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  1. #1
    Atomic Punk
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    05.31.14 @ 08:17 PM
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    Default Al Qaeda Mass Murders That The News Doesn't Want You To Know About.

    If you need a simple illustration between US forces and Al Qaeda then all you need to know is this:

    In Iraq, the US has sent forces to rebuild the country. Outside of the Iraqi Government (which doesn't listen to us anyway) we really don't impose anything on the Iraqi people themselves. Most Iraqis do their best to go about their business and stay out of our way.

    In Iraq, Al Qaeda has sent forces to fight US/Coalition forces and force a civil war upon the people of Iraq. Al Qaeda on the ground will move into small towns and take over by murdering the families of those who resist them. They then erect kangaroo courts and then start trials of their new "Citizens".

    Al Qaeda has killed more Iraqi civillians than the US Military has. Many US engagements with Al Qaeda and other insurgets have failed because the US didn't want to risk civillian lives.

    Al Qaeda doesn't give a shit.

    You can read Michael Yon's latest dispatch here: **Note - Disturbing Images**

    http://michaelyon-online.com/wp/bles...d-children.htm

    It is also good to note that our ground forces refused to take the AQ bait and rush into their IED ambush. It is also good to read something honest about the new Iraqi Army.

    Check it out.
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  2. #2
    Little Dreamer Evmeister's Avatar
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    They are to the point of what could more than likely be daignosed clinical insanity (cutting the heads off children in no way represents a tactical military action, nor would it relate to any religious statement unless you're a psychopath). It just doesn't make sense.

  3. #3
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    Anyone see the NBC Nightly News on the topic of the growing popularity of Al-Qaida? It really makes you guess our future circumstances.
    Respects.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post
    If you need a simple illustration between US forces and Al Qaeda then all you need to know is this:

    In Iraq, the US has sent forces to rebuild the country. Outside of the Iraqi Government (which doesn't listen to us anyway) we really don't impose anything on the Iraqi people themselves. Most Iraqis do their best to go about their business and stay out of our way.

    In Iraq, Al Qaeda has sent forces to fight US/Coalition forces and force a civil war upon the people of Iraq. Al Qaeda on the ground will move into small towns and take over by murdering the families of those who resist them. They then erect kangaroo courts and then start trials of their new "Citizens".

    Al Qaeda has killed more Iraqi civillians than the US Military has. Many US engagements with Al Qaeda and other insurgets have failed because the US didn't want to risk civillian lives.

    Al Qaeda doesn't give a shit.

    You can read Michael Yon's latest dispatch here: **Note - Disturbing Images**

    http://michaelyon-online.com/wp/bles...d-children.htm

    It is also good to note that our ground forces refused to take the AQ bait and rush into their IED ambush. It is also good to read something honest about the new Iraqi Army.

    Check it out.
    Its hard to believe that Al Qda would kill more civilians with cell phone bombs then Americans that are loaded with all that we have. JETS,HELICOPTERS,TANKS,NAVY SHIPS and all the weaponry that comes with it. Why wouldnt American media tell us about this and why would you think that the U.S. government would tell us how many civilians have really been killed. Im not arguing but I dont believe anything our government tells us anymore. The truth is out there but Im sure we will never know.

  5. #5
    Atomic Punk FORD's Avatar
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    Al Qaeda isn't even in Iraq. God, why does anybody believe these fucking lies anymore.

    The "insurgents" in Iraq are simply Iraqis who want an occupying army to get the Hell out of their country. And while I don't like the fact that Americans get killed in the process, the Iraqis DO have every right to want the occupation ended.

    Think Redcoats. Think King George. Think the "insurgents" of that day. Were they right or wrong? Were they "terraists"?? I'm sure the British thought so.

    And then there's the Sectarian bullshit. Sunni vs Shia. Never would have happened without the invasion, because Saddam Hussein - despite his many faults - didn't go for that shit, just like the Commies didn't go for that shit in Yugoslavia.
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  6. #6
    Baluchitherium loveevhsince79's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FORD View Post
    Al Qaeda isn't even in Iraq. God, why does anybody believe these fucking lies anymore.

    The "insurgents" in Iraq are simply Iraqis who want an occupying army to get the Hell out of their country. And while I don't like the fact that Americans get killed in the process, the Iraqis DO have every right to want the occupation ended.

