INDIANAPOLIS (AP) -- Peyton Manning's phenomenal season earned him his second straight Associated Press NFL Most Valuable Player Award. He was nearly a unanimous choice.

The Indianapolis Colts' star quarterback, who surpassed Dan Marino and Steve Young with his passing prowess in 2004, earned all but one of 48 votes from a national panel of sports writers and broadcasters who cover pro football. Manning tied with Steve McNair for the award last season, but this time only Atlanta quarterback Michael Vick drew a vote.

Manning joined the likes of Joe Montana, John Unitas, Steve Young and Kurt Warner as quarterbacks with two MVP awards. Brett Favre is the only player to win it three times.

``Individually, I accomplished a lot in a short period of time,'' Manning said. ``But no question, we did not win a Super Bowl in the time I've been here as a quarterback.''

Ever the team man, and ever championship-oriented, Manning refuses to concentrate on his statistics. He might have thrown for 49 touchdowns, surpassing Dan Marino's 20-year-old NFL record. And he may have shattered Young's passer rating record with a 121.1 mark. And he might have established other league marks and a bunch more team records.

But to Manning, unless it all culminates in a championship, it's not what he's after.

``Just because you played well in Week 2 or Week 10 doesn't mean anything for the playoffs,'' Manning said. ``Except that you're capable of doing it.''

Manning was capable of doing almost anything in leading the Colts to a 12-4 record and the AFC South title. They routed Denver 49-24 in the first round of the playoffs -- the MVP voting was held before the postseason -- and play at New England on Sunday.

He also turned two of his previously unaccomplished receivers, Reggie Wayne and Brandon Stokley, into threats almost on a par with Manning's favorite target, perennial Pro Bowler Marvin Harrison. All caught at least 10 touchdown passes and went over 1,000 yards in receiving -- an unprecedented combination for three teammates.

``Peyton is such a competitor, he has such high expectations to go out and win,'' Wayne said. ``You want to make a play for him and bail him out of tough situations.''

Tough situations? Manning tends to make everything look easy.

Sort of like Young and Montana and Unitas and Warner and Favre did. But all of them have that championship along with their MVPs. Manning doesn't.

And it drives him to do even more.

I can't believe someone actually didn't vote for him...

I can. A certain #5 has had a great year as well.

Indeed. But Manning had the best season for a QB in the history of the game.

Arguably, yes you're right. I won't go there though because you know how I feel about dome QB's. :)

Manning earned it this year over anyone else.

Manning had the best season for a QB in the history of the game.

Agreed. He totally deserved it. Hope he gets a ring.

This was a shock. Saw it on the espn ticker this morning. If the Falcons cant win it. I hope the colts do. So Manning could have one of the best seasons ever for a QB.

Manning can win the MVP every year for all I care - the best postseason QB is Tom Brady.
It's like comparing Marino and Montana - stats are great but I'll take the championships.

Manning can win the MVP every year for all I care - the best postseason QB is Tom Brady.
It's like comparing Marino and Montana - stats are great but I'll take the championships.


AMEN! Well put!

Arguably, yes you're right. I won't go there though because you know how I feel about dome QB's. :)

I think Culpepper proved yesterday without a doubt, that he can play well outside of a dome. And if any other QB other than Manning got a sniff at a MVP vote it should have been Culpepper, not Vick! After Culpepper, then McNabb, not Vick. Vick without his legs is just an average QB. Culpepper and McNabb can beat you either way. Manning is just Manning.

Manning can win the MVP every year for all I care - the best postseason QB is Tom Brady.
It's like comparing Marino and Montana - stats are great but I'll take the championships.

If Manning had New Englands defense backing him up, he would be wearing a couple of rings. He's the best QB out there, period.

I don't believe that to be true. Peyton has not won that big game. McNabb hasn't, nor has Vick, Culp, or McNair. Until they do, they will not convince me that they are better QB's than Tom Brady. That cat rolled off what, 22, 23 games without a loss? Because let's face it, that's what matters. Wins and losses, not stats. That's why the Pats were resting over the weekend, and the Colts had to play. They are a better team, and I think that the better team will win. It'll be tough, but I think they can do it.

Peyton did deserve this though, so I won't even try to take that away for him. He had a spectacular year, no doubt.

I think Culpepper proved yesterday without a doubt, that he can play well outside of a dome. And if any other QB other than Manning got a sniff at a MVP vote it should have been Culpepper, not Vick! After Culpepper, then McNabb, not Vick. Vick without his legs is just an average QB. Culpepper and McNabb can beat you either way. Manning is just Manning.

Vike, the Vikings have lost 22 out of their last 26 games outside of a dome, or some shit like that. I forget that exact stat, but I do know that it's not pretty. One game doesn't proove anything to me that he can play outside. The Packers are a BAD football, team and they showed that yesterday without a doubt. They can not play, and that's why they lost. Even with that though, the Pack still could have won!

Just looked it up, the Vikes only won four games outside a dome this year. All of them being close, with the exception of the Tennessee game which they won 20-3.

