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  1. #1
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    Air traffic control has verified that an F-16 fighter jet was in pursuit of the plane the went down near Pittsburgh. While the on-board heroics may or may not be true, it is now known that the military WAS present before the crash.

    Does anyone here have any problem with the idea of the military shooting down a civilian airliner in such a situation? Given the known circumstances, I think it would be the right thing. If they DID shoot it down, then the reports of the cell phone calls may indeed have been fabricated for PR purposes. Regardless, it looks as though our fighter jet DID have SOMETHING to do with the plane's demise, either through a rocket fired or perhaps radio instruction to one of the heroic passengers.

    Anyway, back to the question: how would you all feel if we are to find out that it WAS shot down?
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  2. #2
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    I'm ok with it if all circumstances to it's demise are true. It's better that it happened away from civilization and commerce.
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  3. #3
    Good Enough ScottRoberts's Avatar
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    04.05.12 @ 09:06 AM
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    Donor

    I have no problem with something like this happening. I'm against ANY life perishing, but it's better that the few dozen die in mid-air than possibly several hundred getting killed if it would have hit a building. [img]smilies/frown.gif[/img]

    BTW, this might explain why debris from this crash was found six miles away...
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  4. #4
    Baluchitherium
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AbeVanHalen:

    Does anyone here have any problem with the idea of the military shooting down a civilian airliner in such a situation?
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I have no problem with it considering that more lives were bound to be at stake....I really want to believe that had I been on a plane, knowing that I was going to die, that I'd have done "whatever" to prevent more people from dying....so be it a passenger trying to save more lives, or the military matters little to me.....is one alternative better than the other? I don't think so...the plane didn't hit a target and kill more people [img]smilies/cry.gif[/img] God Bless their souls!!


    ......except the hijackers [img]smilies/mad.gif[/img] Fuck them!!
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  5. #5
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    10.09.12 @ 02:50 PM
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    If it was the first and only plane then there might be a moral dilemma. But it wasn't, so there isn't.
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  6. #6
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    11.04.13 @ 09:31 PM
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    Considering the circumstances, if this is the case (plane being shot down), then i would have to applaud the decision. However, I also am very sad for the loss of innocent lives.

  7. #7
    Damage your reputation seenbad's Avatar
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    11.30.17 @ 06:15 PM
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    Donor

    This has been my gut feeling from the beggining I'm afraid. I knew we shot it down. They called for approval to re-direct to D.C., then all the shit went down. So we KNEW there was one on the way to the capitol when the towers went down. We get it in a remote area so civilians dont witness it....too contraversial to shoot down our own. Personally, I think it was the best thing.
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  8. #8
    On Fire lawchick's Avatar
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    01.24.08 @ 09:30 AM
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    Could this explain why debris was found miles away from the crash site? Regardless, I would like confirmation of this information. If true, then thank God the plane was sacrificed so that thousands of other people wouldn't die. Certainly, those people were headed for their deaths anyway. [img]smilies/frown.gif[/img]

  9. #9
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    02.14.17 @ 07:28 PM
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    Donor

    this whole situation is so utterly devastating.
    you literally have to separate the human factor out of a wartime decision in order to survive.

    look at it this way: if the military was able to shoot down those two planes that destroyed the WTC, about 10,000 lives would be saved at the expense of about 200. not to mention the monetary damage, the effect on the lives of 3 million NYers, etc.

    how horrifying this all is.

    life will never be the same.

    every time i close my eyes i see the second plane hit the tower. i was stuck on a train in the middle of the manhattan bridge less than a mile away. STUCK THERE, like a sitting duck. i'll never forget it.

    these bastards must be completely wiped out - and those who may follow them, too.
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  10. #10
    Emperor of VHLinks.com Brett's Avatar
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    12.11.17 @ 01:34 AM
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    Abe, do you have a link to a story where that was reported?
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  11. #11
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    10.09.12 @ 02:50 PM
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    I believe the story of passengers overcoming the hijackers is probably correct. The cell phone calls certainly weren't made up as I know of one from non-media sources. I haven't seen this particular story, but the Christian Science Monitor reported that F15s were scrambled to chase the planes heading for the WTC - obviously they didn't get there in time, it's not even clear if they got off the ground.
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  12. #12
    Emperor of VHLinks.com Brett's Avatar
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    12.11.17 @ 01:34 AM
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    The only thing I remember hearing was that some passenger on that doomed plane called his family and then said he saw some smoke coming from the wings. But that was a few days ago, and I haven't heard a word about that since.
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  13. #13
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Brett:
    Abe, do you have a link to a story where that was reported?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    No, the story was on the radio early this morning; I don't know of anywhere online to find it. I am not sure which air traffic control station (most likely Pittsburgh International or a smaller nearby airport was the source of the info, but it wasn't mentioned)

