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Thread: Hagar over Roth

  1. #1
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    I've been a firm supporter of David Lee Roth getting back with Van Halen since i started listening to the band. I always liked the albums the band did with Hagar but i was more into the hard rock/metal stuff the band did back in the early days (i.e. "Ain't Talkin' Bout Love" , "Mean Street" etc.) I always thought that Roth was much better for the band, a better singer and believe it or not, even a better lyricist. Over the past couple of weeks i've actually started to see that Hagar, as annoying as he is, is probably better for the band musically - at least in a live situation. After watching some live stuff with Hagar, i realized that he did sound really good onstage and actually knew the words to the songs - which helps. Roth sounds bad live and that's all there is to it. His dynamic stage presence is certainly something to speak of but he's normally out of key and off the beat trying to catch up at the last minute by rushing the end of the verse. I know there is absolutely no way in hell Hagar would ever come back but musically, he'd be a better bet at this point in time than Roth...

    But then again, this is all about money anyway so screw what's good for the music and get Roth back to make that paper.

  2. #2
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    12.14.17 @ 06:29 PM
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    I look at it this way - I'm probably only going to get to see one more Van Halen concert anyway, while any CD that I buy will be with me until I'm cremated, so I'd rather have a CD with Roth sounding good (and I doubt Edward would release a CD with Dave sounding otherwise) - hopefully he'd sound good in concert too, but I'm not as worried about that as a lot of the concerts I've been to recently haven't sounded good for some reason or other, so maybe that part of my hearing that works at concerts is going. If it's not Roth, there's no guarantee that I'm buying the CD anyway and I'm probably not going to the concert, so it doesn't matter how good they sound live without Roth.

  3. #3
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    Donor

    I think a lot of people have given up caring how good Dave would sound live because they just want one more chance to catch the spectacle of Van Halen with Dave before it's all over. And I think that attitude is helped along by the fact that Van Halen are old enough that the end is in sight for them anyway, so the idea of only getting one album and one tour out of Dave isn't of any major consequence, because that may be all the band has left regardless.

    I'm critical of Dave's voice, but I'll admit that having missed the DLR era of Van Halen the first time around, it's something I would like to have a chance to witness. Having heard bootlegs of that era, and having been to a lot of major concerts since about 1987 (including VH twice), I've never heard the kind of crowd reaction that I've heard on those Dave era VH bootlegs. I guess I'd like to see that spectacle for myself, even though I'm fully aware that you can't recreate 1984 just by playing a song from then.

    I've seen Sammy live with Van Halen and enjoyed it, but I haven't seen the Dave show, and that makes it seem more attractive. My real worry about Dave is the album. Live, they kill you with so much volume that a singer's ability is often overshadowed. But I'm going to have this album forever, and I want it to be worthy of the Van Halen name. And I'd prefer it to be without a million studio tricks to hide things.

  4. #4
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    I agree on most of what Glenn said, specially the last two considerations.
    I don't know whether Eddie sees that the end of his band is closer now than it was three years ago. I read a lot of interviews where he stated that there were more than one side to VH music and that he still had tons of music to let out (well, that's what he said at that time being very enthusiast about Gary) and that he thanked God every night for having lifted the stone that was blocking his creativeness.
    So, in a way, Eddie was trying to set a new musical path for him and the boys.
    Of course, now, for us, as fans, the most important thing is to have some new music, no matter whoever sings, Dave, Sammy, my father...
    Sure as hell we will buy the record!!!
    But I think we have also to take into account Eddie's words at that time.
    Would Dave really fit into Eddie's new musical scheme?
    In my opinion, yes, of course; I'd love to hear the boys together again, letting out a great record, hit all the charts and let the other people know what VH can do!
    I would like to hear some new classics and at the same time some new things we have never listened before.
    But I don't know what Eddie really thinks about this... and maybe this is a point not of a lesser importance.
    Ciao

    [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]