I think Culpepper proved yesterday without a doubt, that he can play well outside of a dome. And if any other QB other than Manning got a sniff at a MVP vote it should have been Culpepper, not Vick! You are correct Viking. Culpepper is better than Vick as a Q.B. Manning is the man this year, he did things that are going to be hard to beat. Now he just needs to win a Super Bowl ring to get the critics to shut the fuck up.
Also, Culpepper not only proved he could play outside a dome, but at Lambeau in the cold :irked:

I don't believe that to be true. Peyton has not won that big game. McNabb hasn't, nor has Vick, Culp, or McNair. Until they do, they will not convince me that they are better QB's than Tom Brady. That cat rolled off what, 22, 23 games without a loss? Because let's face it, that's what matters. Wins and losses, not stats. That's why the Pats were resting over the weekend, and the Colts had to play. They are a better team, and I think that the better team will win. It'll be tough, but I think they can do it.

Sucka, I agree and disagree both with you here. I don't want to take anything away from Brady. I think he's a very, very good QB, and he's got some rings... but you know, Trent Dilfer has a ring, too. Why? Because he had a hell of a defense behind him. Now, I don't equate Brady's situation to be exactly like Dilfer's because I think Brady is a damn good QB and much, much better than Dilfer, but there is something you said in the above quote that says alot... "They (the Pats) are a better team."

Now whether that's true this year or not, we're gonna find out this Sunday, but they have been a better team than the Colts for the past few years. That doesn't make Brady a better QB. Let's face it, Brady and the Pats kind of fell into each other's laps. Brady was their back up, then Bledsoe gets hurt and they find that Brady was the missing piece to the puzzle, and Brady found himself on probably the most balanced team in the NFL. It was the perfect situation for both Brady and the Pats. They compliment each other. Manning has had to do everything on his own. He has never been able to say "Damn, that's my third INT of the game... but the defense has my back." Hell, this is the first year he's had a defense that wasn't embarrassing. We still give up a lot of yardage, but at least now we're getting to the QB and and causing turnovers. I think we lead the league in both.

It always pisses me off when someone discredits Manning or his accomplishments by saying "He hasn't won the big game." or "He doesn't have a ring." Bullshit. These last two years are the first time we could actually be called a good team. I credit a lot of that to Tony Dungy.

Just to go a little further than Viking did, let me ask anyone reading this a question. Do you think if Brady and Manning switched teams, that Brady could win as many games as a Colt as Manning has? Do you think he could get the Colts to the playoffs with the defense they've had the past few years? And how many rings do you think Manning would have if he was on the Pats for the last 4 years?

Like I said, my intention is not to discredit Brady, because I think he's a top 10 QB, but he's had the pieces to the puzzle (him being the final piece) on his team since he started playing for the Pats. Manning hasn't. But I think that's changed this year.

you know, Trent Dilfer has a ring, too.

:funny:

Sucka, I agree and disagree both with you here. I don't want to take anything away from Brady. I think he's a very, very good QB, and he's got some rings... but you know, Trent Dilfer has a ring, too. Why? Because he had a hell of a defense behind him. Now, I don't equate Brady's situation to be exactly like Dilfer's because I think Brady is a damn good QB and much, much better than Dilfer, but there is something you said in the above quote that says alot... "They (the Pats) are a better team."

Now whether that's true this year or not, we're gonna find out this Sunday, but they have been a better team than the Colts for the past few years. That doesn't make Brady a better QB. Let's face it, Brady and the Pats kind of fell into each other's laps. Brady was their back up, then Bledsoe gets hurt and they find that Brady was the missing piece to the puzzle, and Brady found himself on probably the most balanced team in the NFL. It was the perfect situation for both Brady and the Pats. They compliment each other. Manning has had to do everything on his own. He has never been able to say "Damn, that's my third INT of the game... but the defense has my back." Hell, this is the first year he's had a defense that wasn't embarrassing. We still give up a lot of yardage, but at least now we're getting to the QB and and causing turnovers. I think we lead the league in both.

It always pisses me off when someone discredits Manning or his accomplishments by saying "He hasn't won the big game." or "He doesn't have a ring." Bullshit. These last two years are the first time we could actually be called a good team. I credit a lot of that to Tony Dungy.

Just to go a little further than Viking did, let me ask anyone reading this a question. Do you think if Brady and Manning switched teams, that Brady could win as many games as a Colt as Manning has? Do you think he could get the Colts to the playoffs with the defense they've had the past few years? And how many rings do you think Manning would have if he was on the Pats for the last 4 years?

Like I said, my intention is not to discredit Brady, because I think he's a top 10 QB, but he's had the pieces to the puzzle (him being the final piece) on his team since he started playing for the Pats. Manning hasn't. But I think that's changed this year.


To answer your question, yes I do believe Brady would get the Colts to the playoffs. This guy played on a team that had Troy Brown at WR, and that was basically his only offensive weapon, and he won the damn Super Bowl! He had Antowain Smith at RB, who I was never fond of, and wasn't all that if you asked me. And that was basically his entire offense. He took a bunch of mediocore WR's, no game breaking Tight End, and an average RB and won the Super Bowl. He of course had a great defense, but he still put up points that year, enough points that he got to the big game and won it. Having Adam Vinaterri helped alot of course. I just don't see Manning with no running game, and average wideouts, and leading them to a championship. He hasn't even done that with the talent that he has, but of course he has that chance to do it this year.

