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  1. #1
    Good Enough THE MARD's Avatar
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    01.28.16 @ 03:05 AM
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    This thread was inspired by a post where someone said that Alex could be driving a forklift at Home Depot. I asked what's wrong with that? A couple folks said they worked there and it was harder than it looks and the pay sucked.

    I drove a forklift for 10 years. Right outta high school. A dirty-ass old warehouse, with bad equipment, bad pay, bad benefits, no retirement. 10 years wasted and my back STILL hurts!

    I finally woke up and switched jobs. Wasn't easy to do. I had a wife and a baby, house note, car note, bills...No guarentee I'd make it at my new job. Smartest thing I ever did.

    I now make an honorable wage, great health benefits for me and my family (NO CO-PAY). I have 3 kids now, and I swear I don't know how anyone can afford to live without health care. We receive days off w/pay if you're sick, personal holidays off w/pay, birthday off w/pay, all national holidays w/pay, up to 5 weeks vacation, 401k, and a REAL PENSION that with 30 years of service you're guarenteed $3000.00 a month retirement for the rest of your life.

    But more than anything we have a CONTRACT with rights and guarentees that we, as employees, are intitled to.

    To many, it seems wrong. Like we are stealing from the company. Anybody happen to see what the top CEO's are making these days?

    Home Depot makes more profits than almost any other corporation. I think they were #5 on the Forbes Fortune 500. They surely can afford to share the wealth.

    I sugested to the folks at the other thread to organize. They won't. Too hard. Too afraid.

    You should read up on Jimmy Hoffa or Walter Reuther. See what those guys went thru, just so ALL working people have rights.

    To those who hate their jobs, I say this. DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. Yes, it is hard, and yes its frightning, but if you don't, things will never change. Get organized. United We Stand!

    Go ahead. What do have to lose but a crappy job anyway. Doesn't have to be! www.teamster.org

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  2. #2
    Baluchitherium
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    Well, this is a totally different situation, but here goes:

    I have a child with special needs and have had to bust my ass to make sure the services
    he gets can be delivered.
    Now, the law gets really technical so you have to watch what you ask for (you have to write things in a way that the schools can't manipulate).
    The teachers have a different union than the paraprofessionals do, so if there are problems, it's very hard to get resolved.
    As a matter of fact, last January, my sons teacher enlightened me as to what was not happening that was supposed to be happening.
    Being the advocate that I am, I proceeded to ask for another para for my son, they had
    a meeting (I wasn't invited ) and the resolution was that the para got to stay and have the glorified position of babysitting my son, which to me is a complete waste of my sons time-no educational benefit there
    I guess, when you're in a union, there is a slim to nil chance that you'll lose your job
    Anyhoo, just my two cents, I worked harder/smarter this year and things are going well

  3. #3
    Atomic Punk MikeL's Avatar
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    03.03.15 @ 08:31 PM
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    Donor

    Now, I know unions benefit a lot of people. But in my experience they protect the weak, old, and lazy at the expense of those with talent and ambition.

    I've got a more favorable opinion of unions and guilds for highly trained groups of workers, and a much less favorable opinion on unions for unskilled labor.

    Angel4U, I work for a school district. At times, the teachers care more about their union contract than they do about their students. That's reprehensible. I'm not talking about things that should be major issues, like pay and class size. I'm talking about little things. Last year teachers at one of our elementaries called in a union rep because the school's principle wanted them outside after school to help supervise the loading of the buses. A little girl at a nearby town had gotten run over by a bus a few days previous to this, due to poor supervision. Parents needed the reassurance that the extra bodies outside would provide. The teachers refused to do it. Now, their contract states that during the half-hour after school is dismissed they're to do activiities as directed by the school's principal. Their beef was that this activity took place outside of the school....

    Maybe I've got a dim view of unions because of crap like that?

  4. #4
    Eruption
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    07.10.17 @ 09:12 PM
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    Well I teach school and it sickens me to listen to some of you people's crap. I teach in Texas we can't have a union. We are only considered state employees when the state deems it fit. We aren't given the benefits that all other state employees are given (insurance,etc.)
    Teachers are not at fault with most instances. It is the parent's. Teachers are there to teach not raise your children. Too many kids get into trouble in their later teen years and people blame teachers. Why can't parents accept the responsibility of raising their kids? My hands are tied when a 15 year old is off drinking, smoking pot, or breaking laws afterschool.

    I teach high school special education so I assume Angel your child is special ed.. If I am wrong I apologize. If in fact your child is special ed., you hold all the cards. Special ed. is federal. There are no state unions that dictate policy with special ed.. You are suppose to get 3 notices sent to you detailing an upcoming A.R.D. meeting. If for some reason you disagree with a meeting you can force an A.R.D. committee's hand to have a 10 days waiting period and then reconvene. Anytime you disagree please speak up. I realize that some meetings can be real intimidating with school officials all around. Whether a district wants to or not there are laws they have to follow. Just remember an A.R.D. meeting becomes law when the papers are signed and you have all the power as a parent.