    Think Redcoats. Think King George. Think the "insurgents" of that day. Were they right or wrong? Were they "terraists"?? I'm sure the British thought so.

    And then there's the Sectarian bullshit. Sunni vs Shia. Never would have happened without the invasion, because Saddam Hussein - despite his many faults - didn't go for that shit, just like the Commies didn't go for that shit in Yugoslavia.
    If Al Qeada is not in Iraq, why did their #2 guy say in the recent video statement that they needed to continue their work there and called for more people to join the insurgency?

  7. #7
    Atomic Punk
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    Quote Originally Posted by loveevhsince79 View Post
    If Al Qeada is not in Iraq, why did their #2 guy say in the recent video statement that they needed to continue their work there and called for more people to join the insurgency?
    Some people need Al Qaeda to be a myth because AQ's views tend to mirror their own.

    Its hard to believe that Al Qda would kill more civilians with cell phone bombs then Americans that are loaded with all that we have. JETS,HELICOPTERS,TANKS,NAVY SHIPS and all the weaponry that comes with it. Why wouldnt American media tell us about this and why would you think that the U.S. government would tell us how many civilians have really been killed. Im not arguing but I dont believe anything our government tells us anymore. The truth is out there but Im sure we will never know.
    If you find it hard to believe then you have a very dark soul.

    The US Military never deliberately targets civilains. One of our handicaps is that we announce offensives in advance so that the locals can get out of town, often the insurgents (including Al Qaeda) slip out with them. That's not to say that we don't kill civilians, we do, it's just that we don't go out of our way to do so. Part of the problem is that Iraqis instinctually hide inside of their houses instead of running away. This is because of living under Saddam Hussein's brutal dicatorship taught them that there was no where to run. Throw in the confusion that follows an IED attack and the FACT that insurgents and Al Qaeda fighters will position themselves amongst civilians and it becomes clear how they fall to American weapons. They often take over households by force and tie up the occupants and then draw fire from US tanks or aircraft. Remember, Al Qaeda fighters are suicidal, so they win if they die. They compound their victory by forcing Americans to kill civillans because Al Jazeera camera men never seem to be too far behind, so on the evening news in the Middle East they see dead Iraqi civilains and then US helicopters circling overhead.

    There are numerous times where attacks have been called off because of the presence of civilians. There are dead American servicemen because operations changed because of civilians being found in a location, heavy weapons couldn't be used but the target still needed to be taken. This meant that instead of a JDAM strike, Marines or Army infantrymen had to be used.
    The DoD has also prosecuted and jailed many soldiers who have commited murder in Iraq and put them in prison.

    Al Qaeda and the rest of the pig-fucking freaks in Iraq have made it a point to target civilians. Their only targets are civilians. They target crowded market places and girl's schools. There are usually no American troops in the area when these attacks go down. At no time have American forces fired into a crowded market place, even when they've drawn fire.

    As for the noble Iraqi resistance, they're either Saddam loyalists who want to reinstall a brutal, Nazi-esque dictatorship or they are Shiites under al Saddar, who's an Iranian butt-puppet. Now I think we should draw down our forces to a handfull of SF and infantry and stage them out in the desert to train the Iraqi Army, but every day that we kill these guy it's worth while.

    The media has already made up their mind on Iraq, so any aditional facts that contradict their view of "Iraq is Lost"/"Bush is the real terrorist" are ignored.
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  8. #8
    Hot sauce on everything Red's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post
    The DoD has also prosecuted and jailed many soldiers who have commited murder in Iraq and put them in prison.
    Some deservedly, some based on propaganda put forth by the enemy and those who are sympathetic to them.

  9. #9
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    If Iraqi civilians are killed and the US is somewhat involved you will hear about it in the news, at least 90% of the time I would guess. On the other hand you have these nut jobs killing Iraqi civilians every single day, all day, it adds up. Ask any Iraqi who their most afraid of, "Cpl. A. A. Devil Dog" or "Alah Mc Crazynut" and I bet you he wont be talking about any Americans. I bet the US has killed at least 10,000-15,000 Iraqi civilians, not counting actual combatants. The death squads, IED's, and suicide bombers have killed much more.