  5. #5
    Atomic Punk Raldo's Avatar
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    12.14.17 @ 10:24 AM
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    I've been a fan of Van Halen since 1982. The one thing I never got to see was a Van Halen show with DLR as the lead singer. I've seen VH w/ Hagar and VH w/ Cherone. I've seen DLR-solo and Hagar-solo. I've even seen Extreme. What would make the cycle complete is to see VH w/DLR. I know Dave doesn't sing perfect live. Believe me, not everyone does. I just want to feel the energy with Al on drums, Mike on bass, Ed on guitar, and Dave providing the vocals. That chemistry is second to none.
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  6. #6
    Romeo Delight
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    One thing too that has to be considered from a VH management standpoint is that as Ed's creativity grows, his output for a mass appeal tune gets smaller...I know most posters here don't care if Ed writes a top 20 tune or not but the label definitely does care...They want at least a couple of good radio tunes. As far as I'm concerned, Ed had free reign over VH3 and there wasn't a single on the whole CD..They tried "Without You" but my opinion on that one is that it was radio-worthy up until it transitions into the chorus...The chorus hook was just a little too melodic. Almost 80's melodic. It didn't match up to the groove the rest of the song had going. Just my opinion...But one thing both Dave and Sammy always brought to VH was the ability to shape some of Ed's creativity into mass appeal. If you let true artists have free reign,,,you'll get Picassos - but the average American still wants something they can relate to, sing along with and shake their asses to. Just look at the simple shit that's dominating the airwaves right now...I don't think the boys need another 7 minute epic song like some of the shit on VH3....What they need is something a little mean with a little attitude...Something like Dead or Alive.

  7. #7
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    i was to young to catch vh with dave so i'm hoping to get that chance soon. the only time i've seen vh live was in 98 with cherone.
    "hello trouble! looking for a place to happen?"<br />dlr-6/23/01

  8. #8
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    Artistically speaking, one MAJOR aspect of being successful (commercially) within any type of art is adherence to FORM. Form (some may say 'formula', so be it) provides a familiar framework within which the artist works. VH3 was a little TOO free; the song structures weren't familiar enough for people to grab onto. There were moments of great potential on 3, but they needed focus. That's where a producer comes in-to help shape the purer 'art' via their craft and STILL allow the artist's ideas to come through.

    With Dave or Sammy in the band, they had more say to begin with, so that kept things better grounded. When Gary was around, Eddie was exploring a little too far outside the framework, coz nobody was there to reign him in. While his creative juices may have been in overdrive, his logical and methodical side was neglected. Hence, a record with little popular appeal. In fact, it went over people's heads. (like it or not, there actually was a GREAT deal of depth on VH3, but it wasn't compatible with most people's schemas of 'forms')

    This is the area that VH needs to focus on-how to get all your ideas in and STILL have them fit into 'songs'. Eddie was a little too wrapped up in his own ego and sense of power since nobody was there to snap him back to reality, and the record suffered badly as a result.

    People have become so entranced with the notion of WHO they will see live, while, as Glenn said, that piece of plastic is gonna last forever. Honestly, if they never toured again I wouldn't be anything but ecstatic: it would be more time for them to spend writing new material! And for that material, I think Sammy is by far better suited to do it justice.
    Don't bark at me...<b>I</b> didn't name ya.

  9. #9
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    12.11.17 @ 03:59 PM
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    Some people are convinced that Dave sings like Alfalfa [img]smilies/rolleyes.gif[/img]
    Eat Us and Smile!

  10. #10
    Atomic Punk hain23x's Avatar
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    12.11.17 @ 03:59 PM
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    and it's kinda funny how an "experimental band" like Radiohead can sell millions of records but when VH "Experiments" it bombs


    ps---"Fire in the Hole" IS NOT EXPERIMENTAL
    Eat Us and Smile!

  11. #11
    Emperor of VHLinks.com Brett's Avatar
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    12.14.17 @ 09:30 PM
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    But "From Afar," "Once," and "Josephina" certainly are for VH!
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  12. #12
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    I agree that it was experimental for Van Halen, but Eddie has always been experimental



    Just listen to 'Eruption'!!
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  13. #13
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    i totally agree darth. ed has always been in to trying new things.
    "hello trouble! looking for a place to happen?"<br />dlr-6/23/01

  14. #14
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    too bad Alex couldn't have been a little more experimental on this one

    At last we will have revenge!

  15. #15
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    10.09.12 @ 02:50 PM
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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Brett:
    But "From Afar," "Once," and "Josephina" certainly are for VH!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    There's a fine line between experimental and crap.
    Delusions of eloquence

 

 

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