I hate to say that the guy hasn't won the big game, because he's had to win big games. Same with McNabb. These guys aren't in the hunt every year without playing in big games. But these two QB's won't get the full credit they deserve until they win a championship.

And do you think Manning would have any rings if you put him to the Patriots?

With that defense, certainly anything is possible. But no I do not. Two different offenses for one, and with no running game until this year, Peyton's play action fake wouldn't be what it is today.

Well, alright then. There's not much more I can say to make my case.

One thing I'll never understand, though, is why people loathe Manning so much. There's always an excuse to discredit his talent. He's a good, gracious and humble guy, too.

Come on Wray, you know I know too much about the game to sit here and discredit Peyton Manning. I've praised the guy for the most part all year. I think he's a great QB, and easily top three or four in the NFL today. But for me personally, when it's playoff time I'll take Tom Brady over any other QB in the NFL. The guy just happens to be undefeated in the playoffs, has a very accurate arm, a decent running game, adequate WR's, and a good young TE. That's a recipe that's worked all year, despite the many injuries the Pats have had over the year. He will never put up Peyton's numbers, but in the clutch he's prooven he can come up big.

By the way, the one other vote that didn't go to Peyton for MVP, went to Mike Vick. Now THAT is a joke.

I didn't necessarily mean you, Sucka. Besides the "Dome" thing, I've never seen you downplay Manning's talent. I was talking generally. There's all kinds of loathing out there towards Manning. It's sickening.

The dome thing is valid though. :) LOL

I hear you man. I think that's a part of society today ya know. The term "hater" is annoying to me, but it does seem that we have alot of haters in today's world man. People want to hate on the classy guys like Manning, McNabb and Brady, while dipshits like Artest, Moss, and heck even Owens get all the headlines.

By the way, the one other vote that didn't go to Peyton for MVP, went to Mike Vick. Now THAT is a joke.

I agree, Sucka, Don, Ben or Tom deserve that one vote before Vick does. :wtf:

I think it's unfair to say that a great QB isn't the equal of a good QB, because the good QB has won a couple of rings. That just ignores so many aspects of the game that a QB plays no part in. Not just things that happen in the game when he's not on the field, but from a coaching and management perspective. Those have a greater impact on a team's performance than any one player, and it's the team that wins championships, not the the player.

What with the salary cap and all, teams that have a great player are less likely to be able to afford a strong supporting cast, or have to compromise on one side of the ball at the expense of the others. NE isn't an organization that focuses on individuals, they focus on the team. They're ahead of the rest of the league in that philosophy, and recognize that winning can create stars out of individuals that would go unheralded on other teams.

If you want to effectively gauge individual accomplishments, you can't be looking at the performance of the team. That's a difficult task because of how interconnected everything is, but it's a mistake to judge the individual by the performance of their surrounding cast.

But unfortunately that's the way it is Mike. We can sit here and have a discussion about the greatest QB's ever, and I'm sure Marino's name would come up. And immediately followed by, "he never won a championship." It's a bit unfair because football is a team game, but championships are the way that great QBs are judged by. Montona, Staubach, Namath, Elway, Unitas, Favre, and Bradshaw were all great QB's, and they get put up on that higher pedistal because they did win a championship.

I agree with your thoughts on NE being head and shoulders above the rest of the NFL when speaking of the salary cap, but the Eagles are right there as well. These guys have let go of countless players, and not just ordinary players, all-pro players, and have still been in the hunt year to hear. Those two teams are the best in any sport if you ask me when it comes to balancing the cap.

Until the Eagles win a championship, they aren't... :)

I just think equating greatness with individual championships glosses over too many things. It's the easy way, and doesn't dig far enough down into the game. When you say "that's the way it is," that doesn't mean much. If you choose to narrow your pool of great players to only those that have played on championship teams, you exclude players like Marino and Sayers.

It's easy for the talking heads to use championships as a benchmark in their two minute segments, but it's not an effective measure of individual performance. As time goes on it will be even less effective, given the expansion of the league and the long-term effects of the salary cap.

It's not as easy to evaluate individuals on their merits, but it's not fair to evaluate them on the merits of their team.

I agree man, totally. It's not fair at all, but it's seems to be the way it is. When talking of great QBs, people don't take into account the great defenses and special teams that QB may have had in his favor. Also a good running game, quality recievers, and solid offensive line are all major factors. It's ashame that alot of that stuff gets thrown out of the window because it's a major part of what can make a good QB, a great one.

Manning is a stud, pure and simple. And, I think his Colts have a very real chance at beating the Pats this weekend.

Choke...gasp..choke... Manning is a great 16 week QB, but has there ever been anyone who chokes more?? I don't know Marino's college record, but I do know Peyton ALWAYS choked in the big Tennessee-Florida college football games and now they same thing is becoming even more evident in the Indy-New England playoff scenarios. Choke...gasp...choke...