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  5. #5
    Damage your reputation seenbad's Avatar
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    11.30.17 @ 06:15 PM
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    Donor

    I cant BELIEVE there is actually something that MikeL and I agree on!!

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  6. #6
    Eruption
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    MikeL - not always do unions protect the people you've mentioned. A lot of times they protect no one but themselves. The unions today have lost their power. Mainly because they quit caring about the little guy. Now all they are worried about is the all-mighty "buck"! Unions used to be about brotherhood - all for one, one for all. You don't see that anymore. Even their members are that way - in most cases. It's all about "what do they owe me or what can I get". Not "what do we deserve or what did we earn". Great topic.!

    Angel4U - good luck with your situation. I admire you. You are one of the "special" moms.

  7. #7
    On Fire
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    well, i live in georgia and it is a "right to work state" ive been through this union thing."right to work"means that employees(even union employees)can cross the line and work!and its not like it used to be in the north years ago. so most places(if they really wanted to) would keep the employees that agree to work and replace the rest,so to sum it up, if you want to pay dues,and waste time in meetings then the union is for you!

    X-member-U.A.W....united auto workers

    [This message has been edited by nightprowler_01 (edited September 18, 2000 at 11:58 PM).]

  8. #8
    Baluchitherium
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Limecuda:
    Teachers are not at fault with most instances. It is the parent's. Teachers are there to teach not raise your children. Why can't parents accept the responsibility of raising their kids? I teach high school special education so I assume Angel your child is special ed.. If I am wrong I apologize. If in fact your child is special ed., you hold all the cards. Special ed. is federal. There are no state unions that dictate policy with special ed.. You are suppose to get 3 notices sent to you detailing an upcoming A.R.D. meeting. If for some reason you disagree with a meeting you can force an A.R.D. committee's hand to have a 10 days waiting period and then reconvene. Anytime you disagree please speak up. I realize that some meetings can be real intimidating with school officials all around. Whether a district wants to or not there are laws they have to follow. Just remember an A.R.D. meeting becomes law when the papers are signed and you have all the power as a parent.

    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Limecuda,
    Thanks for posting about your situation.
    We have a teacher union and paraprofessional union...they're separate....the problem is...once the para is "in" a position, it's hard to get them out/fire them.
    A para can be an aide on a bus/or in the school...they have no training....unless
    the parent absolutely insists, which I do/did. One para took an hour and a half lunch
    during training and the other fell asleep.
    The teacher knew that I'd pursue things when
    she told me what was going on.....I've been real close to mediation/due process with
    our district.....I got the feeling they don't like me
    Limecuda, not to worry, I do take responsibility of "raising" my kids. I'm
    more responsible for my sp sons education than the school district (40 hrs at home-
    30 at school).
    There are some teachers, who really care,
    who go above and beyond, I think this is where the parents come in. Even with my 'typical' son, I call the teacher when
    certain issues come up. I really think teachers see a parent that really cares, and
    they'll really invest time with your child/
    or bring concerns to you about your child.
    I have no issues with the teachers at this time/it's their helpers, the glorified babysitters, that I usually have a problem with



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  9. #9
    Good Enough THE MARD's Avatar
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    01.28.16 @ 03:05 AM
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    Unions aren't perfect. Far from it. Unfortunately sometimes they do protect lazy and uncaring individuals who usually could give a rats ass about the union that protects them. And there are union leaders who are in it for themselves.

    Like most good ideas, there are those who take advantage of it. One bad apple spoils the bushell.

    There are those like ,nightprowler, who feel that getting involed, attending meetings, and pay dues, are waste of time. "Just give me my money, and benefits, and let me go home." Not taking the time to think of those who sacrificed their lives, who were beaten, shot, run over by corporate thugs, just so people, like him, can enjoy the comforts and security we have today. "Right to Work" states were written by politians who were bought and paid for by big corporations who contribute to their campaigns. Corporations who care ONLY about their bottom line. Funny that in an age when record profits are at an all time high, they still don't want to share the wealth...

    States like Texas where unions are illegal, the first thing is to take rights and benefits from the ones put in charge of educating our youth(probably the most important job there is). Then bitch because childrens test scores are low. Why would anyone want to teach there? Me and my degree are going to work for some oil company...

    For those who think unions are orginized laziness, get a clue. My brothers and sisters and I work very hard. We care about our company. Most of us and the managers get along very well. We do our jobs, they do theirs, and we kick ass.

    I'm sure MikeL would tell you that most of the people who teach at his district are hard working, caring people, who love the children they teach.

    There is no such thing as a perfect institution.

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  10. #10
    Good Enough THE MARD's Avatar
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    01.28.16 @ 03:05 AM
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    nightprowler, you are wrong as wrong can be. The labor laws of which you are refering are almost non-existant. The "right to work" state you live in is a prime example. By stripping unions of their ability to strike makes it next to impossible to ever acomplish anything.

