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  1. #1
    Little Dreamer
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    03.02.12 @ 01:47 AM
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    Default Dave's "Curse" with Lead Guitarists

    I was listening to "It's Showtime!" recently, and it made me think of instances where Dave's had bad karma- beyond his control- with the sudden, unexpected and untimely departures of his lead guitarists (Jason Becker, Terry Kilgore, John "5" and EVH), which ultimately affected his career in a negative way.

    1. Jason Becker: Unfortunately, Jason was stricken with ALS in 1991, so he couldn't tour with Dave. Had he been able to tour with Dave, the tour might not have been flushed down the toilet. (Incidently, I never heard a candid 1991 interview with Dave, where he mentions Jason having ALS as the reason that Jason didn't tour with him. Dave actually glossed over it at the time, saying Jason was too young (21) as the reason he couldn't tour with him- although he does talk more openly and honestly about it in his 1997autobiography, "Crazy From the Heat".)

    2. Terry Kilgore: Terry didn't tour with Dave in 1994 after recording "Your Filthy Little Mouth." Does anyone know why?

    3. John "5": John bolted for Marilyn Manson in 1998 after completing the DLR Band CD, so again Dave wasn't able to go on tour with his lead guitarist from the studio recordings. There were promo photos of them together, but then suddenly John hedged his bets and left.

    4. EVH: Eddie went into rehab this year, so the tour was postponed. The Rolling Stone photo of the latest reincarnation got many fans excited, but we all know what happened. Hopefully, the key word here is "postponed," as opposed to "cancelled."

    I hesitate to include Steve Vai in this group because it sounds like he and Dave left on good terms. Ironically though, after leaving DLR (after 1988's "Skyscraper" tour), Vai went on to record with Whitesnake in 1989 and then release probably his biggest commercial solo success, "Passion and Warfare" in 1990. Had Dave kept Steve on as guitarist for a few more years, he could've milked that talent from "Passion and Warfare" for his own benefit.

    It's not to say that these misfortunes could've saved Dave's career, because it can't explain away his poor record sales, but they certainly could've helped give his tours a fighting chance to succeed. I guess you just roll with the punches and make the most out of a bad situation.

  2. #2
    Forum Frontman
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    07.04.16 @ 08:03 PM
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    This is like baseball superstition.

    Dave saw success out-of-the-VH-box in the later-80s because his persona and music were still relevant to popular music of the time. The EEAS band was a helluva band, but your average rock music fan wouldn't have known much of a difference. Dave started to mimic himself as of ALAE, and there was little room for him in the 90s cultural shift. Since 1985 most fans have only wanted to see one guitarist standing to Dave's left, and that's EVH. Dave knows that, and that's why he keeps trying things again with VH despite three previous failed attempts.

  3. #3
    Master Bluesman Elwood P.'s Avatar
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    12.17.17 @ 07:28 AM
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    Quote Originally Posted by powerfuryglory View Post
    3. John "5": John bolted for Marilyn Manson in 1998 after completing the DLR Band CD, so again Dave wasn't able to go on tour with his lead guitarist from the studio recordings. There were promo photos of them together, but then suddenly John hedged his bets and left.

    I think he bolted for Rob Halford's Two first. Then he joined MM.

    Anyway, don't forget Bart Walsh. Good guitarist, really.
    "I'm the opposite of Bill Cosby. Diamond Dave always gets your approval." (DLR)

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  4. #4
    Good Enough vhrocker's Avatar
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    01.21.15 @ 08:57 AM
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    Bart Walsh was damn good.
    ALEX IS GOD!!!

    I've been doin' this for 'bout 20 years now, and I'll tell ya, to this day I still don't know the right drumstick from the left drumstick -Alex Van Halen


  5. #5
    Little Dreamer VanHalenIV2008's Avatar
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    11.30.07 @ 04:12 PM
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AndrewThomas.net View Post
    Since 1985 most fans have only wanted to see one guitarist standing to Dave's left, and that's EVH. Dave knows that, and that's why he keeps trying things again with VH despite three previous failed attempts.
    Is the 1985 breakup considered a failed attempt? I know it may or may not be a stupid question.

  6. #6
    Atomic Punk Raldo's Avatar
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    12.17.17 @ 03:32 AM
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    Default

    Interesting theory.

