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  1. #1
    Top Of The World
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    Nirvana, I see the name everywhere: "they changed the face of rock" "they killed off all those crappy hair bands". Most over-rated band in history. History was manipulated not to remember many greater bands.

    Will the rock world ever wake up and realize that this band had far less substance/talent than any band remotely close to being called "hair metal"? Their music is basic, using simple power chords and shallow vocals that are unbelievably easy to imitate. I've tried it many times myself. "with the lights out, it's less dangerous, here we are now, entertain us..." Compare that to Sebastian Bach, for example, Baz's voice blows Cobain away. Yet Cobain is considered a legend and Bach seen as just some washed up metal singer(he happens to be a year younger than Cobain).

    I also believe that this band is responsable for the the demise of rock and roll. 1991 was a truly amazing year, rock was front and centre on the charts, Extreme's "More Than Words" was lighting things up, Skid Row's album "Slave To The Grind" debuts at number 1 on Billboard, and VH had their their last really big record. Not to mention the countless other metal bands who were on top of the world. Fast forward to 1993/94 and guitar solos are gone from the mainstream and bands that just a few years earlier were flying high, are in the gutter, along with musicianship. [img]graemlins/brickwall.gif[/img]

    "Nevermind", unfortunatly became the benchmark for rock in the nineties, making everyone forget about the albums from more talented bands. The following albums should have shaped rock for years to come:

    "Extreme II: Pornograffitti"(1990) Intricate guitar work, incredible political lyrics, and one of the greatest love songs of all time. ...Money, my personal savior...

    Skid Row "Slave To The Grind" (1991, on the same day as F.U.C.K.)
    Three words: Sebastian Bach's voice

    Tesla "Psychotic Supper" (1991, on the same day as Nevermind, I think) This album is an overlooked gem containing attitude and grit, to the bone. 'What You Give' and 'Song and Emotion', especially are masterpieces of song stucture, playing technique and heartfelt lyrics.
    ...looking for a change in the weather...

    -----------------
    I needed to let off some steam on this one. [img]graemlins/devil.gif[/img]
    Right now, rock n' roll needs a swift kick in the...<br /><br />"Gimme a bottle o' anything... and a glazed donut... to go!"

  2. #2
    Top Of The World
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    07.06.05 @ 06:12 PM
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    Rock is constantly evolving, and comes in many different flavors.

    I agree that Nirvana sucked. Cobaines death propelled their status to legendary, otherwise their shine would have worn off as time wore on (my apologies to Lemmy).

    I miss such bands as Supertramp, Moody Blues, Mike Oldfield, etc. Pure musicianship.

    True, my first love is hard rock, but like I said, rock comes in many different flavors.

    Too bad the most recent flavors have all tasted like shit!
    Buttocks and crotches and nipples with wings, these are a few of my favorite things!

  3. #3
    Good Enough
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    07.27.07 @ 01:06 PM
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    Donor

    I actually felt that Nirvana, Soundgarden, Pearl Jam (for a brief period of time) Alice In Chains, and Tool were about as musically refreshing as it could have gotten back in '91-'93. The entire seen was about as stail as could be when the decade started, unfortunatly it got stail again by '94-'95, just different bands were involved.

    Maybe you don't agree that Nirvana was an important Rock Band, but at least they helped contribute to the utter destruction of bands like this:

    Winger
    Great White
    Bullet Boys
    Warrant
    Enuff Z' Nuff (spell?)
    Def Leppard (to a certain extent)
    Mr. Big
    Cinderella
    Firehouse
    Extreme (sorry)
    Faster Pussycat
    Slaughter
    Britny Fox
    Europe
    Stryper
    Motley Crue
    Poison
    Skid Row
    Steelheart
    Whitesnake
    Danger Danger
    Dangerous Toys
    Dokken
    White Lion

    It could be argued that allot of these bands just had "internal problems" and imploded on there own, but if there band names would have been worth a hill of beans in 1992 they would have survived.

