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  1. #1
    Romeo Delight
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    Default Standard Tremolo vs Floyd Rose

    which is better, tricks for making standard stay in tune, the whole shebang. Now if you don't mind, i'm gonna go hide behind this rock while the shootout commences.

  2. #2
    Atomic Punk
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    07.24.11 @ 04:36 PM
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    I dont do divebombs and all sorts of crazy stuff with my tremolo bar so I've always preferred standard. I do have a guitar with a floyd on it, and it's cool to have but nothing I would put on every guitar and nothing I look for when buying a new guitar.

    And to be honest, as incredibly heavy handed as I am, I rarely have trouble keeping guitars in tune. I put a few extra windings on the posts and stretch them well before I get into and I buy good strings.
    Stay out of it, dude.


    I am Van Halen.

  3. #3
    Hot For Teacher danward5150's Avatar
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    If you're going to use the bar I recommend a floyd. All of my guitars without a floyd are blocked so they don't move. If you're intent on using a standard trem I'd be sure to use locking tuners (sperzels) and a roller nut to reduce friction. I have this on both of my strats but it still doesn't help a lot. Just makes it easier to change strings.

    Good luck.

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    "Best" is all a matter of preference really.
    I prefer a Floyd Rose.

    Vintage style trems can be made to stay in tune but alot really depends on the setup and the guitar itself (headstock design, angle of the strings coming off the nut, string trees, etc..)

    For example, PRS guitars use a vintage style trem BUT ... their design is such that the strings are guided straight from the nut to the tuners with just enough pitch to provide proper intonation, but not so much as to cause the strings to bind up in the nut (which is made of a teflon type material).
    Locking tuners help as well, but IMO, it's the angle and pitch of the strings coming off the nut that make the biggest difference.

    Other "tricks" include fabricating angled shims for the tuners so they stagger the height of the strings and eliminate the need for string trees.
    Again, stressing the importance of the pitch and angle of the strings coming off the nut.

    You can also try loosening the inner (4) baseplate screws which would allow the trem to function on 2 pivot points.
    There are also an aray of low friction nuts, roller nuts, and nut lubricant available as well. (he he ... nut lubricant. )

  5. #5
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    11.17.15 @ 08:56 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by broken9500 View Post
    I put a few extra windings on the posts and stretch them well before I get into and I buy good strings.
    On the contrary, I believe "extra windings" only provide more potential for strings to slip and stretch out of tune.

    IMO, the less windings, the better.

  6. #6
    Romeo Delight
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    tone wise i heard floyds can be tinny. anyway to cure this

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    Quote Originally Posted by locano78 View Post
    tone wise i heard floyds can be tinny. anyway to cure this
    A brass big block upgrade helps.
    You can also try "blocking" the trem by mounting a hard wood block between the trem block and the cavity.
    Applying contact with the trem block should allow for better transfer in sound, tone and sustain.

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    Good Enough SLEEPER5150's Avatar
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    Tonewise, I prefer standard. I do have a first year Floyd that alot of the chrome has fallen off of around the arm pivot, and it generally looks trashed but it still works great, and it has to be the closest sounding to a standard bridge of any Floyds or Floyd liscenced jobs I've played. For standard Fender trems though, I too don't have that much issue with tuning during use. I use Floyds primarily for reduced string breakage, and having fine tuning right at your fingertips. The most important thing with a standard bridge is of coarse to have the right nut/fret slots. I fashion mine from bone, and make the bottom of the slot a little flat, and taper the sides slightly. Great sustain, easy to work with, and binds less than plastic, or brass. (graphite is a whole other discussion. I find it to soft and wears exceptionally fast) The other thing is string trees. At most I just use the B & E tree, and I usually file or hone the edges of the tree (where the string enters an leaves the tree) as well as wipe a little oil on the underside of it when changing strings. These tips have served me very well.
    Last edited by SLEEPER5150; 06.23.09 at 10:58 AM.
    She looks so $#@!'n good ,so sexy and so frail....Somethin's got the bite on me, I'm goin' straight to Hell.

  9. #9
    Atomic Punk
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dino5150 View Post
    On the contrary, I believe "extra windings" only provide more potential for strings to slip and stretch out of tune.

    IMO, the less windings, the better.
    really? My experience has led me to the exact opposite conclusion. Years ago I would only put a couple on there and they were always slipping and throwing the tuning out of whack. After a while I just started adding more turns when I strung up...I probably use twice as many windings as what you'd find from the factory and I've had excellent results...that plus good strings and getting them good and stretched out...and I always make sure that I get a very very tight fit around the post.

    I can't remember the last time I had to tune in the middle of a show or rehearsal...hell, I can't remember the last time I rehearsed and had to retune after tearing down, packing, moving into the venue and setting up. My guitars are just very stable. Seriously, I'll retune out of compulsion, but it's always dead on...once I get the strings on there the way I like.