    I enjoyed the ALAE tour. I remember they had Cinderella and Extreme opening for him.
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  7. #7
    Forum Frontman
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raldo View Post
    Interesting theory.

    I enjoyed the ALAE tour. I remember they had Cinderella and Extreme opening for him.
    Gary said Dave was really cool to them on that tour. Then when Gary was annouced as VH's new singer in 1996, when asked Dave said: "I always thought 'Extreme' was short for 'extremely boring.'"

  8. #8
    Hang 'Em High Blind Lemon Loons's Avatar
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    12.03.17 @ 07:20 AM
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    Donor

    Quote Originally Posted by powerfuryglory View Post
    I was listening to "It's Showtime!" recently, and it made me think of instances where Dave's had bad karma- beyond his control- with the sudden, unexpected and untimely departures of his lead guitarists (Jason Becker, Terry Kilgore, John "5" and EVH), which ultimately affected his career in a negative way.

    1. Jason Becker: Unfortunately, Jason was stricken with ALS in 1991, so he couldn't tour with Dave. Had he been able to tour with Dave, the tour might not have been flushed down the toilet. (Incidently, I never heard a candid 1991 interview with Dave, where he mentions Jason having ALS as the reason that Jason didn't tour with him. Dave actually glossed over it at the time, saying Jason was too young (21) as the reason he couldn't tour with him- although he does talk more openly and honestly about it in his 1997autobiography, "Crazy From the Heat".)

    2. Terry Kilgore: Terry didn't tour with Dave in 1994 after recording "Your Filthy Little Mouth." Does anyone know why?

    3. John "5": John bolted for Marilyn Manson in 1998 after completing the DLR Band CD, so again Dave wasn't able to go on tour with his lead guitarist from the studio recordings. There were promo photos of them together, but then suddenly John hedged his bets and left.

    4. EVH: Eddie went into rehab this year, so the tour was postponed. The Rolling Stone photo of the latest reincarnation got many fans excited, but we all know what happened. Hopefully, the key word here is "postponed," as opposed to "cancelled."

    I hesitate to include Steve Vai in this group because it sounds like he and Dave left on good terms. Ironically though, after leaving DLR (after 1988's "Skyscraper" tour), Vai went on to record with Whitesnake in 1989 and then release probably his biggest commercial solo success, "Passion and Warfare" in 1990. Had Dave kept Steve on as guitarist for a few more years, he could've milked that talent from "Passion and Warfare" for his own benefit.

    It's not to say that these misfortunes could've saved Dave's career, because it can't explain away his poor record sales, but they certainly could've helped give his tours a fighting chance to succeed. I guess you just roll with the punches and make the most out of a bad situation.
    Terry Kilgore did tour with Roth in '94, but not the whole tour. Rocket Richot(sp?) from Black Oak Arkansas completed the tour I belieb.

    You forgot about Michael Hartmann from the DLR Band cd who died.

    And 'mighty' Joe Holmes(who I've heard later toured with Ozzy) who toured with Roth in '91...I don't think they parted on good terms...

    I guess you just roll with the punches...and get the war trio...

    If Jason Becker never got Lou Gehrig's disease...Papa Roth could have worked with quite a string of axe-slingers...Eddie Van Halen(1974-85)...Screamin' Stevie Vai(Jack Butler from Memphis)(1986-1988)...and Jason Becker(1989-Present)...

    I'd like to hear Diamond Dave record with Eric Sardinas...that would be the most to say the least...yez yezz...
    ASHES TO ASHES...DUST TO DUST...IF THE WOMEN DON'T GET YA, THE WHISKEY MUST!!...

    "I used to play the blues alone in all the local joints," he explained. 'The only thing that I can really play on guitar to this day is the blues. I heard Doc Watson and his son playing 15 years ago, and from there I got into Leadbelly and John Lee Hooker."--DLR

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  9. #9
    Atomic Punk Bad to the Bone's Avatar
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    12.17.17 @ 04:09 AM
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Blind Lemon Loons View Post
    Terry Kilgore did tour with Roth in '94, but not the whole tour. Rocket Richot(sp?) from Black Oak Arkansas completed the tour I belieb.

    You forgot about Michael Hartmann from the DLR Band cd who died.