    Now if something could just be done with the horseshit music of today!

  4. #4
    Good Enough Cabo Kid's Avatar
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    08.27.15 @ 02:07 AM
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    Donor

    You know, it's REAL easy in the year 2003 to sit here and slag on "hair metal" because it seems to be the "in thing" to do. I mean, look at how quickly and hypocritical MTV is in their regards to bands and music of that era when in reality, it was this exact music that helped save and define what MTV was to become.

    Somehow, admitting to liking and listening (and STILL listening) to this music makes you a shallow and immature person. Whatever...

    How many of you that are quick to slag these bands actually listened to this music back when it was everywhere? [img]graemlins/irked.gif[/img]

    I'm not saying that it didn't eventually become watered down with the onslaught of power ballads and every Tom, Dick and Harry could fit into a pair of spandex pants and do an Yngwie-style musical shred...but let's enjoy the music for what it was and what it was supposed to be about...

    fun.

    Nirvana and Pearl Jam NEVER had music that was intended to make you feel good about yourself or the world. It was always this "oh poor little me with my flannel shirts and shorts, living here in dark, dismal Seattle with a cup of triple espresso latte, I'm going to die so forlorn".

    Indeed.

    It's mentioned how many of these "hair bands" are still out there and how many of them have fat band members still trying to rock.

    Well, what is the lead singer for the Screaming Trees doing nowadays? What is the bass player for Soul Train occupying himself now? How many times has the guitar player for Soundgarden performed within the past year? Do ANY of these "grungers" still perform and if so, are they doing any better than the 300+ seat clubs the 80's bands are? Pearl Jam, MAYBE...but they sure don't get the exposure they USED to. Funny how MTV has turned their back on them too.

    Layoff the 80's rock. It's the music I grew up with and like it or not, a LOT of it is due to the influence of classic Van Halen.
    "Once the final BAN has been completed I will ban myself." -OLO, March 21, 2002
    "The price of the steak sandwich over there is ridiculous!!" -Glenn, March 3, 2003
    "Hang on, I'll go ask everybody and be right back." -seenbad, March 11, 2003

  5. #5
    Atomic Punk
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    05.31.14 @ 08:17 PM
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    Nobody's a bigger fan of 80's music and I don't own a single Nirvana album but...give me a break.

    Nirvana is a pivital band, they kick started a trend and made the Seattle scene a national phenomina.

    It's wasn't their idea.

    In fact the opposite is true, I think they would have been happy with a few gold records and a couple of west coast tour every few years.Instead, the kids hooked into their music and their sound and the record industry was quick to move and in less than two months every band that hadn't had a bath in six months had a record deal. Chess King was out and the Salvation Army Thrift Store was in. The whole thing is classic textbook marketing, the style was no style at all. The kids ate it right up. Cobain couldn't handle it, it wasn't what he was about. Factor in his personal demons and you could see the end coming a mile away. I wasn't suprised that he died but I was suprised that he had the balls to blow his own head off. It's sad, especially since he seemed to be a genuinely nice guy. In the end, Nirvana fans loved their band to death.

    I'm not a Nirvana fan, never will be, but I acknowledge their RIGHTFUL place in rock history. I also tip my hat to Cobain, they guy had a vision of a band and a type of rock music and he was blessed enough to put it all together and catch lightning in a bottle. I hope he's found peace.
    "Nothing is ever what it seems but everything is exactly what it is." - B. Banzai


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  6. #6
    Super Duper Frontman track 5's Avatar
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    12.03.17 @ 09:00 PM
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    Premium Member
    Originally posted by Cabo Kid:

    Nirvana and Pearl Jam NEVER had music that was intended to make you feel good about yourself or the world. It was always this "oh poor little me with my flannel shirts and shorts, living here in dark, dismal Seattle with a cup of triple espresso latte, I'm going to die so forlorn".