    Then again, I don't do a lot of the acrobatics that some of you guys may do. As heavy handed as I am and as much as I bend my strings to create modulation, I seldom attack my trem bar....so that may have a lot to do with it.
    Stay out of it, dude.


    I am Van Halen.

  10. #10
    Eruption
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    Quote Originally Posted by locano78 View Post
    which is better, tricks for making standard stay in tune, the whole shebang. Now if you don't mind, i'm gonna go hide behind this rock while the shootout commences.
    Standard Tremolo vs Floyd Rose: IMO, a three-decade-old subjective argument that, in the final analysis, comes down to only one thing- a matter of personal preference!
    And yes, some will swear that the Floyd "sucks tone" while the other side laments about the inherent tuning stability problems of a sixty-something-year-old design (that, by the way, was never made for the divebombs and overall abuse of Hendrix or Eddie in the first place!), but in the end, it's what YOU prefer and what you're willing to put up with to keep your guitar in tune! I personally prefer the Floyd for it's "clamp it and forget it" set-up. I compensate for any "tone loss" by adding big blocks, mounting the bridge flush to the body and adjusting the pick-up height and the pick-up screw poles.
    Last edited by jimi11580; 06.23.09 at 11:43 AM.
    WGAF?!!

  11. #11
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    11.17.15 @ 08:56 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by broken9500 View Post
    really? My experience has led me to the exact opposite conclusion. Years ago I would only put a couple on there and they were always slipping and throwing the tuning out of whack. After a while I just started adding more turns when I strung up...I probably use twice as many windings as what you'd find from the factory and I've had excellent results...that plus good strings and getting them good and stretched out...and I always make sure that I get a very very tight fit around the post.

    I can't remember the last time I had to tune in the middle of a show or rehearsal...hell, I can't remember the last time I rehearsed and had to retune after tearing down, packing, moving into the venue and setting up. My guitars are just very stable. Seriously, I'll retune out of compulsion, but it's always dead on...once I get the strings on there the way I like.

    Then again, I don't do a lot of the acrobatics that some of you guys may do. As heavy handed as I am and as much as I bend my strings to create modulation, I seldom attack my trem bar....so that may have a lot to do with it.
    Well, I'd imagine if you literally just wind the string around the peg, the more windings the better, but I really don't recommend using that method.

    Using standard, non-locking tuners, I just slide the string through the peg hole, then bring it back under and over. Then when you wind the peg, the string locks itself into place. You could then end up with as little as 1/2 a winding on the peg, depending on how much slack you use when you string it up. The less string material there is to stretch, the better IMO.
    That's one of the reasons why locking tuners work so well.

    I wish I were at a computer that allowed me to post pics.

  12. #12
    Atomic Punk
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    The way I do it is pull the string through the hole tight. Then, I back it out a length equal to about one and half the distance to from post to post. Then, at that point I bend the string tight against the post and start winding. Probably 4 windings before it achieves tension. I've been using that system for almost ten years and have had great results with it. When I do it like they do at the factory, I bend the strings out of tune and sometimes I've even yanked them out of the post all together.

    Now, with Washburn P4, it has locking tuners and as long as I get really really tight, I don't have that problem where they go flat or pull out, precisely because there's so much tension holding that string in place and in tune.
    Stay out of it, dude.


    I am Van Halen.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by broken9500 View Post
    The way I do it is pull the string through the hole tight. Then, I back it out a length equal to about one and half the distance to from post to post. Then, at that point I bend the string tight against the post and start winding. Probably 4 windings before it achieves tension. I've been using that system for almost ten years and have had great results with it. When I do it like they do at the factory, I bend the strings out of tune and sometimes I've even yanked them out of the post all together.

    Now, with Washburn P4, it has locking tuners and as long as I get really really tight, I don't have that problem where they go flat or pull out, precisely because there's so much tension holding that string in place and in tune.
    If you're using a Floyd, just string the ball ends through the hole in the tuning peg.
    That works well too.

  14. #14
    Atomic Punk
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dino5150 View Post
    If you're using a Floyd, just string the ball ends through the hole in the tuning peg.
    That works well too.
    i always cut the balls off...it actually never occurred to me to string it backwards!
    Stay out of it, dude.


    I am Van Halen.

  15. #15
    Romeo Delight
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    one other thing to consider is how you use your bar.if you are hoping for shimmering 60's kinda sounds ....well i find it harder w/a floyd than a strat syle bar.........the de-tune/pitch change is far wider w/a floyd than the un-locked reg.bar............at least in my experience...............but if you do goup /down agressively.then there is no subsitute for a floyd...........imho

 

 

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