    And 'mighty' Joe Holmes(who I've heard later toured with Ozzy) who toured with Roth in '91...I don't think they parted on good terms...

    I guess you just roll with the punches...and get the war trio...

    If Jason Becker never got Lou Gehrig's disease...Papa Roth could have worked with quite a string of axe-slingers...Eddie Van Halen(1974-85)...Screamin' Stevie Vai(Jack Butler from Memphis)(1986-1988)...and Jason Becker(1989-Present)...

    I'd like to hear Diamond Dave record with Eric Sardinas...that would be the most to say the least...yez yezz...
    I think Harman died a few years after working with Dave didn't he? I know he had CF-terrible disease and he was in his 20's which is pretty damn old for a CF person.

  10. #10
    Forum Frontman It's Mike's Avatar
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    12.17.17 @ 09:55 AM
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Blind Lemon Loons View Post
    Terry Kilgore did tour with Roth in '94, but not the whole tour. Rocket Richot(sp?) from Black Oak Arkansas completed the tour I belieb.

    .
    In Toronto it was Rocket Richot (i guess that was his name - when Dave introduced him I thought he said Rocket Richard). I was wondering why an ex hockey player was touring with Dave. It was at that show that I knew it was over for Dave. The crowd was horrible, maybe 6000 in a 12000 seat venue. And the first words out of Dave's mouth were "this is the best crowd we've had all tour".

  11. #11
    Good Enough Nickdfresh's Avatar
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    11.27.17 @ 11:27 PM
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    Default

    Yes yes. Dave's guitarists are like Spinal Tap's drummers. They all have "gardening accidents" of one sort or another...

    But, I'm curious, I've read speculation that Dave and Randy Rhodes had hit it off and there was a possibility that they'd of recorded after Dave left Van Halen, and had Randy not had a bad aerial gardening accident of his own?

    Qui?
    Originally posted by Katydid

    Because I realize you all (the Roth Army) are a bunch of twisted, demented, beastility, porn loving, drug addicts and alcoholics and psycopaths. I guess Devil worshippers more aptly describe you.

  12. #12
    Atomic Punk Van Squalen's Avatar
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    12.17.17 @ 11:41 AM
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post

    But, I'm curious, I've read speculation that Dave and Randy Rhodes had hit it off and there was a possibility that they'd of recorded after Dave left Van Halen, and had Randy not had a bad aerial gardening accident of his own?

    Qui?
    Never happened. But Dave wanted it to. What solo artist didn't, back then?

  13. #13
    Atomic Punk FORD's Avatar
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    10.22.17 @ 08:55 PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by Van Squalen View Post
    Never happened. But Dave wanted it to. What solo artist didn't, back then?
    Dave wasn't a solo artist in 1982, so I doubt he was thinking of anything other than the next Van HALEN album. Though I'm sure he was familiar with Randy's work back to the Quiet Riot days, since they played the same clubs Van HALEN did.

    If there was such a thing as a Star Trek style parallel universe, maybe in that universe Dave & Randy would have formed a band ("Quiet Mammoth"??) and it would be an interesting study in what makes one band greater than another.
    Eat Us And Smile

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  14. #14
    Atomic Punk Dave's Dreidel's Avatar
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    12.17.17 @ 11:43 AM
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    Quote Originally Posted by FORD View Post
    Dave wasn't a solo artist in 1982, so I doubt he was thinking of anything other than the next Van HALEN album. Though I'm sure he was familiar with Randy's work back to the Quiet Riot days, since they played the same clubs Van HALEN did.

    If there was such a thing as a Star Trek style parallel universe, maybe in that universe Dave & Randy would have formed a band ("Quiet Mammoth"??) and it would be an interesting study in what makes one band greater than another.
    Yeah, but which one would have the goatee?
    Taylor Swift is nice to look at. Adele can sing.

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  15. #15
    Atomic Punk Van Squalen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FORD View Post
    Dave wasn't a solo artist in 1982, so I doubt he was thinking of anything other than the next Van HALEN album. Though I'm sure he was familiar with Randy's work back to the Quiet Riot days, since they played the same clubs Van HALEN did.
    Getting brain farts in my old age, I guess. For some reason I'd recalled the plane crash as occuring in '85, not '82.

    In any case, Roades was a highly respected and coveted axe man. One wonders what he would've accomplished had he stuck around.

 

 

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