    Way too funny, dude. [img]graemlins/thumb.gif[/img] Out.
    Quin-a-se-i-co

    You're a dick for putting ian on "ignore" DIF

    "You stupid fuck!" Seen

    "Well if you saw it, stats and scientific studies be damned!" Lovemachine 97 v. 2.

  7. #7
    Atomic Punk Little Dreamer's Avatar
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    12.14.17 @ 01:39 PM
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    Uh?
    This post is very strange.
    [img]graemlins/wtf.gif[/img]

    Just compare the music.

    Soundgarden's "Jesus Christ Pose" compared to Poison's "Unskinny Bop"

    Pearl Jam's "Even Flow" compared to Slaughter's "Up All Night"

    Alice In Chain's "Would?" compared to Bon Jovi's "bad Medicine"

    Nirvana's "On A Plane" or "In Bloom" compared to Whitesnake's "Is this Love?"

    Which is true rock, intended like it should be played, and which is a bunch of hairdressers with guitars? These bands were called pop metal, but they were trully more pop than metal. Having long hair doesn't automatically mean you rock, in the truest acception of that term.
    And the lyrics were awful, come on. "Unskinny bop"? Even Britney Spears sings better lyrics.

    VH gave a clear message: they chose Alice In Chains as their opening act, indicating who were the true heirs to hard rock, and who were the impostors.
    Little Dreamer

  8. #8
    Eruption valdez44's Avatar
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    12.14.12 @ 08:13 PM
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    Shit...I'll admit it, I don't give a fuck what anyone thinks about it! Skid Row's slave to the grind was and still is a killer album. When the Crue came out they fuckin' rocked. I'm glad someone mentioned it in here...that Tesla was way under-rated and they flat out rocked. Hell, I even have a few Stryper CD's....and you know what? Them frickin' holy rollers can rock the shit outta any Sum 41, Linkin' Park bullshit that is out there today!!! A lot of them "hair Bands" put out a lot of good music that still sounds good to me today!!! And yes...as someone said these bands made MTV!!! And then of course, we all know what MTV fucked them all over in return. Bottom line....I want my 80's music and thanks to the internet, I've got it!! [img]graemlins/thumb.gif[/img]
    If you shake my hand better count your fingers - Mustaine

  9. #9
    Hot For Teacher
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    02.27.07 @ 04:58 AM
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    Originally posted by willy4pres:
    I actually felt that Nirvana, Soundgarden, Pearl Jam (for a brief period of time) Alice In Chains, and Tool were about as musically refreshing as it could have gotten back in '91-'93. The entire seen was about as stail as could be when the decade started, unfortunatly it got stail again by '94-'95, just different bands were involved.

    Maybe you don't agree that Nirvana was an important Rock Band, but at least they helped contribute to the utter destruction of bands like this:

    Winger
    Great White
    Bullet Boys
    Warrant
    Enuff Z' Nuff (spell?)
    Def Leppard (to a certain extent)
    Mr. Big
    Cinderella
    Firehouse
    Extreme (sorry)
    Faster Pussycat
    Slaughter
    Britny Fox
    Europe
    Stryper
    Motley Crue
    Poison
    Skid Row
    Steelheart
    Whitesnake
    Danger Danger
    Dangerous Toys
    Dokken
    White Lion

    It could be argued that allot of these bands just had "internal problems" and imploded on there own, but if there band names would have been worth a hill of beans in 1992 they would have survived.

    Now if something could just be done with the horseshit music of today!
    Even if Nirvana's time in the spotlight (thankfully short) was responsible for the demise of these bands - and that is nonsense, then that is even more reason to hate Cobain.....he was like a black hole in music.

  10. #10
    Banned!
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    07.15.07 @ 05:40 AM
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    Originally posted by Little Dreamer:
    Even Britney Spears sings better lyrics.
    And she's nicer to look at than Bret Michaels.

  11. #11
    Romeo Delight
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    Wait another 10-12 years and hair metal will make its comeback. Trends come and go and then come back again. Good music lasts forever.