    Anyway, more proof for my theory. If we killed more people we would have less problems. We either leave or get busy killing, these are our two choices.

  10. #10
    Atomic Punk FORD's Avatar
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    10.22.17 @ 08:55 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by willy4pres View Post

    Anyway, more proof for my theory. If we killed more people we would have less problems. We either leave or get busy killing, these are our two choices.
    And the more you kill, the more that rise up to replace them. So leaving is the only thing that makes sense at all.

    It's not a loss either. The military took Saddam out. The case for removing him was questionable at best and had not one damn thing to do with the events of 9-11-01, nevertheless it was successful. So, time to move on. And I don't mean to Iran!

    The PNAC agenda of permanent occupation is what failed. And it deserved to fail. And only Chimpy and the treasonous neocon shitbags deserve the blame for that.
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  11. #11
    Atomic Punk
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    Anyway, more proof for my theory. If we killed more people we would have less problems. We either leave or get busy killing, these are our two choices.
    Yep.

    One of the reasons that we didn't have problems in Germany and Japan was that we (the Allies) killed huge segments of their population through round-the-clock bombing.

    One of the unexpected problems of precision weapons is that they don't kill a lot of people, so in an invasion like Iraq, you'd actually need a larger ground force to secure the country. All through the invasion, the people of Baghdad were able to go about their dailey lives, unless we knocked out a bridge or something. Yes, every once in a while a bomb sails long but that's rare.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post
    Yep.

    One of the reasons that we didn't have problems in Germany and Japan was that we (the Allies) killed huge segments of their population through round-the-clock bombing.

    One of the unexpected problems of precision weapons is that they don't kill a lot of people, so in an invasion like Iraq, you'd actually need a larger ground force to secure the country. All through the invasion, the people of Baghdad were able to go about their dailey lives, unless we knocked out a bridge or something. Yes, every once in a while a bomb sails long but that's rare.
    In Germany and Japan it helped to not have a media presence like there currently is in Iraq.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FORD View Post
    And the more you kill, the more that rise up to replace them. So leaving is the only thing that makes sense at all.

    It's not a loss either. The military took Saddam out. The case for removing him was questionable at best and had not one damn thing to do with the events of 9-11-01, nevertheless it was successful. So, time to move on. And I don't mean to Iran!

    The PNAC agenda of permanent occupation is what failed. And it deserved to fail. And only Chimpy and the treasonous neocon shitbags deserve the blame for that.
    I see you point FORD but I don't believe it's true. History has shown the more you kill the better off you are, and it's the truth as far as i'm concerned. I believe we should kill more people in the Middle East but I know that's not possible in this day and age. So, the only thing to really be done is to become less reliant on them.

    A loss is a loss, I don't believe we have lost anything but the word is we have (and that's really all that matters anymore). If we lost everyone is to blame, you, me, Bush, all service members (living, wounded, or dead), everyone. It's a scary world but it's about to become much more scary (if we pull out and let the nation fall into COMPLETE chaos). We only have our credibility, and I'm not talking about our truthyness either. Our credibility is the fact that we will kill to get what we want, that all might be gone now.
    Last edited by willy4pres; 07.06.07 at 11:06 PM.

  14. #14
    Atomic Punk MikeL's Avatar
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    The thread title bugs me. There's this segment of the population out there that seems to think that "the media" is comprised of evil people taking their direction from our enemies. Those sorts of conspiracy theories are just as nutty as the kind FORD dreams up in his mom's kitchen while he's waiting for mailman to bring his latest we-hate-Bush newsletter.

    Saying "the news" doesn't want me to know about something is silly. They could give a shit about what I know. What they want is my attention, and for me to spend money with their advertisers.

    Iraq is a tar baby. There's no other way to describe it. We picked it up, and we're stuck with it. As a nation, we've been completely schizophrenic in our approach. Should we have gone into Iraq in 2003? Of course not, but we did. There's a huge contingent of asshats out there who think we can just wash our hands of it. Where were they in 2002, when the political waters were being tested to see if the American people would buy into a war? It's too late to bitch and moan now--we're there.

    We've been there for four years, and we're going to have to stay there for another twenty. That's our moral commitment. That's the price we chose to pay in 2003. It's a done deal, and we either hold up our end of it or we suffer some very unpleasant consequences.