    The pupose of a strike is to force the company to bargain. You hurt, being without pay. They hurt without profit. Forcing both sides to compromise.

    To say we live in a day and time when corporations wouldn't do the things now like they did then is not true. Take a look at the ongoing Detroit Newspaper strike. Gannett and Knight Ridder (the two biggest newspaper giants) who own the Newspapers here, paid the city police to break up the strikers. Paid for the overtime, paid for the riot gear and equipment. Hired Vance security guards (HUGE men!)to dispence the strikers. I know. I was there. I was teargased, peppersprayed, beaten, threatened, ran over...Several of us were hospitalized. A friend of mine was crippled when a guard deliberately opened a big steel door on him and broke his spine. He's in a wheel chair now. The guard laughed when he did it.

    I never thought in this day and age something like this could happen in this country.

    All this, in the name of MORE money.


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  11. #11
    5150 Alchemy's Avatar
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    06.29.12 @ 01:03 AM
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    I don't think that there is anything wrong with unions. Unions are pretty damn good...except when you have to cut them and they make you cry and then that's not good...but the rest of the time they are definately good. I like em fried. Mmmm...fried in delicious batter. Yep...lets all thank your friend and mine...the union. Just like the commertial where the french guy is cutting the union and the guy watching starts to cry...ah the union...such a beautiful thing. *sniff* I used to be so pretty...in Paris...


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  12. #12
    On Fire
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    i took some offense to that,but... ill try not to "offend" on my response.
    as i wrote at the bottom of my last post,i was a member of what is supposed to be one of the bigger unions:U.A.W.(united auto workers... i went through it, i went to meetings,paid dues,etc. even took a lot of shit becausee i voted for the union,the plant was non union when i started... we voted it in,62% was for the union,and it was a continuing argument between us(fellow employees)some BAD arguments.anyway the corp. wanted a revote... still 62% so we went for two years with the commitee trying to negotiate with the business,i left in 98,and they still havent got anything accomplished.
    all of the operators had a problem concerning a disciplinary action to another operator,so most laid out the next day...everything went on as usual,the jobs were covered by supervisors,lead men,overtime,and even people from other departments...the management made their point,and it was said by certain ones that if there was indeed ever a strike it would be COVERED!people who were on strike would be warned and then replaced! so i think i had sufficiant reason to take the stance i took!
    and yes, i know people were beaten,killed,etc.i didnt disrrespect them,that was a different time,things are different now,there are labor laws that werent around then,most big businesses have to have a good reason to dismiss an employee or the labor board will deal with it.and most businesses have otherr places to compete with and so their pay and benefits have to be competitive. so i think that if there is already a governing body to protect you and it seems to me that a union really cant do much in this time we live in, why pay somebody,and do all it takes when ther is really nothing that can be accomplished.

    [This message has been edited by nightprowler_01 (edited September 20, 2000 at 12:22 AM).]

  13. #13
    Atomic Punk MikeL's Avatar
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    03.03.15 @ 08:31 PM
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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by THE MARD:
    I'm sure MikeL would tell you that most of the people who teach at his district are hard working, caring people, who love the children they teach.
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Yes, they have those three qualities on the whole. Many of them are very dedicated individuals. As individuals. For some reason people often stop thinking and lose sight of what's important when put into a large group. It's as though they've put all their trust in their leadership, and feel that they no longer have to think about what they're doing.

    We've had a fine example of that here on the Links, if you know what I mean.

  14. #14
    Hang 'Em High Stuff No More's Avatar
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    01.08.05 @ 11:08 AM
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    I don't think there's anything wrong with the IDEA of unions... it's just like with things like socialism - looks good on paper till you realize it could never work in reality.

    My union experience:

    At my new job we work with computers, testing software the company is about to install across the board. Sometimes that involves working with the hardware. However, the in house union has negotiated it so that if any job requires a tool at the company, we are not allowed to do it, and then must seek out a union person to do it. However, if they screw up, we're held responsible.

    This is just an example of an organization acting without thinking how logical and sensible what it wants is.

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  15. #15
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    oh, they can strike... it just wouldnt do much good here.
    ill give you...if you do not live in a right to work state the union maybe o.k..
    if you do live in a r.t.w.s., then its like i said above...whats the use?you know yourself in this situaion,where they can just say...out with the old,in with the new,weve got enough people to train new help. onother thing that goes along with that,a union cant work unless its 100%,in our situation....62% out of a 100...not a very good number,if when it was voted in everyone became a member i might have a different opinion.that kind of division was bad news because everyone doing so much arguing at work...kindof like a civil war&lt;so to speak...not arguing over issues,it was more like arguing overwhy you joined,more like just simply joining or simply not joining that was what the arguing was about the people that pushed it were on your ass till you joined,then the people that fought it would be on your ass after joining.

    [This message has been edited by nightprowler_01 (edited September 20, 2000 at 11:48 PM).]

 

 

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