell you that much but I'm tired of this administration putting it all on Bush. At what point does this not become Bush's fault? If everything is still bad by the 2012 elections, is it still Bush's fault?
    It will be a long time to come before it's no longer Bush's fault, if ever; just as well for Reagan, Bush I and Clinton. Everything that is happening now can mostly be laid at the feet of those four men.

    Like him or not, agree with him or not, we won't be able to judge the long-term effects that Obama's decisions have made on the economy at least, most likely, until around the 2012 elections. That is simply the reality of the situation.

    Political prejudice is a faulty perspective.

  12. #12
    Atomic Punk edwardv's Avatar
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    I agree with you Wray people live in the now and want instant everything. The fact is this country has been grossly mismanaged for a long long time at almost every level. In the private sector that gets you fired in government it means very little.
    EVH 1979: Well, actually it's not much of a vacation, because we run everything ourselves. We design our own album cover, we have to be in the office every day to sign checks - the whole corporation revolves around us. Nothing can be done without our approval. We even have photo approval.

  13. #13
    Atomic Punk lovemachine97(Version 2)'s Avatar
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    It seems to me that by trying to numb the pain we are prolonging the injury. Markets correct, bubbles pop, and a true bottom needs to be found. Aren't we just trying to blow air back into the bubble? Aren't the past and current policies encouraging more reckless behavior, and stymieing other behaviors that will prolong this mess, including unemployment?

    Why would the government, who absolutely did have a hand in this mess, be the saviors to get us out of this? Why not just let the pain happen, and let the market correct itself? It would hurt more, but for a shorter amount of time--and let us recover faster.

    The way I understand is that the 1977 CRA mandated lenders offer credit across their entire market, not just the high-income market, encouraging banks to make loans to riskier customers. This evolved to include subprime lending where those with poor credit history and a poor financial situation where able to get housing loans with a higher, adjustable interest rate.

    In 1995, as the CRA was strengthened, Fannie and Freddie started recieving tax incentives to purchase these subprime loans. In 1996, the United States Department of Housing and Urban Development gave Fannie and Freddie a goal of 42% as the percentage of loans that they purchased to be from those with an income below the median in their area. This became 52% by 2005. These GSEs had became important in the demand for these subprime securities.

    Bear Stearns did the first securitization of CRA loans in 1997, $380 million backed by Freddie. By 2007, Bear Stearns issued $2 billion in CRA loans backed by Freddie or Fannie. Between 2000 and 2002 Fannie Mae securitized $394 billion in CRA loans.

    Fannie, Freddie, and banks actually opposed and lobbied against these laws and changes, but then realized there was profitability if housing prices continued to rise.

    The TRA in 1997 created exclusions in capital gains and rental properties, and funds rate hits a 40-year low, further increasing demand.

    Isn't government policy just as much to blame as the actions of the corporations? I mean BECAUSE banks were not lending to lower-income families--those who are risky investments because of the high risk they could default--Congress enacted the CRA to mandate that banks actually do it. Then they gave guarantees and tax breaks to entities to purchase those loans. Then, when it burst, we bailed out those companies. Where does greed and the failure of the free market outweigh the influence of the government in this? The free market, as I understand it, would be responsible citizens entering into an agreement with a bank where the citizen, or homebuyer, would want the best rate possible and the banks would want their money back. If the homeowner couldn't pay, they would lose the house, and if the bank made too many bad loans, they risked going out of business. The banks and citizens would weigh their reward versus real risk. Instead, the government told banks to lend to people they didn't want to lend to, gave great incentives to entities to purchase the mortgages, giving incentive to more buyers, driving prices higher, then bailed all the companies out when it ran out of steam. Obama said, "They wanted to let the market run free, but instead they let it run wild." What?

    Would this have happened without government policy? Maybe, we'll never know. Banks could have started going crazy with this on their own. But we DO know that it DID happen with these policies. The answer now is to give the government MORE control over the industry? That's like calling the arsonist, not the fire department, to put the fire out.

    Let the bubble pop. Unemployment would still be bad. It would hurt. But lets take our lumps and get it over with, or we are just prolonging the inevitable.

  14. #14
    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lovemachine97(Version 2) View Post
    It seems to me that by trying to numb the pain we are prolonging the injury. Markets correct, bubbles pop, and a true bottom needs to be found. Aren't we just trying to blow air back into the bubble? Aren't the past and current policies encouraging more reckless behavior, and stymieing other behaviors that will prolong this mess, including unemployment?

    Why would the government, who absolutely did have a hand in this mess, be the saviors to get us out of this? Why not just let the pain happen, and let the market correct itself? It would hurt more, but for a shorter amount of time--and let us recover faster.
    By decreasing the level of pain by making it last longer you hope to not kill the patient. There is something to be said for this. There are mistakes being made now by governments around the world by trying to spend out of the mess, the bigger mistakes however were made by previous governments who found a way to run up huge debt numbers during "good times".

  15. #15
    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    We are reaping the rewards of falling behind in the education of our youth the past thirty years.

    At one point in time, the United States was either first or close to the top of almost every important educational category.

    Now we are no where near the top of the list.

    This is huge over simplification of course of a very complicated issue, but no one can convince me otherwise that we have an ever increasing amount per capita of absolute idiots in this country.

    Absolute idiots don't get jobs, and voila, you have the results.
    Taylor Swift is nice to look at. Adele can sing.

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    David Lee Roth did the impossible. He made Van Halen better. Deal with it!

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