  12. #12
    Good Enough ScottRoberts's Avatar
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    04.05.12 @ 09:06 AM
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    Donor

    Great first post, 5150guy. I agree with you on most things, but...

    I happen to think that the superfluous "hair metal" groups (Warrant, Poison, Slaughter, Winger, etc.) of the late '80s were already on their way out in 1991. If you have any old rock magazines like Hit Parader or Circus from that time, go back and take a look at them. You'll read more than one article that mentioned record and ticket sales were drastically decreasing for some of these bands and how the artists tried to blame it on the Gulf War-era's "bad economy".

    Meanwhile, Extreme, Skid Row, VH, G N'R, Queensryche, and Metallica all had fantastic record sales and most of 'em were producing kick ass music. Heavy music certainly was doing good in the industry, and the supposed bad economy wasn't effecting them. I just think fans were becoming "smarter" and weren't purchasing as much product from the unoriginal copycat pop metal bands. IMO "hair metal" was being weeded out naturally.

    But Nirvana and company became popular, and just about all good hard rock and metal was quickly destroyed. [img]graemlins/irked.gif[/img]
    Scott Roberts
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  13. #13
    Sinner's Swing! Mario VH's Avatar
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    07.09.17 @ 06:30 PM
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    It's obvious that the whole Seatlle scene drove a stake in the hearts of most 80's acts. The few that survived like Van Halen, Aerosmith and Metallica were established acts who had a huge catalog of music behind them and a very loyal fan base.
    As with all eras of music the 80's did have their fair share of crappy bands but let's not dump on everyone. I honestly never understood the appeal of bands like Nirvana and why the Seatlle scene was so revered. How does dark depressing lyrics, 3 chord grunge and heroin over doses appeal to the masses?
    Anyways I'll gladly take a slice of Cherry Pie over the mostly shit ridden concoction that was the Seatlle music scene. Jani at least never mumbled into his microphone.
    "It's now officially 5150 time!!!"

  14. #14
    Top Of The World
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    12.31.69 @ 04:00 PM
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    Just to set things straight, I'm not trying to say that Poison is great. My main point is that a lot of bands who were better than that got the shaft. Extreme, Skid Row, Tesla and Mr. Big were the ones I think got it bigtime. They were never glam and didn't do songs like 'Unskinny Bop'(which is good in its own right), but they still got unfairly lumped in with that crowd and all the flack associated with it.

  15. #15
    Good Enough
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    07.27.07 @ 01:06 PM
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    Donor

    Well, for starters, im 30, so I did actually listen to every band I listed. I bought Poison's first album when it came out (don't tell anyone though ) I think I had Def Leppards Hysteria (and Pyromania, but who didn't), well that's about it. Van Halen, Iron Maiden and some 70's bands were the only thing worth listening to, to me, that's just how I felt.

    When Nirvanna, AIC, and Soundgarden came out they just seemed to be singing song's that were more "important" to me at that age, song's like Cherry Pie and stuff didn't seem real to me, but song's like Sea Of Sorrow and Outshined did. That's really all I needed at the time, something that I could relate to, and according to record sales at the time allot of people felt the same way. To allot of us it was a special time in music, for a very brief period of time it was music with a message and grounded in reality, vice listening to what we felt was a "Rock Stars" point of view of what life is really like. They were the one's that were dating hot ass models and having huge parties that cops wouldn't break up, not us.

    When Nirvana came out all the other "popular" rock bands suddenly looked very silly, me and my friends dressed like "normal" teenagers, we didn't have frizzed out hair and spandex pants, We wore T-Shirts and blue jeans.

    Im not trying to slag on those bands from the 80's, they had a purpose and they served it. Hell, if anything they were around longer and more successful then almost every band that came out in the early 90's, that accounts for something. They did give there fans what they wanted for a much longer period of time.

    Having said all this, I do agree that Skid Row's album "Slave To The Grind" is a very underated album, like Faith No More's "Angel Dust" is. And Tesla was unfairly grouped into that whole "Hair Metal" category, they were very much above all that.

 

 

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