    Why is there an insurgency in Iraq, and what fuels it? The answer doesn't have a damn thing to do with whether or not we kill civilians or if anybody else kills civilians. The opposition doesn't form because we kill insurgents and terrorists. The opposition forms because we have a weak will, and it doesn't take a sociology degree to understand why. Many Americans don't believe we've made any sort of commitment to Iraq and Iraqis, and they communicate that message to our enemies loudly and clearly.

    The more civilians that are killed and the more chaos that is created, the more deeply involved our troops become. The more men and women we send, the less happy the fickle American public. If the insurgency can keep the heat on, we'll leave. Their strategy is obvious and so is ours. This is an endurance contest.

    When we show weakness, the enemy gains strength. When we talk about leaving, it only makes our enemies more resolute.

    Democracy and freedom aren't things you can just transplant into a country. They aren't just words in a constitution. They're cultural and personal beliefs. We take them for granted because we've been born into them for generations. Iraq isn't like that. The people don't have traditions built around such concepts. It takes a great deal of time for those values to take root.

    Look at the early 20th century as an example. Countries with nascent freedoms, such as Germany and Russia, were completely willing to throw their freedoms away. The people who made such choices weren't that different than you and I. They just lacked long-standing traditions and appreciations for freedom.

    Iraq isn't going to be any different. Democracy and freedom can't be successfully imposed upon a culture in just a few short years. We either stay long enough to make the ideas stick, or we fail miserably.

  15. #15
    Unchained coyote's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeL View Post
    The thread title bugs me. There's this segment of the population out there that seems to think that "the media" is comprised of evil people taking their direction from our enemies. Those sorts of conspiracy theories are just as nutty as the kind FORD dreams up in his mom's kitchen while he's waiting for mailman to bring his latest we-hate-Bush newsletter.

    Saying "the news" doesn't want me to know about something is silly. They could give a shit about what I know. What they want is my attention, and for me to spend money with their advertisers.

    Iraq is a tar baby. There's no other way to describe it. We picked it up, and we're stuck with it. As a nation, we've been completely schizophrenic in our approach. Should we have gone into Iraq in 2003? Of course not, but we did. There's a huge contingent of asshats out there who think we can just wash our hands of it. Where were they in 2002, when the political waters were being tested to see if the American people would buy into a war? It's too late to bitch and moan now--we're there.

    We've been there for four years, and we're going to have to stay there for another twenty. That's our moral commitment. That's the price we chose to pay in 2003. It's a done deal, and we either hold up our end of it or we suffer some very unpleasant consequences.

    Why is there an insurgency in Iraq, and what fuels it? The answer doesn't have a damn thing to do with whether or not we kill civilians or if anybody else kills civilians. The opposition doesn't form because we kill insurgents and terrorists. The opposition forms because we have a weak will, and it doesn't take a sociology degree to understand why. Many Americans don't believe we've made any sort of commitment to Iraq and Iraqis, and they communicate that message to our enemies loudly and clearly.

    The more civilians that are killed and the more chaos that is created, the more deeply involved our troops become. The more men and women we send, the less happy the fickle American public. If the insurgency can keep the heat on, we'll leave. Their strategy is obvious and so is ours. This is an endurance contest.

    When we show weakness, the enemy gains strength. When we talk about leaving, it only makes our enemies more resolute.

    Democracy and freedom aren't things you can just transplant into a country. They aren't just words in a constitution. They're cultural and personal beliefs. We take them for granted because we've been born into them for generations. Iraq isn't like that. The people don't have traditions built around such concepts. It takes a great deal of time for those values to take root.

    Look at the early 20th century as an example. Countries with nascent freedoms, such as Germany and Russia, were completely willing to throw their freedoms away. The people who made such choices weren't that different than you and I. They just lacked long-standing traditions and appreciations for freedom.

    Iraq isn't going to be any different. Democracy and freedom can't be successfully imposed upon a culture in just a few short years. We either stay long enough to make the ideas stick, or we fail miserably.
    Great post. I just have one issue with it, and that is your final thought. You really cannot impose democracy, any more than the Bolshevik's could impose communism in Russia. Political culture is something that develops and any attempt to thwart that natural evolution of political thought is doomed to fail.

 

 

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