    There WERE a small number of eyewitnesses with VAGUE details based on visual evidence, but the actual news came from an air traffic control station which was not identified. Obviously, the pilot (assuming that there WAS said F-16 on the spot) has not been debriefed, or it was a clasified mission.

    There is also the possibility that the F-16 was only tailing the airliner, but watched it go down on its own. However, there is some evidence that agrees with the shoot-down theory:

    1) A large airliner WANTS to fly; they are designed to maintain or regain flight due to their shape. It is virtually impossible to nose-dive an airliner from high altitude into the ground; however, a stall-out CAN be caused by flying UPWARD to the point of complete stall. It would take an INTENTIONAL act of crashing to cause that type of crash, and a pilot would had to have been in control. If a hijacker was at the controls, why wouldn't they continue on target? And why, if the REGULAR pilot took control, would he opt for suicide? If he had control again, he would have been more apt to try and at least land it gently.

    2) There was an explosion of some sort reported before the plane descended.

    3) Some of the material from the plane was found 6-8 miles away. In the most recent crash in PGH, Flight 427, where the plane went down of its own accord, leaving a crater and mostly nothing else of size behind, the debris did NOT scatter nearly that far.


    Again, it's still all theory, but there was an EXPLICIT report on the radio that air traffic control specified an F-16 was tailing the airliner, and IMMEDIATELY headed away when the plane went down. It's still possible that the on-board heroics occurred, but it's up to the gov't/military to tell us what they choose.

    Sorry there's nowhere that I know of to link to. If I hear any more, I'll certainly post it either way.
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  14. #14
    Super Duper Frontman YankeeRose's Avatar
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    12.08.17 @ 01:39 PM
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    I think that there is a good chance that it was shot down, i've suspected that it was.

    I hope if it was, the U.S. Air Force will admit to it.
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  15. #15
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    08.17.07 @ 05:09 PM
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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AbeVanHalen:

    1) A large airliner WANTS to fly; they are designed to maintain or regain flight due to their shape. It is virtually impossible to nose-dive an airliner from high altitude into the ground; however, a stall-out CAN be caused by flying UPWARD to the point of complete stall. It would take an INTENTIONAL act of crashing to cause that type of crash, and a pilot would had to have been in control. If a hijacker was at the controls, why wouldn't they continue on target? And why, if the REGULAR pilot took control, would he opt for suicide? If he had control again, he would have been more apt to try and at least land it gently.
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    There are exceptions to everything though. Remember the plane crash in Roselawn Indiana about six years ago on Halloween? That plane was flying just fine, and went into a steep dive and crashed, spreading debris for miles. That plane was flying on course, and suddenly went out of control in a spinning dive. It crashed.

    As far as the pilot opting for a safe landing, I agree. But what if he believed that there was a bomb on board and believed that he and all the souls on his plane were going to die no matter what, and to spare lives...

    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AbeVanHalen:

    3) Some of the material from the plane was found 6-8 miles away. In the most recent crash in PGH, Flight 427, where the plane went down of its own accord, leaving a crater and mostly nothing else of size behind, the debris did NOT scatter nearly that far.
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    BUT! What if there had been a bomb aboard and it was detonated when the passengers tried to deviate the path of the plane?


    Not saying you're wrong Abe, just playing the devil's advocate. I heard speculation that they plane might have been shot down...but the official report was that though the planes scrambled, they never got off the ground in time. You know how it's been though...somebody hears something, someone else repeats it, then another states it's fact, and only later after the frenzy is over, do we hear the truth...

    If indeed it were shot down, I'd support it. Even if I had a loved one on that plane, or it was me. To spare the lives of many more, I'd be willing to sacrifice mine.
    "May you die at age 128, in bed, shot to death by a jealous lover" DLR 2002

 

 

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